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Originally posted by SummersAtTheLake:


From my limited knowledge it appears that many people run steel cased ammo through their AK's and for the most part there are not many problems...I've never ran steel cased ammo thought my DD ARs.

Wasn't the AK designed to fire steel-cased ammo as that was all the Soviets made?

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Originally posted by bionic218:

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Originally posted by SummersAtTheLake:

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Originally posted by bionic218:
Good job, Summers. AK mods are half the fun. (The other half is $4 a box ammo)uhh

I have the MI gas rail on mine, and I'm very happy with fit, finish, and function. Their stuff is expensive, but IMHO - worth it.

Somebody local had those in stock if you want one off the shelf. Black Rifle LLC in Columbia Mo maybe?

Best of luck with the new rifle, and enjoy!

From my limited knowledge it appears that many people run steel cased ammo through their AK's and for the most part there are not many problems...I've never ran steel cased ammo thought my DD ARs.

I can't speak to your model specifically, but my WASR actually prefers steel case. I've had excellent results with Hot Shot (Ukrainian) and Brown Bear/Monarch/Barnaul (Russian)

Believe it or not, my best groups were with Monarch - which is just Academy's house brand of Brown Bear (I believe)

I got a bunch of Monarch steel case and some brass case in my deal so that will be the first ammo down range when I get this back together.
I just struck a deal on a Magpul Zhukov furniture set...they were taken off a new AK so like new for about 1/2 the price. I prefer the shorter handguard..at least today anyway

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I shoot almost nothing but steel cased ammo through my AKs, with nary a hiccup. They were designed for steel cased ammo. Mine like Golden Tiger FMJ the best out of the cheap steel-cased plinking ammo, so that makes up most of my stockpile.

I use Federal Fusion soft point (brass cased), Hornady SST hollow point (steel cased), and Ulyanovsk 8M3 hollow point (steel cased) for hog hunting.

The Zhukov stock is fantastic. Superior to the standard AK stock, and the ability to fold is handy.

quote:

Originally posted by SummersAtTheLake:
I prefer the shorter handguard..at least today anyway

The longer Zhukov handguard was a great addition to my AK-103k. I like being able to get my support hand further out. Allows me to use a stance that's closer to the one I use on ARs, which I shoot with my support arm fully extended.

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Originally posted by RogueJSK:
<SNIP>
The longer Zhukov handguard was a great addition to my AK-103k. I like being able to get my support hand further out. Allows me to use a stance that's closer to the one I use on ARs, which I shoot with my support arm fully extended.

Thanks for posting that RogueJSK, It looks really good. I've got the longer hand-guard too but haven't put it on as I'll either have to R&R everything in front of the lower hand-guard retainer or cut the retainer off in order to get it to fit ... now that I've seen your's I know that's what I want, and since I'll probably never sell it anyway it won't matter.

quote:

Originally posted by RogueJSK:
I shoot almost nothing but steel cased ammo through my AKs, with nary a hiccup. They were designed for steel cased ammo. Mine like Golden Tiger FMJ the best out of the cheap steel-cased plinking ammo, so that makes up most of my stockpile.

I use Federal Fusion soft point (brass cased), Hornady SST hollow point (steel cased), and Ulyanovsk 8M3 hollow point (steel cased) for hog hunting.

The Zhukov stock is fantastic. Superior to the standard AK stock, and the ability to fold is handy.

quote:

Originally posted by SummersAtTheLake:
I prefer the shorter handguard..at least today anyway

The longer Zhukov handguard was a great addition to my AK-103k. I like being able to get my support hand further out. Allows me to use a stance that's closer to the one I use on ARs, which I shoot with my support arm fully extended.

Nice set up there Rogue and I can definitely see the advantages of the longer hand guard.

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Originally posted by kimberkid:
I've got the longer hand-guard too but haven't put it on as I'll either have to R&R everything in front of the lower hand-guard retainer or cut the retainer off in order to get it to fit ... now that I've seen your's I know that's what I want, and since I'll probably never sell it anyway it won't matter.

I had the same hesitation when I first bought the longer handguard, about cutting off the handguard retainer. It was worth the plunge, though.

