Non NFA SBR - Franklin Armory Reformation

January 23, 2018, 09:34 AM

quote:
Originally posted by smithnsig:
It’s straight land or lands. It is for close in defense, 25-50 yard max. A gimmick to drum up interest. It can’t be anything else.

Now suppose you could get helical cuts on some 556. Probably be more expensive than the stamp.

This is my understanding. Straight lands going down the barrel. Short range toy at best.

January 23, 2018, 09:42 AM

Fundman

Not speculation anymore. It's official. Straight lands and groves with no spin. 3-4 inch group at 50 yards.

January 23, 2018, 09:44 AM

RogueJSK

quote:
Originally posted by Fundman:
Not speculation anymore. It's official. Straight lands and groves with no spin.

Yep. Recoil was the first to get the scoop.

http://www.recoilweb.com/frank...revealed-133042.html

quote:
The innovators at Franklin Armory took a unique approach to solve the problem of a “shortish” rifle that would require no tax stamp in certain areas or to give shooters who cross state lines an easy option to take their rifles with them by adapting straight-cut lands and grooves.

That means that the barrel imparts no spin on the projectile. According to ATF’s tech branch, this means that the Reformation is “not a rifle”. The concept has been around since match lock guns and early shotguns; however they were pushed aside as gun makers continued to innovate and spiraled rifling improved along with bullet construction.

Those of us who are rifle shooters know that the system of lands and grooves within a rifle’s barrel make our projectiles faster and more accurate. Longer or heavier bullets crave a faster twist rate for stabilization in flight.

Franklin’s Reformation does not offer this.

Neither does your handgun for the most part and with the Reformation we aren’t exactly talking thousand yard shots or even 500 yard shots. This was intended for CQB range. Maybe out to 100 yards. With 5.56mm NATO ammunition, we were able to achieve 3 to 4 MOA.

However, 5.56 will not be what the company is focusing on with the initial launch of this firearm. The initial intent will be 300 Blackout. The 5.56 guns were built to take advantage of the cheaper ammunition options in order to make the experience of the Reformation to shooters at Media/Industry Day at the Range.

When Franklin starts shipping the Reformation it will be in 300 Blackout

Franklin Armory is also apparently working on a proprietary projectile design that will allow greater accuracy with these non-rifled barrels:

January 23, 2018, 10:34 AM

RHINOWSO

quote:
Originally posted by Fundman:
Not speculation anymore. It's official. Straight lands and groves with no spin. 3-4 inch group at 50 yards.

That's a whole lotta "meh".

January 23, 2018, 10:43 AM

sigfreund

No spin stabilizing, eh? Absolutely ridiculous.

Franklin Armory has indeed attracted my attention, but I’ll be polite and leave it at that.

On the other hand, it will be interesting to see how the fin-stabilized bullet concept works out.

January 23, 2018, 10:50 AM

LVJD

Way better off just getting a pistol brace or just an SBR.

January 23, 2018, 10:52 AM

myrottiety

quote:
Originally posted by LVJD:
Way better off just getting a pistol brace or just an SBR.

This. I see this thing as nothing more than a range toy. I don't really have a use for it.

But to their marketing team: Well done. You certainly earned your dollar.

January 23, 2018, 11:05 AM

Jus228

Well then, that's the end of that. No one is going to want that. Stupid. Even for those that can't get SBRs but insist on a small package better off with a bullpup.

January 23, 2018, 11:31 AM

RHINOWSO

quote:
Originally posted by Jus228:
Well then, that's the end of that. No one is going to want that. Stupid. Even for those that can't get SBRs but insist on a small package better off with a bullpup.

Yup, X95 or AUG is far superior.

January 23, 2018, 11:38 AM

RogueJSK

quote:
Originally posted by LVJD:
Way better off just getting a pistol brace or just an SBR.

Agreed. This is interesting as yet another creative bypass of the NFA, but little else. Unlike some of the other workarounds, such as pistol braces, it has no real practical usefulness.

Like bump stocks, it's a gimmick for those that want to spend money on a toy to thumb their noses at the ATF.

But as stated earlier: Kudos to their PR team. I suspect their booth at SHOT was mobbed this morning.

January 23, 2018, 11:44 AM

cslinger

So it’s an assault musket?

January 23, 2018, 11:55 AM

RogueJSK

Holy crap... Retail price is $2095.

But don't worry... You ain't gotta spend the $200 on a tax stamp!

Hell, you could build two good SBRs or braced pistols for that.

I guess they've got to make back all that money spent on marketing and musket research.

They probably recognize that few folks will actually be interested in buying one of these, so they have to make maximum profit off each unit sold.

Or perhaps they're planning to use the massive profits from each rifle to try to fund the R&D and production setup for their fin-stabilized ammo. Sort of a "chicken and egg" effect... Gotta sell lots of the new guns to fund the new ammo, but gotta create the new ammo to make the new guns work well.

I suspect PSA will start cranking out straight land 11.5" barrels for $85 and complete straight land barreled uppers for $199 next week.

January 23, 2018, 12:37 PM

SigM4

quote:
Originally posted by RogueJSK:
I suspect PSA will start cranking out straight land 11.5" barrels for $85 and complete straight land barreled uppers for $199 next week.

Pair that up with some reman Freedom Munitions fin stabilized ammo and you've got yourself a winner.

January 23, 2018, 12:54 PM

smpsmp

Read the article on recoil this morning since I was searching for the answer again. Straight rifling, no thanks. Add in the price tag and definitely no. Thats enough money for a bcm or DD factory sbr, plus stamp, plus geissele ssa and probably some left over. Same thing with a brace or buy a bullpup.

January 23, 2018, 12:55 PM

arabiancowboy

I'll take a different approach than most of you. I'm glad to see this weapon, might buy future iterations, and welcome further innovation. Also, the "3-4 MOA" was with 5.56 not 300 BLK; a larger bullet might achieve better accuracy.

The NFA restriction on SBRs is ridiculous and I welcome legally sanctioned exploitation of loopholes to counter this stupid unjust law. I liked the braced pistol approach, and braces have only improved in looks and function since the introduction of the first one a few years ago. Who knows what this will develop into 3 years from now?

If they start selling short barreled 300 blackout uppers I can drop onto any lower (for < $1.5k) I might be interested enough to buy.

January 23, 2018, 01:03 PM

Sigolicious

I wonder how much these will have an effect on the draconian states like CA, MA, NJ, MD, or NY? How many of their laws are written to cover "rifles" and "pistols" but not "firearms"? This may be a wolf in sheeps clothing for them. Even if it's sparkle wear for the rest of us.

January 23, 2018, 01:10 PM

IndianaBoy

Wow...... Just.... wow....

January 23, 2018, 01:43 PM

lkdr1989

So they're going retro-18th Century with a twist?

January 23, 2018, 01:48 PM

Il Cattivo

Well, without a twist, actually.

January 23, 2018, 02:43 PM

P220 Smudge

NFA needs to go away. It was bad legislation when it was passed, the primary chance to review it at SCOTUS was bungled, and we've been saddled with some really bad, stupid laws ever since.

How about more stuff like this and more clarification letters being requested until we're left with an incredibly narrow definition of what's "legal" to own, instead of focusing our efforts as a community on putting some leverage on our legislators who do little for us, but everything for themselves? Sounds great to me. That, instead of silly gotcha games between us the and government with them doing all but saying "yeah, we really don't want you armed in any meaningful way" and us all but saying "that's great, we don't give a shit."