Back in the day, amateur and CB radio were well known. CB is limited in power and frequency bands. With amateur radio, the sky’s the limit, but you need a license that requires passing a test, and none of your friends and family have their license.

FRS is your off the shelf walkie talkie with very short range. With a (no test) GMRS license, you can use FRS frequencies with higher power and repeaters.

In recent years, civilian radio is getting more digital. Amateur radio has APRS, which allows (unencrypted) messaging and (optional) position reporting.

A recent development is the Meshtastic protocol over LoRa (long range) radio. In the U.S. LoRa runs on the 915 MHz ISM band. Meshtastic is similar to APRS in forming (practically) self-organizing networks.

Has anyone incorporated these, or other radio types, into their emergency planning?

I've played around with a pair of cheap Meshtastic radios, mostly investigating as a potential off-grid way to track people in a relatively small area. Here in the Salt Lake valley, there are a good number of "infrastructure" type nodes where people have invested in good, permanently emplaced antennas. With those nodes available, I can "see" a good long ways even with my very cheap radios.

However I would really caution against relying on these Meshtastic radios for any serious purpose. Your reliance on others' relaying your messages is an obvious weak point as I suspect many will not have a good power source. However if you want to have a way to "text" your buddy a handful of miles away it might be a good option. Note that you can create private networks with your own encryption key, but nobody outside of your private network will relay your traffic.

If you're into radios or just a tech nerd, do pick some up to play with. As linked above, they're super cheap and have kept me entertained. Note the software has a "pax counter" module that records WiFi and Bluetooth MAC address that pass within range. Might be something interesting (or creepy) there.

We have a couple radios in our get-home bags.
I recently (end of march) got my HAM license and have been playing around with that quite a bit.

For our get-home bags, I ended up choosing some DMR radios as there's a fair number of DMR repeaters in my area.
I figure that in the event of vehicle trouble the radios are a good backup if there's no cell reception in the area.

I also like the fact that if I'm truly in a SHTF scenario... I can use these radios for simplex comms and only someone else with a DMR radio programmed the exact same way can hear/understand me.
But they can of course also do standard analog radio to be understood by anyone (when desired).

I also picked up a couple of DSTAR radios.
There's almost zero DStar presence around here, so if someone cracks my DMR, we can fall back to this.

I also have base stations for inside the house to handle both of those above technologies.

Those radios all use VHF (roughly 144mhz)or UHF (roughly 440mhz).
144mhz is also known as the 2 meter band.
440mhz is also known as the 70 centimeter band.

70cm is great for urban environments as it cuts through buildings fairly easily.
2m is better in rural as it can more easily handle vegetation.

With 70cm, my best distance is probably about 15-20 miles.
With 2m, my best distance is about 50-60 miles.
The HAM technician license gets you the above VHF/UHF (as well as the 6m band (50mhz)).

If you're looking to go any further than that you need to start poking into the world of HF.
For this you'd need the HAM general or extra license.
My antenna system for HF is still... not great.
However I've been able to hear people from as far away as Japan and Russia (I'm in NC).

During my early learning phases I picked up a handful of these cheap things.
They're honestly fairly well made for what they are.

A couple years ago I grabbed some of these things based on some posts on this forum.

Both of those radios quite happily work perfectly well with the others listed in my previous post (for analog).
I figure if I ever do end up in SHTF then I can hand these things out to neighbors or something.

One benefit both of those have over the more expensive ones in my first post... they're not locked down to NOT transmit on GMRS/FRS frequencies.

The anytones and icoms (linked above) both refuse to transmit on GMRS - but can happily receive on it.
However the baofengs and retevises quite happily flip the bird to the FCC in that regard.

If your locked HAM radio can receive GMRS and your GMRS radio can receive HAM frequencies, you can use them to communicate with each other.

My amateur radios are unlocked so I’m able to transmit and receive on HAM bands as well as GMRS if needed. A requirement I usually follow when researching a radio is that it can be unlocked

There is a big thread Para started in the lounge about communications devices, it has a lot of good information.

https://sigforum.com/eve/forum...935/m/5830063605/p/1

I link it simply because at 40 pages theres too much to reference to re-post

One of the best radios I have come across so far is the Wouxun KG-935H.

https://www.buytwowayradios.co...gXaFzR_viSdWWpczmjnu

It’s a tri band radio, can be programmed with Chirp, is easily “unlockable” meaning it will transmit and receive out of band (GMRS) and doesn’t cost a fortune. Pair it with a good antenna from ZBM2 and youre ready to go.

https://zbm2industries.com/

After Para’s thread about radios, referenced above, we got some of the basic recommended ones and our basic license.