And if you decide you want to go back later, there are bolt-on handguard retainers that you can put back on easily.

Midwest Industries or UltiMAK Rail? MagPul references UltiMAK on their website but I can't see much difference.

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Originally posted by RogueJSK:
And if you decide you want to go back later, there are bolt-on handguard retainers that you can put back on easily.

I didn't know that! It's coming off on Thursday (my day off) if I have time!

I've got a UltiMAK Rail in my spare parts box too but I've also got a railed top cover ... can't think of who makes it but it wasn't cheap, had to buy their locking button too. I didn't see the point in that until I put it on and it was wobbly, bought theirs and it was pretty solid.

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I've got a UltiMAK Rail in my spare parts box too but I've also got a railed top cover

FYI, the railed gas tubes (like Ultimak and MI) are set up as such to give true co-witness to most popular red dot (with no riser).

They do get front heavy with that set-up, at least mine is, but I don't mind it a bit.

Unless you have one of the fancier railed top covers from someone like Texas Weapon Systems or Parabellum Armament, the Ultimak will likely provide a sturdier and stabler optic mount.

Railed dust covers are notoriously unstable, especially cheap ones. The fancier ones provide multiple attachment points, including anchoring to the rear sight base.

"Pretty solid" isn't enough, if you want repeatable accuracy.

And luckily, the Magpul handguard is designed to work alongside the Ultimak. I have an Ultimak on the rifle I posted above.

quote:

Originally posted by RogueJSK:
Unless you have one of the fancier railed top covers from someone like Texas Weapon Systems or Parabellum Armament, the Ultimak will likely provide a sturdier and stabler optic mount.

Railed dust covers are notoriously unstable, especially cheap ones. The fancier ones provide multiple attachment points, including anchoring to the rear sight base.

"Pretty solid" isn't enough, if you want repeatable accuracy.

And luckily, the Magpul handguard is designed to work alongside the Ultimak. I have an Ultimak on the rifle I posted above.

I saw the Texas Weapon Systems and Parabellum Armament top covers and they are pricey but even if the prices were the same is the ultimak don't think I would go that direction

Since you have a rail on the side of the receiver, don't overlook mounting options that use it. I'm a fan of RS Regulate, Midwest Industries has a good reputation, and there are doubtless others out there.

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Originally posted by Il Cattivo:
Since you have a rail on the side of the receiver, don't overlook mounting options that use it. I'm a fan of RS Regulate, Midwest Industries has a good reputation, and there are doubtless others out there.

My Magpul furniture should be here in a couple of days.....I had looked at the RE Regulate beiefly...how sturdy are the optic mounts?

RS Regulate mounts are very sturdy. I had a 1st Gen RS Regulat mount on my AK-103k prior to its current configuration. Here's an old photo:



It put the extra optic weight over the middle of the rifle, which is nice. And they allow for iron sight cowitness. But they're a bit bulky, with lots of extra bits to get hung up on things. Not as low profile or streamlined as something like an Ultimak with a micro red dot. You also have to remove them in order to break the rifle down, though that's not as big of a deal because they do a good job of returning to zero.

I still recommend an Ultimak, as long as you're using a lightweight optic like a micro red dot, to prevent it from feeling overly front-heavy. I have similar Ultimak with micro red dot setups on my Mini-14. (I'm planning to add one to my M1A in the near future too.)

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But they're a bit bulky, with lots of extra bits to get hung up on things. Not as low profile or streamlined as something like an Ultimak with a micro red dot.

True, but only to a degree IMHO. The newer mounts don't seem terribly bulky in general, although they're pretty much bulkier than the Ultimak by definition. The 'multiple parts' aspect of the mount makes it easier to center the sight on the barrel regardless of what weirdness there may or may not be in the dimensions of the receiver. But yeah, we are talking multiple parts.

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You also have to remove them in order to break the rifle down, though that's not as big of a deal because they do a good job of returning to zero.

Not necessarily true, depending on the model. I've got red dots on RS set ups on a Yugo and a converted Saiga that co-witness as well as the (very slightly canted on the Yugo) sights will allow so long as I don't use a red dot that stands terribly tall. Even so, there's still room enough to open, slide out and reinstall the dust cover without unmounting the optic.

