quote:

Originally posted by tatortodd:
My Colt came with early generation MOE handguards, and I hated the handguards. Everything was FDE and I spent months looking for a FDE, M-LOK, aluminum handguard that fit with a fixed front site. I finally gave up, bought a black one, and painted it with Brownell's Alumahyde in FDE.

If you're still in the market... I believe they're discontinued now, but you might look for a used Troy Delta VTAC rail.



It's what I used on my fixed front sight carbine.

Thanks Rogue. I neglected to include timeline, but I did this Christmas 2019. I bought a black Leapers UTG PRO AR-15 Drop-In M-LOK Handguard and painted FDE with Brownell’s Alumahyde.

I've given mine the Krylon fusion touch once or twice. I have some alumahyde and some other stuff but haven't gotten around to trying it. The Fusion adheres really well if you strip the surface with a cleaner first.

Big fan of Aervoe camouflage paint. Bad thing is they discontinued it.

That sucks, anything better than krylon?

The paint pictured on the first page, with the boat on the can, is made by Rust-Oleum, I believe. That is what I have used, to camouflage a couple rifles. I can't say if it is better or worse than Krylon, Aervoe, or anything else. We're talking about spray painting, or otherwise altering, a rifle for the purpose of camouflage; just as long as you don't use satin or gloss, and you stay away from the spray paint that's like a dollar a can, you'll be fine. If it's a professional finish you're after, you need to look at having your rifle Cerakoted, or something similar. If the quality of a spray paint is determined by it's adhesion, as implied a couple posts up, then I'd say we need not worry much at all about the quality of the paint, as the paint wearing off merely adds to the camouflage effect and, at the risk of sounding pretentious, the "charm" of the rifle.

I think a common and understandable concern is whether or not the gun will come out "good". If camouflage is important to you, in your use-case, just give it a go; that's the way to figure it out. It may not come out good, but it'll probably get a bit better with use/wear, and it'll come out better next time, when you apply your lessons-learned. About the only thing to really pay attention to is the distance of the paint nozzle from the rifle, and the speed of your passes. These aspects will both vary, with different paints. You don't want to be so close/slow that paint goes on to thick or runs, and you don't want too be so far/fast that you get crap coverage or "dry spray".

This message has been edited. Last edited by: KSGM,

quote:

Originally posted by Rey HRH:
Supposedly, a black rifle makes you a target from far away.

This is exactly why I break up this AR's profile with a stainless barrel and a nickel finish receiver. Topped off with a coyote can cover, of course.

Fritz' comment and image, as well as the images posted above, of the black and tan guns, illustrate what may be the best approach. A uniformly applied camouflage pattern often isn't as effective as breaking the gun into larger contrasting chunks. A camouflage painted rifle always serves to subdue the gun's contrast against the environment, but it seldom helps the overall recognizable silhouette. A recent paint job of mine came out a bit too uniform, and perhaps a bit too dark. If it doesn't age well, I may go back over it with a lighter shade, and break it into big chunks.

An issue that many people don’t consider or aren’t aware of is that as the distance to the camouflaged item increases, the more the colors visually blend together into an average hue. There are photos of very conspicuous British troops during the Falklands war dressed in camouflage uniforms that appear to be a solid dark color, almost black, when viewed from a long distance. The uniforms did not contain black as part of their patterns, but the dark brown and medium shade of green blended together to overwhelm the small yellowish tan areas. The effect was no doubt enhanced because much of the background landscape in the area was a faded dead grass color, with no dark browns or greens.

US soldiers with extensive experience with the original “woodland” camouflage pattern of the 1980s (which does contain black) reported that was true of those uniforms as well, especially when the colors were not faded from repeated washing.

The best camouflage of equipment like rifles is what countless military snipers have used for over a century: loose fabric wraps or attached foliage whose color(s) closely match the backgrounds. Unfortunately if we’re not a sniper crawling into a stealthy position to pick off an unwary enemy, such measures are very inconvenient, and can interfere with the gun’s functioning if not applied properly.