That being said, I’m intrigued with a Starlink Mini. In many ways, easier to use, no license required, and it’s not dependent on antennas or repeaters.

Like many here, I began my emergency communications interest a couple of years ago and followed a few of the threads here on SF. Since then, I have a GMRS license and my Technician's license. Perhaps more importantly, I joined a local HAM radio club and have begun the journey to get ARES certified in EmComm. If you are not sure what these acronyms/terms mean, welcome to the world of communications. Go find out what they mean at EmComm and ARES. The single most valuable source of knowledge, help, and encouragement has come from my colleagues in EmComm. These guys may be classified as "amateurs," but they are pros. Many coming from careers in military comms, other retired first responders with decades of experience. No commentary means much without understanding the source, so now you know my background and level of experience and I am sharing my experience from the perspective of a relative newbie. Others here likely are more experienced, I'd love their take on the topic.

I think a crucial aspect on comms has been missing from this discussion, and some of the others I have seen on SF. One really has to define and understand what they want their comms to do for them, for that drives almost all the decisions. Consider what different types of things might be "emergency communications" in the event of infrastructure communications failures.

The ability to reach family or friends in a local area.
An example from my own life arose in the lead up to the 2024 Presidential election. I was concerned that when Trump won, there was a heightened probability of violence from the left. My son attended HS 2 miles away, and I was concerned about his ability to get home. We had already seen what a mess un-planned transportation from his school could be during evacuations due to severe weather. I had already researched and had a planned escape route for him where we could meet most likely undetected in a matter of minutes. Hand-held radios are the perfect choice here. Short range, easily carried. Properly pre-programmed, easy to use. The low-power FRS wouldn't work here. He and I practiced on GMRS, but I gave him a VHF radio to carry. Sure, it would be illegal for him to TX without a license, but it would be short messages and unlikely to get caught. There are many other similar possibilities.

The ability to notify family/friends out of the region.
Let loved ones know that you survived the disaster. In my case, that happened when I was caught in the Loma Prieta EQ. My mother could not get through on the phone to me, but I was able to call her and let her know I was fine. If telephone is out, a StarLink Internet link would work great for this. In radio, probably an HF radio is required, repeaters within VHF range are likely to be down.

Communicate among a group of casual people that are trying to coordinate efforts in an emergency.
This might be a group of people in a retirement community that organize to check on each other after an incident. GMRS could work, FRS probably is fine, as well. Depending on the size, geography, buildings in the area, might need to put together a call-tree type arrangement to reach everyone, but doable.

Communicate among a group of dedicated people to a particular action.
This could be people putting together a security patrol to protect from civil unrest, or looting after a natural disaster. The book, "Guerilla's Guide to the Baofeng Radio" is a nice primer on that scenario.

Another group falling into this category are the amateur radio operators that assist the official responders to an incident. This would be people most likely associated with FEMA, a state-level agency, or most likely a county emergency services. This requires training and certification.

Until one has defined their communications problem clearly, recommendations on equipment, service, operations, etc. are moot. There is no one-size-fits-all.

Finally, just as owning a revolver doesn't make one Jerry Michelak, owning a radio does not make one a communicator. What ever you do, practice your comms with the people you want to communicate with. It is surprising the difficulties that can arise, and during a real emergency, wringing those out is a severe weakness.

quote:

Originally posted by DrDan:
....One really has to define and understand what they want their comms to do for them, for that drives almost all the decisions. Consider what different types of things might be "emergency communications" in the event of infrastructure communications failures....

This is a great post IMO.

I had a set goal in mind when I started my HAM journey.
I targeted my purchases with that goal in mind.
I then attempted to use my stuff in the same fashion as I would in an emergency.
It was a bit of an eye opener as some things don't always work as you'd expect.
Some of my purchases worked out - some did not; and then I had to go back to the drawing board to figure out what to do instead.

quote:

That being said, I’m intrigued with a Starlink Mini. In many ways, easier to use, no license required, and it’s not dependent on antennas or repeaters.

