I was referring to the economic impact as well. There is greed involved as well. That is how El Chapo got started with the marijuana business. Sinoloa does not have the beaches of Cancun or Cozumel.

quote:

Originally posted by Sig2340:
If Mexico wants to eliminate the cartels, declare Brazilian street justice and start arming the law abiding and shooting the cartelo members on sight.

Funny thing it, that's already been tried in Mexico. And you know what happened? The law abiding citizen militia/vigilante groups turned into criminal cartels themselves, in short order.

Read up on the autodefensas groups, which began about a decade ago as rural vigilante groups of citizens in Southern Mexico defending their towns from cartel violence, before getting into selling drugs themselves, and using false accusations of cartel involvement as a cover for committing robberies and murders against rivals and against those with which they had personal grudges, before finally coalescing and transforming into new drug cartels themselves and battling against each other for power and territory, thus leaving the area just as violent as it was when these groups were started to "stop the cartel violence".

When you're dealing with that level of poverty and that level of potential money, greed and corruption is basically inevitable. (Especially in a culture where crime and corruption is so deeply ingrained and normalized.) They figure why kill the rich bad guys and then go back to being poor good guys when you can just kill the rich bad guys (eliminating the competition) and become the newer, richer bad guys.

quote:

Originally posted by ZSMICHAEL:
I was referring to the economic impact as well. There is greed involved as well. That is how El Chapo got started with the marijuana business. Sinoloa does not have the beaches of Cancun or Cozumel.

No, just amazing Pacific blue shrimp, fresh fish and holy guacamole, Puerto Vallarta, and amazing weather with beautiful coast lines.

I’ve been a few streets off in Sinaloa, and felt very unwelcome.

Seahawks had won the Super Bowl and that bought me a little grace by wearing a jersey… But it’s not much protection down there. Fuck Mexico.

quote:

Originally posted by SIGnified:
Fuck Mexico.

Yeah, that's my thought as well.

I have a few friends that spend a great deal of time in Baja. One just finished building a house near Los Barriles and another north of Loreto.

I keep telling them, when they claim the problems in Mexico aren't in Baja, "just wait...it's a matter of time".

I've had some some great times in Mexico decades ago, including a few wonderful days in Mazatlan and an untold number of times down Baja, but not anymore. Not a chance I'd enter that failed state.

quote:

When you're dealing with that level of poverty and that level of potential money, greed and corruption is basically inevitable. (Especially in a culture where crime and corruption is so deeply ingrained and normalized.) They figure why kill the rich bad guys and then go back to being poor good guys when you can just kill the rich bad guys (eliminating the competition) and become the newer, richer bad guys.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Exactly

quote:

’ve been a few streets off in Sinaloa, and felt very unwelcome

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
That is what I mean. Not like the interior of Yucatan. Tourism does not support Sinoloa.

quote:

Originally posted by ZSMICHAEL:
Tourism does not support Sinoloa.

Yet.

^^^^^^^^^
You suggesting NARCO tourism where adventure seeking 20 somenthings go to view the latest shootout? LOL

quote:

Originally posted by BBMW:
Or would they become more dependent on the smuggled in drug cash?

Not to mention that all the big US businesses that do business in Mexico will call in favors from the politicians whose campaigns they fund to stop this.

quote:

Originally posted by cobre sig:
Shut off all money transfers to Mexico and they will close their borders within a week. Its possible to shut it off but there really is no desire.

Which is my point, there is no desire. Mexico's economy would collapse in months without family members sending cash.

quote:

Originally posted by 911Boss:
I’ll go one step farther…

It is in Mexico’s interest to have an open border. The human and drug smuggling is the single greatest source of income for the cartels and that income is what corrupts the Mexican government and police officials.

...and I'll go even further, it is not just Mexican politicians and police officials that are on the take.

With an open border, there is zero accountability of who comes in, which includes cartel members setting up shop in the U.S., its biggest customer. CA, Oregon, Washington, Chicago, etc., they have set up operations everywhere in the U.S. And given that they pay off key politicians and officials in Mexico, they are doing the same in the U.S.

Of course Trump has been saying this for years, but is ignored. And some of the politicians speaking the loudest for open borders are not really concerned about "migrants" or even potential Democrat voters at all.

The cash would still flow by illegal, underground means. How much drug cash flows back to Mexico? The pipeline is there. It would just turn into another profit center for the cartels.

A lot of people have the mentality that by banning something it can be stopped. The reverse usually turns out to be true. When the government bans something, they end up losing what little control over it the might have previously had (see alcohol prohibition, war and drugs, etc.). This is one of the main arguments I use against gun control.

quote:

Originally posted by cobre sig:

quote:

Originally posted by BBMW:
Or would they become more dependent on the smuggled in drug cash?

Not to mention that all the big US businesses that do business in Mexico will call in favors from the politicians whose campaigns they fund to stop this.

quote:

Originally posted by cobre sig:
Shut off all money transfers to Mexico and they will close their borders within a week. Its possible to shut it off but there really is no desire.

Which is my point, there is no desire. Mexico's economy would collapse in months without family members sending cash.

quote:

Originally posted by c1steve:
I suspect most locals do not support the cartels. They put up with them, but probably wish they were not there. I spent a year total in Mexico and Central America, and this is just my opinion.

Under the Sinoloa / El Chappo regime, the plan was to work WITH the locals. Dont fuck with them.
Build a school, soccer stadium, toss some extra $ at locals. Help out a business or two. "winning hearts and minds" theory. This way, locals turn a blind eye to or actually support the cartel trade.

Time to label them as terrorists and let the dogs off the leash.

Some in our govt will have to find another source of income.

I read this morning that Mexican judge refused the extradition order for this kid.

RMD

A) Mexico isn't actually a poor country, by global standards. It is a very eff'd up country.

B) The poverty is not a result of anything but Mexican culture. That culture is why there are cartels in charge, or corrupt POS in charge, and why everyone with any drive, aside from a handful of true believers, is up here.

C) To "clean up" Mexico, means to embrace wrecking, and reconstructing Mexico. Missionaries, the "right" NGOs running school systems, shoot on sight orders for cartel members, armed, trained civilian population, etc - the hardest part is, culturally, you're going to need a "Mexican" force to do a lot - far more so than we needed De Gaule as a figurehead in France - and bringing them in, and building them up, without getting it compromised, is going to be difficult. The cartels already have compromised our military through the Hispanics.

(Its more along the lines of "You daughter looked lovely in her new dress at church, Sunday. There's an envelope under your desk." Its not a pistol bullet for you, as much as incredible torture for your entire family, neighbors, etc, as well as you.)

We have to start treating Cartels like they're NAZIs, and anyone who backs them as NAZI sympathizers.

quote:

Originally posted by YooperSigs:

The conditions inside Mexico represent a grave threat to US security.

Just going to say that I really enjoyed the book "A Clear and Present Danger".

When the people of one of the most powerful nations on this planet decide that they want , no need something ,
And make the decision to pay for it at any price
Either financially
or
With human sacrifice.

There will always be people that will make the decision to reap the benifits of demand.

Until those that wield the power are deemed problematic ,
Poor decisions
Will be made
And
The suffering will never end

quote:

Originally posted by Aglifter:
We have to start treating Cartels like they're NAZIs, and anyone who backs them as NAZI sympathizers.

Do you know how many MILLIONS of Americans do Cocaine, Meth, Heroine & Marihuana that's been funneled up through Mexico?
Then there's the "Club Drugs" (MDMA and the like)

quote:

Originally posted by Aglifter:
C) The cartels already have compromised our military through the Hispanics.

Care to elaborate on this one?