Or other? This will be for sport shooting and possible - but highly unlikely as I have enough handguns for that - home defense, not military combat in the jungle, sandbox or Russia during rasputitsa. Their price tags of $500-ish are affordable.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: egregore,

for $500 you can build one that's how you want it.

Go with the Ruger. The 1 in 8 barrel twist is a nice thing to have.

Flip a coin between the Ruger or Smith, but don't overlook the prospect of "building" one. You can buy a completer lower and complete upper from PSA for $500ish and maybe get a configuration more suitable to your sense of style. There are a lot of deals on PSA's website, and they change every week.

Between the two? I like the Ruger. It comes with a 1/8 twist barrel while the Smith & Wesson has a 1/9 twist. Otherwise, I don’t think there will be a wide difference between the two. Both appear to come with winter trigger guards but the Ruger has a non-A2 pistol grip.

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Originally posted by RHINOWSO:

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S&W M&P15 Sport II

+1

I own both the Ruger and S&W Sport 2 and like both but can tell you that I have one Sport 2 with over 2,000 rds thru it without a single FTF or FTE...2k rounds may not be a lot of rounds thru an AR but it tells me its a reliable AR...Barrel twist for the type of 100 yards and closer plinking is not somethng I am highly concerned about but as others have said - it is worth reviewing/considering if you are going to be shootng longer distances wantng tighter groups...

Nothing against building your own BUT if you can purchase a complete system that has been tested and re-tested for functional reliability by that companies Quality Team and if anything goes wrong you can send the unit back for repair and you need not worry about hearng the story that the other companies lower is your problem, or vise-versa....well that is why I buy complete AR’s when the price is right....Just my 2 cents worth on this topic....Mark

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Originally posted by Bigboreshooter:
Flip a coin between the Ruger or Smith ...

Exactly what I thought looking them over. There are almost no external differences. One, I forget which, had a single finger groove on the pistol grip, the other was smooth. That was the only thing that jumped out and bit me.

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Originally posted by Bigboreshooter:
... but don't overlook the prospect of "building" one.

I don't have much interest in that. Also ...

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Originally posted by sigarmsp226:
Nothing against building your own BUT if you can purchase a complete system that has been tested and re-tested for functional reliability by that companies Quality Team and if anything goes wrong you can send the unit back for repair and you need not worry about hearng the story that the other companies lower is your problem, or vise-versa ...

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1:8 vs. 1:9 rifling twist

What does faster or slower rifling do? Heavier bullets? Longer ranges? Probably 98% of shooting is going to be at the 25-yard indoor range. There are some informal ranges in the nearby national forest but I don't think they go much past 100 yards. If a mob with pitchforks and torches should gather in the street outside my house, that distance is maybe 20 yards.

Egregore, I have the Ruger and I have been very pleased overall...quality, fit and finish is good and accuracy using the Vortex Spitfire 3X scope is excellent with various 55-62 grain ammo...the only thing I have experienced with it that some would find as a negative, is the rifle doesn't seem to like the Russian steel case ammo, at least the 55 grain Wolf stuff. It works like a charm with any of the brass case ammo, but with the Wolf steel, I have feeding issues...

Trigger was heavy and somewhat gritty (mil-spec)...I planned to change it out...but it has smoothed out enough that I put that on the back burner for now...

The buffer tube is Mil-spec if you want to change the stock over to something else in the future...the delta ring is a Ruger threaded design which makes it somewhat easier (not that it is really that difficult with the pull down version, especially if you have the tool or were born with three hands) to replace the handguard with something like a Magpul MOE so you can add rails if you like...

The Ruger OEM grip very good...as is the rear sight (a Ruger copy of the Magpul MBUS)...

Both Ruger and S&W have good customer service...

I don't think you would go wrong with either.

For this sort of AR, I wouldn’t worry too much about twist. 1:9 will happily stabilize most ammo you’ll encounter, which will be of the 55gr and 62gr variety. This includes most surplus or “military grade” stuff, such as M855 and M193. Where it becomes a factor is when trying to stabilize the heavier bullets used in competitions, where bullet weights can be in the 75-90gr range. At that point, you’d have a dedicated rifle, built specifically for that kind of shooting.

Personally, I’d buy the smith. I have an M&P 15x, and it’s been a great rifle. It’s a noticeable quality increase over my palmetto stuff, and I’d expect the sport ii to be similar. Of course, if I could get a sig m400 in that price range, I’d grab that in a heartbeat.

of the 2,
Smith

ruger uses some proprietary parts, (funky delta ring, funky front sight if you get a model with a FSB)

coming from some one in the business, both sell well,

I have sent a couple rugers back for repair, I have not sent any smiths,,

however, in all honesty, either will do what they are intended to do,

I imagine you can't really go wrong with either.
As an alternate, grabagun has had DPMS ORC Oracles for $389, just need to budget for sights/optic.

My brother in law & boss both have one & they shoot pretty well. My boss was getting roughly paper plate size groups at 100yds with just a red dot.

Just "build" it. Go online, watch the videos and it will walk you right through the process.

Comparable guns but even though the Ruger has a one in 8 twists compared to 1 and 9 for the Smith & Wesson, I do not like the proprietary Delta ring on Ruger. People have over tighten them and had some difficulties loosening them up. Prices are good on both.

I can’t tell the difference.

I own a 1st gen S&W Sport, Ruger AR-556, and DMPS Oracle 5.56. Quite frankly all three are amazing for what I have into them. All three will group better than my Colt 6920 in 5 and 10 shot groups. Picked up the Ruger and the Oracle on sale under $500 I think I paid $549 for the S&W way back when.

The Ruger has the worst trigger of the bunch even so the 1 in 8 hammer forged barrel seems to be a good one. The Ruger has the best grip of the bunch but I'm not really a fan of the ruger delta ring set up. I for one wished S&W would have used the 1 in 8 5R barrel on the 2nd gen Sport like they did on the 1st gen Sport. But I got to admit I mostly shoot 62 gr or lighter bullets and the 1 in 9 Oracle does fine for me even with some of my 63 Sierra handloads.

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delta ring

? (I don't know much about this kind of rifle.)

Egregore...it's the ring that holds the top and bottom halves of the clamshell handguard together and in place on the rifle...the handguard halves that have "tabs" that slip into the delta ring at the rear (next to the upper receiver). The handguard also has "tabs" on the front that slip into a circular or triangle piece behind the rant sight/gas block...

An all but the Ruger, the delta ring is spring loaded (flat springs) which takes a fairly hard pull to bring it back far enough to free and remove the handguard (they make a tool that makes it easier)...

On the Ruger, the delta ring is threaded so it screws in and out to clear the tabs on the handguard...if it's not lubed it can be a little hard to unthread...lithium grease works well...

It's not something you will have to often...it's just Ruger being different as Ruger is apt to do...to me, it's six of one...half dozen of the other...

Standard delta ring...



Ruger threaded delta ring...

Is that something you regularly remove to clean the gun?

Not unless you're completely disassembling it to clean it. The delta ring makes it easy to replace the handguards with others like them, or to access the exterior of the barrel and gas tube. None of which is needed for your basic clean'n'lube, of course.