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Purveyor of Death
and Destruction
Picture of walker77
posted
Does anybody know of a place that has IMR 4895 in stock (preferably 8lb)?

If not, what would be a good substitute that I can find in stock? I have only used 4895 for my 308 150gr FMJ.
 
Posts: 7206 | Location: Raymore, Missouri | Registered: June 24, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Walker - I cannot provide you a solution for finding any 4895 as I to used what I had until I could not find any. I did a lot of research and decided to move to Winchester 748 as a replacement powder for my 150gr 308 loads. If you google Winchester 748 powder for 308 rounds there is a lot of information (older and also newer posts) related to this combo…..

Good news is the 748 is a very affordable powder that was available at three different on-line sites about two months ago when I decided to pull the trigger on buying some. I purchased two - 4lb jugs from MidSouth Shooting Supply…

The 748 can also be used for other rifle rounds like the 5.56/223 and this was what sold me on this powder because I load and shoot a lot of the 5.56/223 rounds also.
 
Posts: 2845 | Location: MS | Registered: December 16, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Purveyor of Death
and Destruction
Picture of walker77
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Ill look into it. Thanks!
 
Posts: 7206 | Location: Raymore, Missouri | Registered: June 24, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I have used IMR3031 in lieu of IMR4895 or H4895 in 30-06 military loads w/ good results. I know there are loads for 308 using IMR3031. A lot of places have IMR3031 in stock.
 
Posts: 3697 | Registered: January 17, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Caught in a loop
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I've kept my ear very close to the ground the past couple of years for components. I haven't seen any of the 4895 variants in a hot minute.

As far as alternatives go, I have heard amazing things about CFE 223 for 308 though I haven't tried it. IMR 4116 used to be my go-to but it's been discontinued; I'm not sure what I'm going to do when I run through the 9.5# I have left. But then, I'm also pushing Berger 200.20X BTHP and not 150gr ball.


"In order to understand recursion, you must first learn the principle of recursion."
 
Posts: 3197 | Location: Memphis, TN | Registered: August 23, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Purveyor of Death
and Destruction
Picture of walker77
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So Powder Valley has IMR 4895 listed as discontinued. I emailed them and they confirmed that Hodgdon has discontinued it.

Sounds odd. I'm going to contact Hodgdon and see what they say. Although it would make sense as to why nobody has it.
 
Posts: 7206 | Location: Raymore, Missouri | Registered: June 24, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
I Deal In Lead
Picture of Flash-LB
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HOdgdon still lists it on their website. No mention of being discontinued.

https://shop.hodgdon.com/hodgdon-h4895/
 
Posts: 9912 | Location: Gilbert Arizona | Registered: March 21, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Purveyor of Death
and Destruction
Picture of walker77
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quote:
Originally posted by Flash-LB:
HOdgdon still lists it on their website. No mention of being discontinued.

https://shop.hodgdon.com/hodgdon-h4895/


I understand that. I'm only relaying what Powder Valley told me.

 
Posts: 7206 | Location: Raymore, Missouri | Registered: June 24, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Sounds like the are consolidating powders. H4895 is virtually the same thing. Just like a while back Hodgdon was supposed to stop making Winchester 231 since HP-38 is the same thing.
 
Posts: 3697 | Registered: January 17, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Caught in a loop
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quote:
Originally posted by 357fuzz:
Sounds like the are consolidating powders. H4895 is virtually the same thing. Just like a while back Hodgdon was supposed to stop making Winchester 231 since HP-38 is the same thing.


The entire IMR Enduron line is getting the axe as well, as they're functionally VERY similar to the Hodgdon Extreme lineup. IMR 4166 and 4451 are almost identical to Varget and H4350 respectively. This was announced at the beginning of September. It's a real shame because while the Hodgdon stuff was constantly sold out the IMR stuff (while it was available) was always much easier to find (current environment excepting, of course).

I just hope my IMR loads will translate over to the Hodgdon stuff without much of a fuss.


"In order to understand recursion, you must first learn the principle of recursion."
 
Posts: 3197 | Location: Memphis, TN | Registered: August 23, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of sourdough44
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Over the years I’ve found many uses for Ramshot TAC, near similar burn rate. The Ramshot data booklet is usually available as a free download.

There is plenty of info out there for medium/faster cartridges, 223, 308, etc..
 
Posts: 5512 | Location: WI | Registered: February 29, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of sigcrazy7
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SONOFABITCH! For the last few years before Covid, Enduron was flogged as the "next big thing." Extreme powders were hard to get, so I went all in on the new powders. Now they're being discontinued??! Dammit!! Maybe this is their plan all along, to keep me in a perpetual cycle of load development.

At least I bought 64 lbs of the fabulous 4451 before it was nixed, which will last me until the sun goes supernova. I'm quite the fan of 7977 as well, but only have 10 lbs of it. At least I managed 16 lbs of RL23, so I suppose I'll manage. Ironically, I've got plenty of powder to keep the 50BMG shooting. I managed to stash away 350 lbs of cannon powder and about 5000 bullets and primers. That's a lot of big boom.

