I'm interested in VOIP phone service so that I can subscribe to an international calling program for cheaper rates and for calls that would terminate on international mobile phones (my current landline service is pay by the (discounted) minute and doesn't call international cell phones, only landlines).

I used to have two landline phone lines; I've since cancelled one of the lines.

1) Can I get DSL using the wiring for the second line to get internet service and VOIP? Disadvantage here is that I would have to pay for additional internet service (already have cable internet).

2) Can I get (ATT) VOIP using my current internet service? This may be ideal however it seems that ATT VOIP requires ATT internet (see #1). Does anybody know - can I get ATT VOIP / internet phone service using a non-ATT ISP? Or only with ATT internet?

3) I would be okay with VOIP using my current internet service but they don't seem to have the international calling program that ATT does. If not, then may not be a cost effective calling solution. I could like into calling programs in more detail but it's hard to find info (website sucks).

#2 may be ideal; #1,3 may be less than ideal but technical solutions (assuming that they can complete calls to international mobile phones). It sounds like there is a limitation to landline service, not subject to internet phone service, that disallows calls to mobile phones.

Is this personal or for business? For all my international friends, we use just use WhatsApp on our mobile phones.

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Originally posted by konata88:
I'm interested in VOIP phone service so that I can subscribe to an international calling program for cheaper rates and for calls that would terminate on international mobile phones (my current landline service is pay by the (discounted) minute and doesn't call international cell phones, only landlines).

I used to have two landline phone lines; I've since cancelled one of the lines.

1) Can I get DSL using the wiring for the second line to get internet service and VOIP? Disadvantage here is that I would have to pay for additional internet service (already have cable internet).

It doesn't matter what ISP service you use, VoIP will traverse your existing Internet service, assuming sufficient bandwidth (which isn't really much unless you are doing video calls). You do not have to add an Internet service just for the VoIP traffic.

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2) Can I get (ATT) VOIP using my current internet service?

Maybe, but there are probably much better options in the VoIP market. You can use any VoIP provider with your existing Internet service, just as you can access any web server. For example, if your mobile phone service allows you to set up a "hot spot" WiFi access point, you can use it to make VoIP calls from any device on your network.

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This may be ideal however it seems that ATT VOIP requires ATT internet (see #1). Does anybody know - can I get ATT VOIP / internet phone service using a non-ATT ISP? Or only with ATT internet?

This is a business policy from ATT, not a technical one. They do not want to lose revenue to another company.

Is there a reason that ATT might be preferred over other VoIP providers or ISPs? The biggest plus for VoIP is that you are not married to a particular ISP or vendor. The VoIP service works over any IP network.

I will put in a plug for VoIP MS a provider that has served me well for over 20 years. I will also recommend Grandstream SIP phones as handsets. Please understand that any SIP phone will work with any VoIP provider (from a technical standpoint). There are even a number of free SIP "softphones" that run on an Internet-connected device. Even if one finds these inconvenient for regular usage, they are very useful in exploring VoIP options at a zero entry cost. Voip MX also has an excellent Wiki, and documentation that helps newbies understand the technology. Not saying that there aren't other decent providers out there. but....

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3) I would be okay with VOIP using my current internet service but they don't seem to have the international calling program that ATT does. If not, then may not be a cost effective calling solution. I could like into calling programs in more detail but it's hard to find info (website sucks).

I think the only way to determine this is to do more investigation. One of the other benefits with VoIP is that you are not limited to a single provider. You can point your SIP phone to multiple providers and compare side-by-side which gives you the best service.

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#2 may be ideal; #1,3 may be less than ideal but technical solutions (assuming that they can complete calls to international mobile phones). It sounds like there is a limitation to landline service, not subject to internet phone service, that disallows calls to mobile phones.

Again, this would be a policy/economic decision by the various providers. The technology does not prevent any of these scenarios.

As a final note, I am very happy to address general or specific questions as best I can if posed to me via the e-mail address in my profile. For any inquiries, please identify yourself by name and SigForum handle when asking.

I have used 1- Voip for several years for international service. Cost is very reasonable depending on country, cell number or land line number.

I can tell you that adding VOIP to your ISP plan is going to be some $30 a month, give or take. I use Ooma for mine. The equipment was purchased outright for about $90 (in 2019), then I pay about $7 a month for the service. It does everything I need it to do (i.e., unlimited local & long distance within the USA), and has never gone down, provided of course that electricity and internet are both up. YMMV.

