I know nothing about the round, but am intrigued. Where’s a good site to get the basics?... well obviously here, but don’t feel like y’all have to type out a paper on it if there’s a good website already.

Oh, dear. Do a search for the Grendel and either Arfcom or the AK Files. Be prepared for reams of meticulously documented "Ford vs. Chevy" type arguments involving the 6.8 SPC II.

Lol. Nothing personal, but I’d rather stay away from AR15.com. Too many people that think they’re operators. I went down the 6.8 road awhile back. The Grendel just sounds impressive, on the interweb anyway.

My deer rifle is a 22" 6.5 Grendel. I bought the upper from grendel hunter

It will put 5 rounds under an inch, hit with a lot more force than 5.56 or 300 blackout and reach a good distance.

I have not chronographed my barrel yet.

Another cool thing is wolf makes a round for it at about $.25 a pop.

Impressive^^^. Frankly, the cartridge is just one I’d never concerned myself with. After investigation it appears I need to look into it, I don’t hunt... other than hogs when given a chance. Something for longer range looks fun.

6.5 Grendel forum, there is a good bunch of tinkerers, SMEs and reloaders there. It's where I go for info. The beyond 5.56 section of M4 Carbine.net, but you would need to search for 6.5 Grendel threads. I'd also go to the Alexander Arms website. Mr Alexander actually designed the cartridge.

Heres a little overview from Alexander Arms .

As mentioned the 65grendel forum is a good source.
I'm on there but it gets boring for me.
Like most every other forum other than here.
I have two more ARs to build & the Grendel is one.
I have a Colt Competition upper & lower built (minus the bolt) awaiting the barrel assembly.
I just can't make up my mind as to what configuration I want to live with.

quote:

Originally posted by dry-fly:
I went down the 6.8 road awhile back. The Grendel just sounds impressive, on the interweb anyway.

Since you have a 6.8, you already know a number of things about the 6.5 -- ballpark muzzle energy, case capacity, magazine capacity issues. As with any chambering which uses roughly the same case capacity, then necks the case down to different bore sizes, there are relative differences between muzzle velocity/energy based on barrel length. Furthermore, there are differences in bullet types & weights available between 6.8 and 6.5.

It comes down to what you want to do with the 6.5 Grendel. Depending on your goals, and the configuration of your rifle build, the Grendel may or may not make sense. You should go into a purchase or build with a defined purpose and a well thought out budget. Assuming you're looking at a longer range rifle, all of its components need to be up to the task. So quality optics are in the mix.

Right now there are at least four commercial chamberings of increased case capacity AR-15 platform loads -- 6.8 SPC, 6.5 Grendel, 22 Nosler, and 224 Valkerie. All have their strengths and weaknesses. Firm up your longer range goals, then run some ballistics on the various rounds.

Very good advice Fritz, others too. I appreciate it. I’ll check out the mentioned sources.

Also look up data for the 264 LBC. It's the same round with the neck length just enough different that Les Baer doesn't have to pay Grendel royalties. You reload it with the same dies and data as the Grendel.......

I know you want to avoid arf, but there is usually good data in the other variants section and has more frequent traffic. But yes, there does seem to be much more banter and some heavily vested members. LRRPF52 is on there and 65forums, has done a lot of testing, and from what I can tell or remember, has a lot of experience with it and other rounds.

Personally, I own both 6.5 & 6.8, but have only shot about 50 rounds through the 6.5 and maybe 75 through the 6.8. I like them both, and will decide which to keep once the barrels get worn in, plus a few other factors.

Keep in mind, Fritz sent you in the right direction, but what is your desires for the rifle? Hunting? Longer range shooting steel? Suppressed/SBR? How many rounds to you plan on putting down range? And lastly, do you reload?

Both of mine are 16", as I intended them to be whitetail guns good to 250yds, for hunting up north. I bought the 6.8 as an upper from PSA with the Hammer forged FN barrel and it is surprisingly accurate thus far with factory Hornady 120gr SST, not so much with the American Gunner 110gr BTHP Match. I have yet to try the BLACK or Full Boar loads.

With the 6.5, it's proven most accurate with Hornady's 123gr ELD-M BLACK and less so with the 123gr SST. I haven't reloaded for either cartridge so far, but rumor has it, Sportsman's Warehouse is going to start carrying the American Gunner line in 6.5 Grendel. However, I bought a cheap BCA barrel from Primary Arms on sale for less than $100, and it's been pretty good too. Once I get the chance hopefully over Thanksgiving break, I'll do some "official" accuracy testing at 100yds.

Hunting applications, even just pigs, you will likely want to choose different projectiles, I'd toss in Barnes TTSX in either flavor. Being said, whenever I've gone looking, the 6.5 projectiles seem to be gobbled up by the Creedmoor folks, where there is a lot of options for the 6.8, using a lot of (not all) of the .277" diameter projectiles.

Unfortunately I do not reload, but it’s in my future. Mostly this would be for long range steel fun, assuming Cobra21 ever gets his hand healed to take me . It would be used for hogs when given the chance. Definitely would be suppressed. If velocity is still high enough, I’d love a 14.5” barrel vs. a 16. Thats only 1.5” so I can’t imagine it would be that much worse.