As mentioned by KSGM, for the rest of us the approach used by fritz with its large blocks of color can be a useful approach. Of course, it helps if the colors are more likely to be found in nature than bright silver and black (even though the silver does match that particular background of dead grass pretty well ). His color scheme is, however, somewhat reminiscent of the “dazzle” pattern used by various navies for their warships at one time. That scheme was found to be less effective than uniform gray against the uniform colors of the sea and fog and was therefore generally discontinued, but if the background is not a uniform color, it can be effective.

This is one of my attempts in a similar vein.





If, however, I were really concerned about being detected in a rural setting with that rifle, I’d try to increase the effect with something like a sniper veil.

quote:

Originally posted by KSGM:

I think a common and understandable concern is whether or not the gun will come out "good". If camouflage is important to you, in your use-case, just give it a go; that's the way to figure it out.

I wasn't concerned out it looking "good," I was concerned about flagging myself as a wannabe tactical commando operator on the range especially when I'm wearing my affliction t-shirt (j/k about the t-shirt; I don't have any).

But when I get around to it, I do plan on practicing on cardboard first so I can work out a color scheme / plan.

I had some arts and crafts time this weekend. haha

I used the brownells aluma-hyde on the Mk12. I didn't have the balls to paint it. A friend of mine that paints alot of stuff did it for me.

And my 6.8

quote:

Originally posted by Ryanp225:
I had some arts and crafts time this weekend. haha

Looks great!

quote:

Originally posted by JonDaddy82:
a black rifle sticks out like a sore dick

Jeez.

Camo often consists of various hues of green, brown, and gray in an effort to hide the person/equipment in natural areas. Sometimes it works well, and as noted by Sigfreund, sometimes not so much. The various militaries have camo research capabilities well beyond civilians, sometimes knowing exactly where they are going, and yet they don't always nail it.

In my neck of the woods, the traditional camo might work well in forests and prairie/foothills transitions areas. Probably won't do squat in winter's snowy areas, eastern prairies after the summer brownout occurs, or the red-rock desert regions of the Colorado River basin. Maybe not so hot in urban areas, too. Urban areas where there might be a fair share of black, shiny metal things, gray, tan, blue, yellow, orange, red, green, or whatever. What's the best urban camo color combination -- for both equipment and clothing? And does one wear the same urban camo clothing to church, to the office, to Taco Bell, to a gas station....?

When we look at a person's need for self defense or to stop a threat, at least so far around here it's not occurring at a hiking trail head in the Collegiate Peaks. It's not in the ski lift lines at Vail. It's not while photographing elk in Estes Park. Think convenience stores, gas stations, big box retailers, traffic lights in rougher parts of town, churches, schools, and maybe even in your own neighborhood. Maybe a camo'd gun helps to stop a threat at the 7-Eleven, but more likely it's a person's ability to draw from concealment and place rounds on target in a quick and decisive manner.

If one buys into Red Dawn and Call of Duty, then a woodland camo (or whatever) AR15 is great. I'll pass, even though I'm in natural lands for a full day almost every week. Yeah, I have rifles with camo stocks, have some camo-accented clothing, have some rifle accessories in camo -- because I like the way some items look in camo. But I see no reason to camo coat stainless barrels, because they're consumable items in my book. I'll keep my black rifles black.

IMO put as much camo or as little camo as you want on firearms. If you like it, do it. If it gives you warm fuzzies, rattle can away. But IMO camo's practical benefits to civilians are pretty much nil.

quote:

but more likely it's a person's ability to draw from concealment and place rounds on target in a quick and decisive manner.

No argument there; that's not what this thread is about.

quote:

But I see no reason to camo coat stainless barrels, because they're consumable items in my book.