Our property manager, office is a little out of the metro Sacramento are (Rancho Murietta), recently had a cyberattack that closed the internet. I immediately recommended she get Starlink.

In a war, Starlink will be attacked, but probably can't be shut down completely--glad to hear different opinions.

By 2027 there will be direct Starlink to cell phone capability. It exists now for messaging (through T-Mobile). But long term Starlink is planning to be a major player internationally in the cellular communications market.

What about those radios that use cellular? I think Rocky Talk is a popular version of that.

quote:

Originally posted by ruger357:
What about those radios that use cellular? I think Rocky Talk is a popular version of that.

If you mean this:
https://rockytalkie.com/

I just checked their website.
They seem to offer two radios.
One uses FRS.
One uses GMRS.

Neither FRS nor GMRS uses cellular frequencies.
Both of those use frequencies in the 460MHZ range.

quote:

Originally posted by creslin:

quote:

Originally posted by ruger357:
What about those radios that use cellular? I think Rocky Talk is a popular version of that.

If you mean this:
https://rockytalkie.com/

I just checked their website.
They seem to offer two radios.
One uses FRS.
One uses GMRS.

Neither FRS nor GMRS uses cellular frequencies.
Both of those use frequencies in the 460MHZ range.

Yeah. It’s somebody else but I forget who.

quote:

Originally posted by creslin:
If you're looking to go any further than that you need to start poking into the world of HF.
For this you'd need the HAM general or extra license.
My antenna system for HF is still... not great.
However I've been able to hear people from as far away as Japan and Russia (I'm in NC).

HF NVIS can be used from locally out to several hundred miles. I've hit friends a few miles away with a wire just a few feet off the ground. An antenna analyzer makes cutting the wire to the proper length easy.

There won't be much need for DXing in a survival situation, and 2M may or may not work at all in a grid down/power out scenario as those repeaters require power. And, depending on your terrain, simplex may or may not work.

quote:

Originally posted by ruger357:
What about those radios that use cellular? I think Rocky Talk is a popular version of that.

I believe you are thinking of https://rapidradios.com/


Also known as “POC 4g LTE” radios.

Several options, yes they rely on the cellular systems but will work with multiple carriers and use data for voice so transmissions can be encrypted.

Can switch to alternate carrier if one goes down, and using data may get a “call” through where voice cell won’t (similar to how a rext will get through when call fails).


I am looking into these as a possible option for our church response team. No FCC license issues, simple walkie-talkie operation, reasonable cost in the $50-$60 range with lifetime SIM.

Can call individuals or groups and have a private locally managed network.


Some models have FRS as well for back up or hybrid that can function as a repeater to send the POC transmissions over FRS and vice versa.

quote:

Originally posted by 911Boss:

quote:

Originally posted by ruger357:
What about those radios that use cellular? I think Rocky Talk is a popular version of that.

I believe you are thinking of https://rapidradios.com/


Also known as “POC 4g LTE” radios.

Several options, yes they rely on the cellular systems but will work with multiple carriers and use data for voice so transmissions can be encrypted.

Can switch to alternate carrier if one goes down, and using data may get a “call” through where voice cell won’t (similar to how a rext will get through when call fails).


I am looking into these as a possible option for our church response team. No FCC license issues, simple walkie-talkie operation, reasonable cost in the $50-$60 range with lifetime SIM.

Can call individuals or groups and have a private locally managed network.


Some models have FRS as well for back up or hybrid that can function as a repeater to send the POC transmissions over FRS and vice versa.

Yep. That’s it. Thanks!

Another hit from Tidradio, the TD-H9

Very similar to the H8 in a well done 10w HT, but the big new feature is APRS positioning.

I’ve been playing around with one for about 3 days and really like it. Enough in fact that am selling off my two H8s and two H3s (email if interested - sure miss the classifieds…)

This message has been edited. Last edited by: 911Boss,

I highly recommend the Wouxun KG-UV9PX+ Ham handheld radio available from BetterSafeRadio.

https://bettersaferadio.com/25...-band-scanner-black/

I have two of these and they perform flawlessly. One great feature is that they can be unlocked with the free CHIRP software. I have more expensive handhelds but they're collecting dust on the shelf as I always choose the KG-UV9PX+.

There are multiple reviews on Youtube.

Note: The KG-UV9PX+ is the upgraded KG-UV9PX and is much improved.