IMO, don't just walk away......RUN.

Imagine how your life will be when those kids become teens and you try to tame them.

Yes, I've been there....done that. As I remember, she was "HOT" and the sex was outstanding.....but her kids were out of control.

quote:

Originally posted by sourdough44:
One has to be careful getting between the potential new squeeze & her kids, a minefield.

Recipe for disaster Sir, I married my wife 3.5 years ago, her kids were 11 and 8 when we met. There are some power struggles but their mom never allowed that sort of shitty behavior that you are talking about. When there are disagreements we all get together and rationally talk them out. Your lady is not about discipline, and more that likely will not allow you to do it either

To put in terms for a gun forum, you're a Sig Guy and she's a desirable Glock (you always wanted a striker fired) that is very tempting however she comes with a bunch of Hi Points in off the wall calibers. Now a day at the range shooting the Glock is good but then having to deal with all those Hi Points takes more time than you get to shoot the Glock and is going to really spoil your day at the range then you have to clean and maintain them. Save yourself the trouble and look for another Sig or at least a Glock that has a bunch of Glocks or even a Sig or two.

quote:

And after a few dates she asks "when can you be around the kids to make it easier?"

Why does she expect a guy she recently started dating to ease her parenting problems? For me, that raises questions about her judgment and self-reliance. Of course she may have been kidding around. Regardless, why on earth would anyone (OP) willingly drag another person's family problems into their life? That's too high of a price for companionship, IMO.

Good luck, OP.

Been on both sides having been a single father. Didn’t work out either time. First one was because my children came first and with the other it was the girlfriend’s. That’s just me though so good luck.

Her parenting style is not a Millenial thing. I've seen that lack of discipline in every generation since hippies started giving birth and having free-range kids.

Out of control kids is a giant red flag.
Other bailout warnings:
Her car is a POS, full of trash and garbage.
Her pets telepathically beg you to help them escape her house.
Her Ex is a doper, drunk, jailbird, abuser or outlaw biker.
Dead end job she has held for years, and bitches about it.
Estranged from her family.
Asks a lot of questions about your income. Or the car / truck you drive.
Uses the term: I dont need a man!.
Rude to wait staff, clerks or other service people.
Best of luck in the dating world! You need it!

*Eject!*
*Eject!*
*Eject!*

Some gals have baggage. This one you're dealing with has a whole fucking freight train! Best move for you is to promptly exit stage right!

Is she THAT good?
My guess is no, based solely on reality rather than opinion, therefore follow ejection procedure as provided.

Run, don't walk. Have a very good friend who entered into a relationship like that when he was 24 and she was 34 kids were 11 and 8. Both kids are now adults and completely worthless. Their only fights are over her disrespectful kids. I have no idea why he stays.

quote:

Originally posted by apprentice:
Is she THAT good?

Well, if she is, disregard what I'm about to say. But then are you anyone to judge? I doubt it because if you have the background to say you wouldn't be asking us.

Who am I to judge? I've only been married for the last 50.5 years, all to the same woman. Might be a different answer if I had a string of experiences to judge from.

For you to get control of the situation, if you were foolish enough to marry the girl, they'd all end up hating you. The kids aren't going to accept you cleaning up their act. And the girl might accept it, but probably not. The kids have control now and have had it so long they're not going to willingly give it up. Its what needs to happen because in the very near future they'll get so much worse as teens no one will be able to stand them.

I know you can't see it because new intruders won't be accepted. The kids will make destroying you their new life's work. My money is on them, not you. Kids just make it their life's work. They will hate you, just because its what they do. I would even bet that if her parents are alive, a visit with them would also open your eyes.

quote:

Originally posted by PHPaul:
There would never have been a second date under those circumstances, no matter how hot she was.

This ^^^^^

I dated a seriously hawt chick with "kid problems" like this. I was having none of it. The relationship did not last.

Bail, and bail now.

There is no shortage of people on this planet to choose from.