The only thing I'd warn the OP about is not a problem unless the OP is interested in a folding stock. Left-side folders will foul the mount for sure. Right-side folders may work, but it may be impossible to mount or remove the the optic and/or mount without removing folding stock hinge first. OP's mileage may vary, of course.

Still leaning towards the Ultimak but not ruling others out right now. As far as optics..my plan is to start with the TRS25 which came with my RAS. If I do purchase another it will probably be a mini/small red dot.

One thing that I am noticing in following AK forums is that many AK owners don't have a problem with using TRS25, Primary Arms, Vortex, and other supposedly "lower end" red dots.....I'm seeing very few "buy once/cry once" discussions.

Personally, I don't use my AK for defensive purposes. The most use it sees outside the range is the occasional short range shot on a hog. It's mainly just a fun range toy. And red dots like Primary Arms or Bushnell are just fine for range toys.

Not every rifle needs a $500+ Aimpoint. Just your serious defensive rifles.

I have a number of Aimpoints/Leupolds/etc., but most of my long guns have "cheap" optics on them.

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Originally posted by RogueJSK:
Personally, I don't use my AK for defensive purposes. The most use it sees outside the range is the occasional short range shot on a hog. It's mainly just a fun range toy. And red dots like Primary Arms or Bushnell are just fine for range toys.

Not every rifle needs a $500+ Aimpoint. Just your serious defensive rifles.

I have a number of Aimpoints/Leupolds/etc., but most of my long guns have "cheap" optics on them.

My AK will be a fun gun also.
I went to an AR classifieds forum/site a bit ago and someone had just posted a LNIB Ultimak M2-B for $77.00 shipped and I jumped on it.

I'll end up having $174.50 in the Ultimak, Magpul MOE Furniture and Zhukov folding stock delivered to my door.

Next purchase will be a muzzle brake and this is another topic I know little about,

quote:

Originally posted by SummersAtTheLake:
I had looked at the RE Regulate beiefly...how sturdy are the optic mounts?

I'm sorry, I flaked on answering this earlier. You'd think it would be a bit unsteady because (1) it's a tower of sorts, and (2) it's bolted together in the middle as well as being bolted around the optic. So far the mount on the Saiga isn't moving after simply being bolted together. I put some pink Loctite on the mount on the Yugo just because, and have had no problems with it yet. About the only thing I can't tell you is what happens if, say, you toss it in the back of your vehicle and drive a few hundred miles.

The lower the mount is and the lighter the optic is, the less the whole arrangement should move around.

I'm sorry I can't tell you about muzzle brakes, but I seem to have some sort of pernicious dislike of them. The Krebs 4-prong flash suppressor is pretty cool, though, and comes with enough notches for the spring loaded pin on the front sight tower to give you a good fit.

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Originally posted by Il Cattivo:

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Originally posted by SummersAtTheLake:
I had looked at the RE Regulate beiefly...how sturdy are the optic mounts?

I'm sorry, I flaked on answering this earlier. You'd think it would be a bit unsteady because (1) it's a tower of sorts, and (2) it's bolted together in the middle as well as being bolted around the optic. So far the mount on the Saiga isn't moving after simply being bolted together. I put some pink Loctite on the mount on the Yugo just because, and have had no problems with it yet. About the only thing I can't tell you is what happens if, say, you toss it in the back of your vehicle and drive a few hundred miles.

The lower the mount is and the lighter the optic is, the less the whole arrangement should move around.

I'm sorry I can't tell you about muzzle brakes, but I seem to have some sort of pernicious dislike of them. The Krebs 4-prong flash suppressor is pretty cool, though, and comes with enough notches for the spring loaded pin on the front sight tower to give you a good fit.

I'm not really looking for the "cool" factor in a muzzle brake and may have been wrong in my assumption that a different style (other than the slash cut/stock brake) would reduce recoil. I just watched several youtube videos for comparisons and the cheap stock brakes had noticeably less muzzle rise that other more expensive designs....one comment was that the Russians must have know what they were doing