So, you’ve bore sighted the rifle, now you’re at the range to fine tune the scope. After firing a shot to foul the barrel do you fire a three shot group and adjust, as necessary? Or do you fire one shot and, with the rifle firmly in place, adjust the crosshairs to where the point of impact is and resight on the bullseye and fire two more shots? Theoretically the second method mentioned will put those two shots in the bullseye.

the three shot group is a solid plan imho.

Sight for groups, or you’ll be chasing your zero all over the paper. Speaking from experience.

quote:

Originally posted by clubleaf206:
Or do you fire one shot and, with the rifle firmly in place, adjust the crosshairs to where the point of impact is and resight on the bullseye and fire two more shots? Theoretically the second method mentioned will put those two shots in the bullseye.

This is how I do it.

The number of shots required for a good zero depends upon the consistency of one's shooting system. Great consistency requires all three system components to be capable of stacking shots on top of each other -- the rifle, the ammo, and the shooter.

If you're absolutely certain that you can place a round anywhere on paper that you desire, anytime, then a low round count zero confirmation works.

I agree with Flash-lb. I fire one (maybe 2 if it's not clear where my first shot went) shot at the target and then carefully adjust. Once I get the scope zero'd I start shooting for groups.

I also don't laser sight any more. Too expensive to get one that's worth a damn. Instead I go old school and yank the bolt and look downrange through the bore to get on paper, then walk it in with the first few shots. I'm zeroed in within 10 shots most of the time.

I do shoot for groups, but only after the scope gets zeroed.

I bought a laser bore sight years ago and it's been a big help to get a base zero (I have a tree exactly 98yds in the yard that is my laser target).

At the range I shoot 3 or 4 rds to establish a poi, then make adjustments and shoot singles down to the bullseye, then shoot groups to confirm the poi.

quote:

Originally posted by fritz:
If you're absolutely certain that you can place a round anywhere on paper that you desire, anytime, then a low round count zero confirmation works.

I’ve never been that certain, so I always confirm with genuine groups.

That said, if I’m going from on paper someplace after actually looking through the bore, then one shot is enough for starters. I use my calibrated reticle to determine how far that shot was from the point of aim, make the indicated adjustment, and then start shooting groups and fine tuning the adjustments as necessary.

Here’s what I do with a freshly mounted scope. I start off closer range with a larger cardboard or target, that may be 30-50 yards. At times I may do a home bore scope ahead of time, usually not.

For the 1st shots at close range I adjust the scope on one shot. I do this until close.

Once it’s close, I extend the range then start shooting maybe 3 shot groups. I then fine tune with the 3 shot groups at hunting ranges.

I usually start with a laser bore sight for left-right alignment and rough drop, like it should be a certain number of inches high or low at 25 yards in the indoor range I frequent. I then go to an outdoor range and verify with a 3-5 round group.

I have a Shepherd scope that has a 1st & 2nd focal plane reticles. So if you have the rifle locked into a rest, you can literally do a one shot sighting in. It’s BDC is calibrated to the 308168 SMK round but other calibers match up to the circles out to 800 give or take.

On my other rifles with scope I use the group method..and usually use five rounds for a group

Irons or Scope,

3 shots, adjust, 3 more etc etc till I think I am good,

if I have trouble finding them , I will back up to 50 and start,

after all is set, then a 10 shot group ,

why 10? , I used to shoot service rifle a lot,

10 shots for score

Not being a smart ass but does it hurt to shoot 3, are we that low on ammo? Don't we all enjoy shooting?

I guess time savings, but for all but the best shooters, WHY NOT three round groups?

quote:

Originally posted by clubleaf206:
So, you’ve bore sighted the rifle, now you’re at the range to fine tune the scope. After firing a shot to foul the barrel do you fire a three shot group and adjust, as necessary? Or do you fire one shot and, with the rifle firmly in place, adjust the crosshairs to where the point of impact is and resight on the bullseye and fire two more shots? Theoretically the second method mentioned will put those two shots in the bullseye.

I mount my optic, take it to the range, start at 50 yards. I fire a 10 round shot group, adjust, fire another 10 round group. Once it’s “zeroed” at 50, I drop it about an inch(ish) and head over to the 100 yard range.

Same process; 10 round group, adjust, followed by another 10 round group.

Through the years I’ve found that as long as properly mount your scope, torque to spec, and plum it, there’s no need for bore sighting or adding in any extra steps.

The farthest I’ve ever been off on a target with my current setups has been roughly 4” from the bullseye. YMMV

quote:

Originally posted by OttoSig:
Not being a smart ass but does it hurt to shoot 3, are we that low on ammo? Don't we all enjoy shooting?

I guess time savings, but for all but the best shooters, WHY NOT three round groups?

Otto, I don't think the question was coming from an ammo-saving viewpoint.
More like a best accuracy method.

And FWIW when anyone says they are not trying to be a smart ass ~ they actually are.

Shoot 1 shot. Measure the POA (Point Of Aim) to the POI (Point Of Impact) and make the adjustment. From then on, shoot 3-shot groups measuring from POA to center of group for adjustment values. Once zeroed, loosen turret, slip to zero and re-tighten. Shoot another 3-shot group to confirm; total number of shots with confirmation is usually 10-13

I’ll state a perspective I haven’t seen yet. You have many variables that can affect where the bullet will impact from shot to shot - how firmly the rifle is aimed at the same spot, any variance from where you think the rifle is aimed at versus where it’s actually aimed at, wind, amount and uniformity of the propellant, and the bullet attributes.

Statistics say the larger the sample, the closer it will approximate the population as the variables will cancel each other out. So 3 shots would be better.

quote:

Originally posted by Rey HRH:
So 3 shots would be better.

And for long range shooting purposes, five or even 10 for final confirmation are better still. If you can shoot a tiny group every time and it’s a foot or more from the point of aim, then two or three shots is plenty for an initial rough correction, but not when we’re trying to finalize and adjust things precisely.

My minimum for confirmation is five shots and after having shot enough of them, it became obvious a long time ago that three shot groups, especially one or two of them, can be misleading. It takes only one shot to skew the apparent results. If the purpose of zeroing is to hit a 12" plate at 300 yards or a 16 inch vital zone at 250, then precise zeroing isn’t important, but for other purposes it can be.

This video is a good short explanation of the fundamental problem with too-small samples. (I find some of his presentations to be a little annoying, but he usually knows what he’s talking about.)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWQdjnevi-4

I have zeroed a rifle with as little as 3 rounds before. Once I feel I'm "there" I'll start doing 3 round groups to double check myself.