I've suddenly reached the point in my life we all sometimes reach: I want a chisel sharp enough to shave slivers off boxwood bushing pegs against the grain as thin as ... well, they remind me of shaving slivers off ginger root. I bought a 1" chisel from the Northern Italian blade sharpening guy (in Italy he is an arrotino); he knows more about blades than any man I've ever met.

It works well but is too wide. After 16 boxwood ends, it seemed less sharp ¿imagination?

As soon as the arrotino saw the 1" Buck chisel today, he started making agitated comments, only a third of which I could understand. I thought he accused me of trying to sharpen the chisel. Eventually I learned I had been using the chisel wrong. Just like Channel-locks only work one way (unless you're a master plumber and using them backwards on purpose), I was using the chisel wrong side up. I alternated, depending on how I was using it on the boxwood, but it was enough to change the angle.

He accepted the 1", a ¼", and a small curved carving chisel, all to re-edge. $3.50 twice plus $5 for the curved one.

He got the $7 on the paper well enough, added the $5, but came up with $11. After using multiplication off to the side, he figured out the 6% tax would be 66¢, and wrote it under the $11. When I eventually got him to understand the $11 should be $12, and the tax is $0.72 (times tables are about all I remember of 4th grade), he had to start over on a fresh piece of paper.

The arrotino may be pushing 80, and numbers are getting mixed up, but he spotted a nearly invisible issue with my technique from several feet away, from looking at the tool. And he went on with more stories of tradespeople in the business for decades, never learning to use tools correctly.

I'll probably continue to use the chisel flat side down on occasion. When it is the better way to get the outcome I want. He says no one wants to apprentice to learn the trade. In all his years, his accent has stayed strong but not a single person wanted to stick with knife sharpening.

And now, some pictures:

A peg end freshly cut and another roughly shaved close. With the ¼" chisel I'll get it better. I am ordering a set of older Marples next week, and the ½" will be ideal.




With a 1" chisel, this is about as good as I can get it without nicking up the peg box. I figured I'd stop for now, until a smaller chisel is in hand.




The ZONA razor saw cuts wickedly close. That is a dime against the 8.5mm diameter peg bushing.

.....wow!!!.....

If you lived down here, I think I'd spend all my time at your place, fetching coffee and taking notes.

My test for my chisels is shaving fine hair off my forearm. I don't grind every time, typically touch up with diamond stone and a strop. Did get a Tormek grinder a while back. Now I need extra care so I don't draw blood while shaving hair.

Plane blades are just as sharp. In a tight spot the block plane blade can work as a short chisel.

 
Pardon if I'm rude, but I've never seen the benefit of having a blade that can shave hair. It's meant to cut wood. Coming off a good grinding, and a brief touch up on a stone to remove the burrs, is all that is necessary, and all I've ever needed, IMO.
 

Not rude at all, Henry. For years and years I've gotten by without sharpening anything more than a cold chisel on a grinder. Sometimes a screwdriver with a file. After a bit I discovered the local guy did not do as nice a job as the Gerber factory in restoring my Covert Folder's blade.

The pegs are in a delicate place, the work is entirely by hand, and any advantage helps protect the surrounding wood - in my case, the varnished 150 year old peg box of a fiddle. I got my chisels back from Antonio, the sharpener of iron (he wrote it for me in Italian but it's indecipherable), and made fast work of the peg ends. It is better to sometimes use the chisel flat, the "wrong way", so I'm thinking it is nearly time to make the drive into Chester County. A guy there is almost done building my new mandolin, and he has the gear to teach me how to keep my chisels sharp.

In the better 4-year luthier schools, weeks are dedicated to learning how to make a chisel really sharp.

I'm looking at an older set of Marples. The seller says he can get them razor sharp on his Tormek before shipping.

SigJacket, we'd put you to work buffing tops, shaving pegs, mixing hide glue, and letting the cat in and out eight times a day

quote:

Originally posted by henryaz:
 
Pardon if I'm rude, but I've never seen the benefit of having a blade that can shave hair. It's meant to cut wood. Coming off a good grinding, and a brief touch up on a stone to remove the burrs, is all that is necessary, and all I've ever needed, IMO.
 

It's all about how much physical effort you have to put into the back of the chisel, quality of the cut, and consistency. To that effect, the adage "a sharp knife is a safe knife" applies. Had I been using a sharp chisel to open my chisels back at the end of August, I'd still have 10 fully functional, fully enervated fingertips.