^^^ Same here. I use Ooma with my ISP (Pure Talk). Cancelled the devil AT&T.

Thanks guys. Appreciate the help. This is for personal use.

I need to dig into the above more but it sounds like: ATT VOIP requiring ATT internet is not technical but policy limitation. Technically possible to install any VOIP service on any internet service. Sounds like VOIP MS and OOMA are a couple of options (never heard of them so will do some research).

SIP is some software phone installed on a device (laptop, cellphone) on the network? Thinking about this, I think I would like both a phone device connected to the LAN/Router as well as software phone on my cellphones. But the latter may be all that is necessary... Need to think some more.

Architect - thanks for the offer of help. I'll do some more research and may send you an email for some help.

I need to look into: 1) VOIP service providers (just want big name companies), including from my cable company; 2) Look into international plans from each possible provider (like ATT $15/mo plan for unlimited calling); 3) hard and soft phones (sounds like separate from VOIP plans).

Still researching but a couple of dumb questions:

1. I used to WFH and used Teams. Is this a form of VOIP? Does this suggest that my current home network (router, modem, ISP) is already capable of VOIP service, just need a new VOIP provider (since Teams is no longer available). Essentially, I just need a VOIP provider to replace Teams, including a software phone app (in place of the Teams app).

Specifically, I don't need something like a new VOIP enabled router / modem from my ISP, right? I can just plug in VOIP hw into my LAN or connect via wifi to my router. Or use a software VOIP app on my laptop / cell phone. Correct?

2. I checked cable company - they offer VOIP but their international service doesn't connect to cell phones (in some of the countries of interest). I'm not sure if this rules out my cable company as VOIP provider or if there is some workaround.

*Ooma warning*

If you go with them, choose the $7 monthly. But pay attention to the fine prints that say they will automatically upgrade you to the next (aka more pricey) level after the initial period (a couple of months, iirc). You need to tell them to opt out of that nonsense before it kicks in. I made a mistake of not paying attention and got zapped once. Had to call and threatened cancellation before they reverted to basic level.

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Originally posted by 12131:
*Ooma warning*

If you go with them, choose the $7 monthly. But pay attention to the fine prints that say they will automatically upgrade you to the next (aka more pricey) level after the initial period (a couple of months, iirc). You need to tell them to opt out of that nonsense before it kicks in. I made a mistake of not paying attention and got zapped once. Had to call and threatened cancellation before they reverted to basic level.

Thanks! Good to know.

the international calling plan for your cell phone would probably be cheaper.

SIP stands for Session Initiation Protocol, a cousin to TCP (Transmission Control Protocol). Both run "on top" of IP (Internet Protocol), with SIP geared toward streaming and TCP designed for data packet exchange. Phones used for VoIP are termed "SIP phones" and can be desksets, "softphones" (a telephone implemented in software that runs on a general-purpose device), or a "PBX" (Private Branch eXchange, a computer that acts like a classic telephone central office switch). VoIP providers maintain one or more PBX servers to provide an endpoint to originate or terminate VoIP calls using SIP. These PBX-like systems will have one or more tie ins to the legacy world-wide "phone system," and/or various mobile provider networks. International calling is more complicated due to many Governments wanting a piece of the action on each call. The US has relatively low taxation on telephonic communications, but this is not the case overseas where taxes can be several multiples over the actual cost of providing service.

Cost is the primary reason VoIP has been widely adopted by telephone service providers over legacy technologies. Most "phone companies" are now using VoIP for virtually all of the long haul, and intermediate traffic. Even if you are using a classic Bell System phone as your "land line," at some point between you and the person you're calling, it is virtually certain that the call will be carried over VoIP. There are devices, known as ATA (Analog Telephone Adapters) that convert VoIP to legacy Bell "tip and ring" signals so as to connect an old-style phoneset to the VoIP network, the OOMA is this type of device.

It is also possible, and not at all expensive, to run your own "home PBX" on a old or spare computer system. System requirements are quite modest, a 486 with 32MB of RAM, or even a Raspberry Pi is more than enough. The advantage of going this route is more control over "line" costs, and the ability to set up in-house to in-house calling/conferencing/etc. (usually VoIP providers will support this as well).