Not that I asked for advice on what to do, just blowing steam about how this type of parenting seems to have become the norm as I've seen it before.

I didn't like when my son was young and we got seated in the "family section" of restaurants with the randomly screaming kids and oblivious parents who don't even react because they are tuning it out. I was like "my kid knows how to behave and I don't want to be around kids who don't and parents that don't care". I don't want my meal constantly disrupted just because I have a child with me.

I will admit I am much less tolerant of kids misbehavior than many other people, so sometimes a reality check is helpful. Some of this might not be considered too out of the ordinary by others. This is a thing in my dad's family and it's just how we are and how I was raised. My son, despite his good nature, was good at pushing my ex-wive's buttons and manipulating her into getting what he wanted, which was usually to stay up long past bedtime. When she wasn't around, I made it clear that bed time is bed time no excuses, no exceptions. "Read me a story!" No, if you want a story it starts earlier and ends at lights out. "I'm hungry!" OK, here's a toasted cheese sandwich, you have 5 minutes then lights out. After a little while, he went to bed on his own at bedtime with no excuses.

An ex-gf had similar issues with her daughter but her former brother-in-law made excuses for it and said it wasn't a big deal, she's just strong willed. He had three kids and I have one, so maybe he had a point. I just do not tolerate open defiance of adults - saying no, talking back, being defiant, negotiating around direct instructions. It's like a horse that has to be broken, and if it's up to me, it's going my way not theirs. With this ex-gf I pretty much stayed out of it and advised her on how to break the cycle. But when the daughter talked shit to me in public I immediately and sternly told her that is not permitted. Didn't go over well, to say the least.

In my observation fathers are usually better at this than mothers. Many mothers just can't separate themselves from "their baby" and enforce discipline, and the worst ones actively prevent fathers from doing it. Every convict sentenced to death has a mother in the courtroom crying about "my baby isn't bad, he just got in with the wrong people!". Fathers matter, and the lack of fathers in poor neighborhoods is a huge contributor to bad behavior of boys and young men.

No, I am not interested in parenting this new one's kids for her, and she is not asking me too. I said previously that kids are to be disciplined by their blood parents and my son is my responsibility and not anyone I date, and the same for her. The comment about "making it easier" was because there is no dad around (died shortly after the divorce so she's not a "widow" in the traditional sense) she has them full time and her only time off is when they are at school, or possibly visiting her ex's parents. So it's a logistical thing since they are too young to be left alone. I am firm on kids being out of the picture until the preliminary dating is finished. Parents should not show their kids a revolving door of dates, only people that are going to around a while, once that has been determined. I would extend some Leeway because these kids lost their dad about a year ago, had to move from their house into an apartment, and various other things that would affect any kid and possibly result in some acting out. And she's not a US native so there are some cultural differences as well.

That said, talking in the evenings and hearing what's going on has been enlightening to say the least, much more so than texting or talking on the phone only after the kids are asleep (one person I dated did that). She's not hiding anything which is actually respectable from a "full disclosure" point of view, and it's better than dating a few months and then meeting the kids...

But yeah, it's not going to go much further because I would not be able to stand it. And sadly I've seen a lot more of this kind of behavior than anything else with regard to single mothers and kids their age.

quote:

Originally posted by Aeteocles:
There is no shortage of people on this planet to choose from.

Yeah but I'm grounded and can't travel internationally this year....

You didn't set the house on fire, so you don't need to rescue everyone.

so many red flags there you must feel like a bull. you know what to and don't even look back

Why is this even a consideration at this point? GTFO, right now. Life's too short to put up with that nonsense. There are other fish in the sea, and you're not committed at this point, so move on ASAP before it gets any worse.

I would not tolerate that kind of behavior (or the enabling) for one minute, much less for the rest of my life. My wife and I have been married for 15 years and have 4 kids. It works because we share the same values and have the same expectations of each other and our kids.

What you are describing is a disaster in the making. She and her kids have established this pattern over the last 8-9 years...its not going to change now just because you've come along. Run now and don't look back.