A good illustration would be a #4 smoother plane straight from the factory, versus one that's had its blade sharpened properly on progressively higher grit stones (my preference is to use 2 DMT plates, "coarse" and "fine," then 1000 grit and 6000 water stones). The former will make a shaving, but it'll be thick and/or variable, and the effort to push it, even if you use candle wax on the sole, will be will always be far greater than the latter. Compare that with the see-through shaving possible from the properly sharpened one. Now consider that planes are merely applied chisels (as are most woodworking tools). To further illustrate the difference, trade that #4 for a #6 jointer: it's a shoulder workout any way you look at it, but every little bit helps you take more shavings before you hit that "nope" threshold.

However, situational awareness plays in here. A framing guy doesn't really need microns-thick shavings, but an instrument maker or fine furniture maker might. I certainly don't for 80% of the work I do because of my experience level, but I'm OCD about my blades and I figure it can't actually hurt anything.

If your method works for you by all means stick with it. Don't change it just because someone on the Internet told you to, but give your blades a little more love sometime. You never know, you might like the results.

This is one of those threads I read and go WOW.

It's true: the more I think I know, the more I realize I know nothing.

Thanks for sharing. More pictures are always welcome of your project.

Cheers~

Thank you for sharing.
A tip of the hat to the Arrotino.
Great Luthiers need great tools.

quote:

Antonio, the sharpener of iron

"Sharpener of Iron" would be an awesome CUT for one who is a knife maker.

Or the google translated into Italian, "Affilatrice di ferro."

In much of my woodworking I don't need a razor sharp chisel. Having one at hand makes the work more of a pleasure and, as noted, safer.

As far as mindset, I do not know when I will be called on for, or I will require of myself, my very best work. For this reason I practice my best in almost all my work. I have two levels of work, either my best or "fast and dirty". In this way my quality keeps improving and often I get results that even please myself.

quote:

Originally posted by Patrick-SP2022:
"Sharpener of Iron" would be an awesome CUT for one who is a knife maker.

Or the google translated into Italian, "Affilatrice di ferro."

Antonio is actually from the South of Italy (not the North as I thought), and what he wrote on the paper ended with "di ferro" but it started differently; I could not make heads nor tails of it. I'll be back as soon as I ruin the edge on these chisels, using them "wrong". And get him to write it out again.

The chisel I used to keep in my plumbing bag for all manner of abuse was used mostly as a sharp bladed punch. I've moved on from that. Now I use a ⅜" x 8" Craftsman screwdriver

Thanks, slyguy. There's some more pictures in the SIGforum Gallery subforum from a couple previous projects, and I also post on nakedluthier.com but not as often as I'd like to.

quote:

Originally posted by vulrath:

quote:

Originally posted by henryaz:
 
Pardon if I'm rude, but I've never seen the benefit of having a blade that can shave hair. It's meant to cut wood. Coming off a good grinding, and a brief touch up on a stone to remove the burrs, is all that is necessary, and all I've ever needed, IMO.
 

However, situational awareness plays in here. A framing guy doesn't really need microns-thick shavings, but an instrument maker or fine furniture maker might. I certainly don't for 80% of the work I do because of my experience level, but I'm OCD about my blades and I figure it can't actually hurt anything.

This is the truth. I made fine furniture (and most other types of millwork) for 25 years. I went the route of ultra fine sharpening, and using the tools daily, 5 days a week, I found the cost/benefit to be too much, for my needs. In almost all cases, if it is to be seen, it is going to be followed up with (depending on the profile of the piece) rasps, files, and sandpapers of progressively finer grits. I never ventured into the realm of Woodman's type of work, though. Here's my now idle collection of hand planes from that era of my life.
 

 

There's definitely a point about knowing how to use a tool correctly.
I refuse to let anyone use any of my files; 99of 100 will just start sawing away with one and destroy it in short order.

quote:

Originally posted by zoom6zoom:
There's definitely a point about knowing how to use a tool correctly.
I refuse to let anyone use any of my files; 99of 100 will just start sawing away with one and destroy it in short order.

I am very protective of my files, too. Always chalk them up before using.
 
For using any kind of iron (chisel, plane, drawknife, etc) on wood, it is as important to be going with the grain as it is to have a perfectly sharp iron.
 

Water stones is the way I'll probably introduce myself. Freehand sharpening.

A 1000 and a 6000, plus a stone to dress the water stones?

quote:

Originally posted by Woodman:


SigJacket, we'd put you to work buffing tops, shaving pegs, mixing hide glue, and letting the cat in and out eight times a day

I'm good with that! I've done the Woodcraft guitar course (sound box came out well, the neck....um..), so I might not start completely from zero. And I like cats.