I'm all for whittling down the catalog a little. Frankly, I feel that things were getting out of hand with the powder selection. Too many powders that did about the same thing. However, I feel the core powders should be left alone and remain available. Specifically, 4064, 4895, & 4350. You open up a Speer No 7 and those powders are listed. Hey Hodgdon, you know what makes a powder "legendary?" Longevity, that's what. How about respecting the decades of load data that everybody has developed on these powders.



Demand not that events should happen as you wish; but wish them to happen as they do happen, and you will go on well. -Epictetus
 
Posts: 7797 | Location: Utah | Registered: December 18, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Caught in a loop
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4451 was my favorite as well, it makes for a mighty accurate 6.5 Creedmoor load. I wasn't able to snag nearly as much, but I still have 16# stashed away.

The real gut-punch for me is 4116. I bought 8# of it when I couldn't find Varget (and quite frankly I prefer the IMR over the Hodgdon products anyway) and was trying to get a load for 308.

So you're the reason why I can't find any 4451, eh? :P


"In order to understand recursion, you must first learn the principle of recursion."
 
Posts: 3197 | Location: Memphis, TN | Registered: August 23, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Powder Valley is WRONG! They do not know of what they are talking about. I just got off the phone with Hodgdon. And, the guy said I was not the first person to ask about IMR 4895. And, the Hodgdon rep was going have Hodgdon provide some clarity to PV soon.
 
Posts: 5 | Registered: July 21, 2022Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of sigcrazy7
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quote:
Originally posted by vulrath:

So you're the reason why I can't find any 4451, eh? :P


Maybe, LOL.

I mostly got lucky. When it was brand new, nobody seemed to want it, so it sat at Cabelas. Eventually it was marked down to $165 per eight, so I bought it all on the hope that it would be a good sub for H4350. This was during the H4350 drought. It was only later that I discovered how great it was. A gamble that paid off.

It’s too bad I’m not closer. I’ve got two or three pounds of 4166 that didn’t work out very well for me.



Demand not that events should happen as you wish; but wish them to happen as they do happen, and you will go on well. -Epictetus
 
Posts: 7797 | Location: Utah | Registered: December 18, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Caught in a loop
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I finally broke down and joined the Varget customer base in light of the Enduron mess. I've got 16# of Varget sitting for when I run out of 4166. I also bought a jug of H4350 for the 6GT build, once that gets out of gunsmith purgatory (hopefully only a couple weeks left!). Hopefully by the time I get through that things will have stabilized more for better availability and price.

On that note I'm planning on calling Hodgdon at some point and asking the tech line directly because everything I'm seeing about these powders being discontinued seems to, at its core, be connected to a Facefuck post by Powder Valley. The above note about IMR 4895 makes me suspicious that PVA might have gotten some faulty information.

I'm definitely super jealous of your little hoard there. 4451 would make for some really good GT ammo, I think.


"In order to understand recursion, you must first learn the principle of recursion."
 
Posts: 3197 | Location: Memphis, TN | Registered: August 23, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of sigcrazy7
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I did the same thing with 2230. I was passing through Gretna, IA, and decided to stop at Brownells. Accurate was switching 2230 from being made in Belgium to St Marks, I think, so they had marked the Belgium powder down to $115 per eight pounds. I bought it all and rode back to Utah with 84 pounds in the truck. I couldn’t pass up the price at around $15/lb. Ironically, I first tried 2230 when our local shop was discounting A223 down to $9 lb because it’s manufacture was being moved from the Czech Republic to Belgium, so I had purchased the three pounds they had.

Is it hoarding? A little, but if stuff sits there and nobody is buying it, and it’s during a time of ample supply, I don’t see the utility of not buying all I can. I don’t buy for the purpose of scalping it later. I just buy all I’ll ever need when I can. I did sell 24 lbs to my BIL for exactly what I paid for it.

Hopefully that funny-colored Varget works out for you. I could never find it anywhere, so never really worked with it much. Maybe I’ll find a mountain of it at discount sometime. Cool



Demand not that events should happen as you wish; but wish them to happen as they do happen, and you will go on well. -Epictetus
 
Posts: 7797 | Location: Utah | Registered: December 18, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Caught in a loop
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Nicely done. I've got a little bit of a large variety of stuff.

I just got off the phone with the tech line at Hodgdon; this is what Luke over there told me: The line's not officially discontinued, but there's zero manufacturing capacity for it at this time, and it's probably not going to be put back on the schedule any time soon. There's a chance it could come back down the road, but you should go ahead and start working up loads with alternative powders. To quote him directly, "I wouldn't hold your breath."


"In order to understand recursion, you must first learn the principle of recursion."
 
Posts: 3197 | Location: Memphis, TN | Registered: August 23, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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