Hi all,

As a result of this thread, I've been doing a lot of research on 1-4x/1-6x LPV optics in the $500-$1000 range lately. Thanks again for all your input. I have a few questions about reticles on LPV optics:

1. When it comes to illuminated reticles, does anyone find green easier for your eye to pick up than red? When I look at gas station electronic signs, the green numbers always stand out much better to me than red. I'm sure this is a personal thing.

2. Given either a 50m or 200m zero (on a 5.56 AR-15), the rifle will obviously have mechanical offset issues at close range (0-25m). Are there any reticle designs that you've found work better to deal with this? Do some reticles have sort of a built-in holdover to handle mechanical offset that allow for ease of use? I'd think that would be important when shooting close targets.

3. Realistically, how important is having a bright reticle that you can see the illumination in bright daylight? Under that circumstances does not having a true "daylight bright" reticle a problem?

4. What do you personally look for in a reticle to be used on a LPV optic? After looking at a bunch, I think I really prefer a non-crosshair type, just something more simple with basic ballistic drops and/or ranging indicators. The "circle-dot", "horseshoe-dot" and "segmented-circle" reticles seem to work well with my eyes.

Thanks for the additional data!

Chris

Some thoughts:

People here hate the expression “established science,” but it is an established fact that the human eye is more sensitive to green light than red. I’m also convinced, though, that a large part of picking up a reticle quickly when mounting the gun is what we’ve conditioned ourselves to see. I have numerous sights with red dots or other illuminated reticles and have never had any problem seeing red. I might prefer green, but the sights I like aren’t available with green illumination. And of course there are times when we don’t want to be overwhelmed with the illumination, regardless of the color. On the other hand, if we accustom ourselves to looking for and using the illumination, we need to be able to pick it up and see it clearly. I don’t want it too bright, but unless it’s part of a nonilluminated reticle, it definitely must be bright enough.

Sight offset is something I’m very accustomed to dealing with and teaching because so much of the shooting I’m concerned about is at close distances. With a red dot like the Aimpoint CompML3, these are the aiming offsets I use: 25 yards +1.2"; 15 yards + 1.7"; 7 yards +2.4". How important that is obviously depends on what type of shooting one intends. If it’s to hit a BG’s center of mass in a home defense situation, does it matter which shirt button we hit? If, however, one anticipates dealing with a hostage taker with half his head as a target, it becomes extremely important.

How shooters deal with required offsets either up or down also varies. Some prefer the traditional EOTech circle/dot because the bottom edge of the circle can be used for close range aiming. As we know, reticles with multiple hold-over dots are popular as well. Except for shooting with a precision rifle, though, I personally am not a fan of such aiming aids. In addition to being less suitable for fast, close range engagements, the aiming aid dots or dashes often include settings for long distances that are unlikely to ever be used by the average shooter. Not only do extra unnecessary dots clutter up the reticle, the ones for long ranges are close together and that’s a disadvantage in itself. Even for longer distance shooting with a red dot sight I just know where to adjust my points of aim.

When I’m shooting at relatively close distances and speed is very important, I focus on the target—as I assume I will be if someone is actually shooting at me rather than presenting a stationary blank sheet of cardboard. I try to train myself to find my desired point of aim and bring the reticle (dot or crosshairs) to that spot rather than first trying to find the reticle in my field of vision and then move it onto the target while attempting to decide where I want the bullet to hit. Because of all that, I prefer simpler reticles.

One problem with using something like the bottom of the EOTech circle as an aiming aid is that it’s precise at only one or two distances. With practice on lifelike targets, I find that knowing where the necessary point of aim on the target is and putting the center of the reticle there works best for me. It also works regardless of whether my sight is someone’s EOTech or my Aimpoints or Leupold 1-6× variable.

In reality "it depends" for each individual.

I prefer a daylight center red dot, noticeable elevation & windage lines that run from the center all the way to the edge of the FOV, and MOA markings to use the optic with other rifles / calibers as opposed to a BDC. I tried a 1-4x Accupower and it was nice, but prefer the Vortex PST Gen 2 1-6x. I also tried a couple of Leupolds but they didn't last long for me.

In reality, I use a 100m zero which will be from -2 to 0 inches from 0-200m. For shots out to 50m, I hold slightly high on the desired POI, about an inch.

Beyond that and out to 200m, I just make POA desired POI, and take the negligible shift 1-2" of shift as "measuring with a micrometer, cutting with a chainsaw". Besides, on most targets I shoot at / anticipate shooting at, a shot a couple inches low is still a hit. I'd rather hit low than high.

Here is a great discussion about reticle, trajectories, etc. Even though it advocates a 100m/yd zero, it's still good info for someone who chooses a different distance.

http://www.m4carbine.net/showt...f-the-100-Meter-Zero

http://www.m4carbine.net/showt...ros-and-Trajectories

quote:

Originally posted by RHINOWSO:
In reality "it depends" for each individual.

I prefer a daylight center red dot, noticeable elevation & windage lines that run from the center all the way to the edge of the FOV, and MOA markings to use the optic with other rifles / calibers as opposed to a BDC. I tried a 1-4x Accupower and it was nice, but prefer the Vortex PST Gen 2 1-6x. I also tried a couple of Leupolds but they didn't last long for me.

In reality, I use a 100m zero which will be from -2 to 0 inches from 0-200m. For shots out to 50m, I hold slightly high on the desired POI, about an inch.

Beyond that and out to 200m, I just make POA desired POI, and take the negligible shift 1-2" of shift as "measuring with a micrometer, cutting with a chainsaw". Besides, on most targets I shoot at / anticipate shooting at, a shot a couple inches low is still a hit. I'd rather hit low than high.

Here is a great discussion about reticle, trajectories, etc. Even though it advocates a 100m/yd zero, it's still good info for someone who chooses a different distance.

http://www.m4carbine.net/showt...f-the-100-Meter-Zero

http://www.m4carbine.net/showt...ros-and-Trajectories

That was a good read, thank you!

Wow. Thank you very much sigfreund and RHINOWSO for those insightful comments. Reading over those replies I had multiple "ah-ha" moments where things really clicked in my mind. I've actually read of those M4C threads years ago, but now that I'm seriously researching a LPV scope, I can apply them and now I fully understand. Thanks again.