quote:

Originally posted by RichardC:
Why is 7.62 a daunting endeavor for a civilian shooter?

Other than what he mentioned, I don’t know what KSGM has in mind, but my response would be its much greater recoil and bigger, heavier guns. Sort of like the ferocious intolerable recoil, bigger guns, and lower magazine capacities of pistols chambered for 40 S&W.

When I joined the Army, the M14 was the individual soldier’s rifle. After the switch to the M16 that was lighter to carry and easier to shoot accurately, plus (later) held more rounds, I didn’t miss the M14 at all. (Not that I was in the combat arms, but there was a time when I relied on a rifle for possible defensive combat use. My somewhat unconventional unit had a number of M14 rifles, but after we scrounged M16s, we gave the M14s to some civilian contractors.)

I have several rifles chambered for 308/7.62, including a Springfield M1A, but if I were going to war as an ordinary grunt, an AR-15 chambered for 5.56 would be my weapon of choice.

And if anyone is going to scoff at the idea that a manly man can’t handle the recoil of a serious cartridge, that has been true of many perhaps less-than-manly men. Something I found interesting to learn not too long ago was that many of the vaunted German army soldiers in WWII were very poor marksmen because of their aversion to the recoil of the K98k rifle.

quote:

Why is 7.62 a daunting endeavor for a civilian shooter?

The ammo cost. If 7.62x51 or a 6mm thing is all-around undeniably better, but costs twice as much (or more), most folks will likely deem the juice not worth the squeeze.

If I was going to opt for a caliber in anything other than 5.56, I would look into an old established cartridge: The .243 Winchester. But it might take the larger, heavier AR 10 format so it may not be the benefit I was hoping for. That being a better cartridge in an M4 carbine format.
The 243 numbers:
Federal 75g VMax
3425 velocity at the muzzle. 200 yard zero. Drop at 300 is 5.4 inches.
Fiocchi Field Dynamic 100gr.
3200 FPS at the muzzle. 200 yard zero. Drop at 300 is also 5.4

The cartridge case for the 243 is based on the .308, IIRC. So would require the AR 10 size rifle?

quote:

Originally posted by YooperSigs:
If I was going to opt for a caliber in anything other than 5.56, I would look into an old established cartridge: The .243 Winchester. But it might take the larger, heavier AR 10 format so it may not be the benefit I was hoping for. That being a better cartridge in an M4 carbine format.
The 243 numbers:
Federal 75g VMax
3425 velocity at the muzzle. 200 yard zero. Drop at 300 is 5.4 inches.
Fiocchi Field Dynamic 100gr.
3200 FPS at the muzzle. 200 yard zero. Drop at 300 is also 5.4

The cartridge case for the 243 is based on the .308, IIRC. So would require the AR 10 size rifle?

Problem is you cannot buy .243 in any respectable quantity.

quote:

Originally posted by YooperSigs:
The cartridge case for the 243 is based on the .308, IIRC. So would require the AR 10 size rifle?

If such a question isn’t the absolute first that should be asked and answered when choosing a carbine cartridge, it’s certainly in the first three or so.

But to answer it, yes, the cartridge size determines such things as the magazine size, and 243 rounds would require the same size mag as 308 Winchester and others in its class, and that means an AR-10 type rifle.

S&B 6.5 creedmor is currently less costly than 308. It’s softer recoil and flatter shooting than 308, fits in common 308 mags, uses 308 bolt group. A 14” 6.5 creedmor with a short can, 1-x lpvo is a formidable general purpose rifle.

quote:

The cartridge case for the 243 is based on the .308, IIRC. So would require the AR 10 size rifle?

Yes and no. There are options out there like the Ruger SFAR that squeeze a .308 into a gun about the size of a regular AR-15. If they can do it with the .308 and the 6.5 Creedmoor, I don't see why they couldn't do it with the .243 as well. It's an interesting idea, and a cool cartridge...a bit of a barrel-burner though due to the velocities involved, and I imagine that would get even worse if you fired it full-auto.