Thank you all again for the pointers

quote:

Originally posted by dry-fly:
Mostly this would be for long range steel fun
If velocity is still high enough, I’d love a 14.5” barrel vs. a 16. Thats only 1.5” so I can’t imagine it would be that much worse.

A lot depends upon your definition of "long range steel". Even with an AR, I consider that to be a minimum of 500 yards, but more likely 600 yards and more. At such distances, the muzzle velocity from every inch of barrel length becomes very important.

The Grendel doesn't push a 123 grain bullet very fast, and it requires some barrel length to get it up to speeds that make drop reasonable at distance. Furthermore, at pokey speeds one loses much of the advantage of the 123's solid wind drift capabilities.

I don't get your desire for a 14.5" barrel, as it needs a pinned FH, which still makes it 16" long. IMO a FH does absolutely nothing for a rifle intended to bang steel, therefore a 16" with no muzzle device is a superior option. Nevertheless, a 14-16" Grendel isn't optimal for a long distance rifle. 20-24" barrel? Now we're talking.

I'd have to run numbers again, but I recall that a 14-16" Grendel offers no practical advantage to my 20" AR using .223 Hornady 73 ELD ammo -- pretty much at any distance reasonable for an AR-15 platform. A 20" Grendel -- sure, the ballistics work, but only after 500 yards. Even then, the Grendel has superior wind drift, but really suffers in drop.

If you intend to shoot steel at 200-400 yards, then your 6.8 SPC with a decent bullet is at least equal, and maybe better than a 6.5. Furthermore, neither one will offer much of anything besides more expensive ammo than a 223 AR with decent ammo.

I was pondering the 6.5 Grendel several weeks ago for a possible build. I ran across this Guns America article that provides a comparison of several calibers. The ballistics info I’ve found make it look like a decent round. The article seems to think the 18” barrel may be decent but the 24” is probably superior. My BIL has an AR in 6.5 Grendel and is very pleased with the accuracy and it is a 24” barrel.

Thanks again Fritz for the insight. My thoughts on the 14.5” Barrel are because of suppressor use, it would be an SBR so no pinned brake. I’m a Class III FFL . Basically having all SBR’s at this point, the thought of something 16 PLUS inches long just sounds like a pain to haul around. That’s just me though, I’ve never owned an AR with a 16” or longer barrel. As far as distance goes, I can’t imaging shooting past 400-450. I seriously doubt I could hit anything at that range! BTW, I no longer own the 6.8. This would be taking that role.

I was researching with the intent to build a Grendel for banging steel at 500-800 yards.

What I found was that for the cost, and if you don't care that much about the energy delivered on target, 223 Rem with 73gr ELD bullets is close enough in wind and elevation that the additional cost of the Grendel wasn't worth it for me.


6.5 Grendel needs some barrel length if you care about staying above Mach 1.1 for long range use.


Now if you are building a gun for 500 yard steel and 200 yard deer, then a 14.5 or 16 Grendel may just fit the bill.


I am still leaning towards 223 with heavy bullets but I am looking at the 224 Valkryie as well.

quote:

Originally posted by dry-fly:
Thanks again Fritz for the insight. My thoughts on the 14.5” Barrel are because of suppressor use, it would be an SBR so no pinned brake. I’m a Class III FFL . Basically having all SBR’s at this point, the thought of something 16 PLUS inches long just sounds like a pain to haul around. That’s just me though, I’ve never owned an AR with a 16” or longer barrel. As far as distance goes, I can’t imaging shooting past 400-450. I seriously doubt I could hit anything at that range! BTW, I no longer own the 6.8. This would be taking that role.

It would work well for this role.

quote:

Originally posted by dry-fly:
..the thought of something 16 PLUS inches long just sounds like a pain to haul around.

My competition ARs are suppressed, with 18" and 20" heavy barrels. I have no issues moving in, out, and around barriers with them. I have no issues walking & hiking hundreds of yards between stages in precision/tactical matches. I am considering getting my 16" suppressed upper in condition for a specific tactical match to save weight. But this is for a two-gun match where I'm carrying both a precision bolt action and an AR at the same time. Right now almost 30 pounds of rifles slung while moving between stages, and starting each stage with one rifle slung and the other at port-of-arms.

We all have our preferences for rifle configurations. I feel the webz statements of rifles being too long for maneuvering is often from keyboard commandos. I shoot a suppressed 26" barrel bolt gun in PRS matches, and PRS matches often require a lot of movement between firing positions, while under tight time limits.

A 14-16" Grendel will work for your intermediate distance steel targets. And it should do quite well with 123 grain match ammo. I just don't think an SBR is the most effective use of the chambering. At your stated distances, a 16-18" .223 AR with a heavier match bullet will work just as well.

Very good. I like what your saying, I just know for a fact that I would not be shooting out past 450 yards.. and that’s a stretch because I’ve never done it yet. I don’t want to neuter the round by using a 14.5” barrel, but honestly I wouldn’t go past 16”. Just being realistic for myself here.