Unfortunately (in my mind at least) much of the terminology used in classic telephony does not directly apply to VoIP provisioning, and this can be very confusing. For example, the term "line" has no analog in VoIP, instead you have an account for outgoing calls, and a DiD for incoming calls. Much more like connecting to a web server for outgoing, and running your own web server for incoming. There are many articles and tutorials on the web that attempt to explain how VoIP works. Vendors generally try to conceal these differences in an attempt to not scare off potential customers, and not all of them do it the same way so trying to compare one service against another can be challenging.

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Specifically, I don't need something like a new VOIP enabled router / modem from my ISP, right? I can just plug in VOIP hw into my LAN or connect via wifi to my router. Or use a software VOIP app on my laptop / cell phone. Correct?

Correct. There are SIP phones that connect via wired ethernet, and/or WiFi. Many of the latter are portables that are not intended to sit on a desk while you are using them (sort of like a "cordless phone"). Many of the desktop variety feature PoE (Power over Ethernet) to supply electrical power, but these can also be powered via a "wall wart" power supply. PoE is very convenient in an office environment because it significantly reduces the wiring required.

Features and price vary widely, but pretty much all of them offer multiple "lines," speed dial, etc., things you won't find on your typical Bell system phone. The online vendor VoIP Supply has a wide range of products from leading manufacturers. I like the Grandstream product line for features, quality, and affordability.

Next time you go to your doctor or other business where there is a phone in the room, take a look at it. It will most likely be a SIP phone connected to their Ethernet network. Mitel and Cisco phones are very popular for business applications, although I am not particularly impressed by their product line.

But, before you lay out the cash for a physical phone, I'd suggest going the softphone route so as to get an idea of how the technology works at minimal cost. A softphone will run on pretty much any computer with a speaker and microphone, including your cell phone. Calling via a softphone installed on a mobile device does not use "minutes" but "data" instead, even though it uses the device's microphone and speaker, and seems no different than making a "regular" mobile call.

Regarding softphones, by far my favorite is a macOS/BSD application named "Telephone" which is appealing because it makes no effort to emulate a POTS (Plain Old Telephone System) interface. There are many others, most of them freeware.

The reality is that the cost of entry/trial is so low that there is little excuse for not trying a variety of "products" and providers to get an overview of the technology. Your time is certainly valuable, but spending a little of it to learn and experiment can prove very fruitful.

Thank you. Very useful information and education. I will need to read and study some more big I think I'm getting the big picture.

One question: I'm concerned about privacy and security, some about the calls themselves but also about the information (name, address, billing info, etc) I may be asked to provide to set up service.

Are the big names (ie - search for "recommended VOIP provider") all reliable? Or how much care do I need to exercise? For example, Ooma sounds like a respected provider and yet they seem to have issues w/ billing (per searches on the web) including multiple fake charges.

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Originally posted by FenderBender:
the international calling plan for your cell phone would probably be cheaper.

Checking. You may be right. This might be the simplest and cheapest solution. But I still may need a home solution. Need to check more and think about this more.

I have been using Magic jack for VoIP for years.

Super cheap, works well.

$50 for the first year including the equipment, a dongle.

I still have the line and the service.

3 year renewal is $100.

Everyone I know overseas has switched to WhatsApp.

ATT VOIP is what I have running over ATT Fiber, I am considering moving it to a PC based provider such as Ring Central that handles my inboung/outbound company faxes via conversion to PDF and email.

Per some of your questions, your current internet provider will not have any issue with any 3rd party VOIP. However a VOIP plan such as ATT will.

Att has signup deals, lower monthly fees, reward cards etc. For us ATT fiber has been very reliable, much better than the problems we were experiencing with Spectrums cable internet delivery.

https://www.att.com/buy/internet/plans/

ATT VOIP does require ATT Internet, they do have an international calling plan $35 a month, it has a list of unlimited free calling countries. For $55 a month you get VOIP and Internet.

https://www.att.com/home-phone/services/

As others have suggested there are apps you can run on your cell phone such as What's App, and that can run on a PC as well that people use for international calls.

You could get a BT enabled headset for your office that connects to you cell, pc, and a land line phone as well, then you can toggle between services based on the call you need to make.

Thanks for the good info. I wish apple would provide a voip service. I guess they kind of do - facetime w/ video turned off? I don't use facetime so not sure but seems like this might be the case? But doesn't help w/ calls to non-Apple phones....