You often remind us that you're the guy who regularly shoots out barrels. Why do you shoot your AR15s so much, fritz? I know it's not to get better at defending yourself at the 7-Eleven, because that's not the piece you'd be carrying, drawing and deploying in a "quick and decisive manner". Do you shoot out barrels for fun, or do you shoot out barrels because you care about becoming more effective (lethal) with your AR15s?

quote:

But IMO camo's practical benefits to civilians are pretty much nil.

Are you LE? Military? Why would you impose limits on the "practical benefits" of militaristic weapon aspects to citizens?

quote:

I'll keep my black rifles black.

Was this remark sarcasm?: "This is exactly why I break up this AR's profile with a stainless barrel and a nickel finish receiver. Topped off with a coyote can cover, of course." You seemed as though you were a civilian caring about camouflage, in that post.

The guy that shoots tens of thousands of rounds is doing it for a reason. What is your reason? If it's not because you want to be more lethal with your AR15, for your job, or because that's how you interpret the 2nd Amendment, as a citizen, then it must just be for fun or "pretend". If it's not for pretend, camouflage is certainly relevant. If it is for pretend, then why not go the whole nine, and paint your rifle? Hell, you're already spending thousands and thousands on the ammo, to facilitate your tactical training that, in your opinion, has no practical benefit to civilians. Help me understand.

It is not uncommon for me to share SIGforum discussions with my wife. She's a damn smart woman, and I value her input. Her input on my preceding post was that I sounded a little bit like an argumentative, confrontational asshole. I didn't feel that way, when I wrote it, so I clearly didn't write it well. My apologies to fritz, and other thread participants.
I am going to add a brief part two, to my tangent, to clarify my attitude. I know we avoid getting into political discussions where they don't belong, but it'll be brief, and this is the most relevant place for it.
Fritz ruffled my patriotic feathers. I believe it's extremely important that we're honest with ourselves, each other, and with those who would oppose us, when considering our rights as protected by the Second Amendment. There are very practical and very important benefits(reasons) to camouflage a rifle, as a civilian(citizen). When you boil it down, the reason a citizen would camouflage his rifle is the same reason he ought to have unlimited access to military rifles; is the same reason the 2nd exists at all. We would do well to avoid imposing limitations on ourselves. The implications, IMO, of saying a civilian has nothing to gain by camouflaging his weapon, are bigger than many may realize, at a glance. As fritz said, if you want to camo it: cool; if you don't: whatever. I understand folks may opt to avoid the practice, as it affects resale value of what may be potential investment firearms. Maybe they adopt the attitude that they'll do it if/when it becomes more immediately relevant. Whatever your reason is for painting, or for not painting, don't convince yourself, or others that it doesn't have a place in our practices as gun owning Americans. Thanks for listening. I'll create another thread, in the gun control forum, where this conversation can continue, if anyone cares to discuss the matter further. Again, my apologies to fritz, who's input I appreciate, and to other forum members, for derailing a thread that was likely meant to be cool pictures of camo guns.
*Don't misinterpret this as a fiery passion for spray painting rifles. That's not the point.

quote:

Originally posted by Rey HRH:

But I have to ask: why? Is it just proof of concept and that you know you can do it? I don’t hunt but that’s not for hunting, right?

quote:

Originally posted by KSGM:
Thanks for listening. I'll create another thread, in the gun control forum, where this conversation can continue, if anyone cares to discuss the matter further.

I look forward to that thread. This thread wasn't primarily to get pics of spray painted guns although that would be nice. But whether it really is a thing.

Over the years, I've been mentally considering the scenario you've described. I don't consider myself a wild-eyed lunatic but for decades before Covid came, I was prepared with N-95 masks, sanitizing wipes, nitrile gloves, and emergency toilet paper among other things. It paid off especially when I saw sanitizing wipes start selling for 40 cents a wipe instead of 0.4 cents a wipe when I bought them. Back to your scenario, I've considered my contribution to be prolonging my usefulness as cannon fodder for as much as I can.

I paint mine all the time but haven't cammo'd any yet.
I plan to and have some lowers yet to do.
I only use Cerakote though although I have used Gun-Kote on some internals.