I am still for all practical purposes unemployed, but really feel the need to have a rifle again to protect my family (other than a .22 rimfire). I'm trying to scrape together enough funds to pick up something used as cheaply as possible while the prices are still low and am trying to decide between the AR platform or the AK platform.

While the main purpose of the rifle will be home defense and general defense of family in the event that all hell breaks loose, I also want to be able to AFFORD to shoot it for sport/fun on occasion, so ammo needs to be affordable, and that seems to tip the scales towards the AK side of the house. However, the AR side has so many accessories and different ways to configure the weapon for my own personal use that it is more attractive that way, plus it appears to be the more accurate option for fun shooting/plinking!

What does the SigForum brain trust think? I'm going to be struggling to exceed $300.00-350.00 for the gun itself, and I know that is going to be tough to work with, but the perceived need/urgency to protect my family by more than just a handgun is getting stronger on a weekly basis.

Your input appreciated! Thanks in advance!!!

I'd rather rely on a good quality handgun for HD than a $350 AR or AK in today's market. If you can do it, it will be with the bottom barrel quality parts. Maybe a used S&W M&P Sport? That would be OK, but I don't know if they are $350.

AR is the better choice due to modularity and availability of good defensive ammo and it will penetrate less in a structure.

AR
Pro - You can get a quality AR for cheaper than a quality AK these days.
Pro - Better iron sights
Pro - Easier to add optics
Pro - Greater availability of accessories
Pro - Cheaper magazines
Pro - More options for calibers
Pro - More options for defensive/hunting ammo
Pro - Can switch calibers very easily
Pro - Better ergonomics (my opinion; user-dependent)
Pro - Potentially more accurate
Pro - Better safety
Pro - More versatile/customizable
Pro - More usable for medium/long-range shooting
Con - Slightly smaller caliber (if using the standard .223/5.56)
Con - Slightly more dependent on proper lubrication
Con - Potentially less reliable in dirty/muddy/sandy conditions


AK
Pro - Slightly larger caliber (if using 7.62x39)
Pro - More tolerant of lack of regular lubrication/cleaning
Pro - Reliable, even when exposed to mud/dirt/sand
Pro - Slightly cheaper ammo (though not by much)
Pro - More tolerant of steel-cased ammo
Con - Inferior iron sights
Con - Slightly less accurate than an AR on average
Con - Somewhat tougher to add optics
Con - Less aftermarket support
Con - Only a couple good options for defensive/hunting ammo
Con - Few options for alternate calibers
Con - Less ergonomic (my opinion; user-dependent)
Con - Less convenient safety
Con - No last round bolt hold-open
Con - Slower reloads
Con - Designed for short-to-medium range shooting


If I was faced with only having one modern defensive rifle, I'd choose the AR over the AK. (And I'm a fan of the AK and 7.62x39 in general...)

However, either way, it's going to be a challenge to find an AR - and especially tough to find an AK - for $300-$350. If ~$300 is all you have to spend, I'd skip the long gun altogether in favor of ensuring your handgun was outfitted with night sights and/or a weaponlight, some premium defensive ammo, sufficient spare magazines, and a quality holster and gun belt, and then spend the rest on practice ammo and range fees.

350 is not even close to enough to build/buy something I'd stake my life on.

Good luck.

At-15 all day. Won’t over penetrate and will drop em quick. Or a police trade in glock can be had for 350-400

quote:

Originally posted by DoctorSolo:
350 is not even close to enough to build/buy something I'd stake my life on.

Good luck.

It can get you a remington 870, which I reach for at my house when something goes bump in the night before I reach for an AR.

$350 is pretty cheap, but I have shot a lot of cheap ARs that function properly. I would wager a $350 AR that will function flawlessly for the first 200 rounds is every bit as reliable as a $350 or $400 pistol. My P226 was not 100% reliable until it had over 700 rounds down the tube.

Having said that, I am blessed to be able to afford more expensive firearms for self defense. But, if all I could afford is a $350 AR that functions properly on the range, I would use it for self defense in a heart beat.

For $300-350 I'd look at used Glocks, Rugers, S&W Sigma or a Ruger or S&W Revolver. Maybe a used older Remington Wingmaster refit with an 18" barrel or a Mossberg 500 .

I'm not a fan of AKs, especially cheap AKs.

The cheapest I'd for an AR would be an S&W Sport or a Ruger.

I'm new at this (the rifle thing), but I would think that the $300 to $350 price range is pretty slim for an AR. I'm in the process of acquiring one. Thanks to the amazing generosity of several SIGforum members, my lower is essentially free, but I'm shopping for a complete upper assembly, and that alone falls into your price range.

The most cost-effective one that I have spotted to date, is from Palmetto State. $319.00 for a complete, ready-to-go, upper assembly including iron (polymer?) sights. With the karmas that I have received for the naked lower and the parts kit to assemble it, that $319.00 is pretty much my total cost for a basic rifle, but it will still need magazines, at a very minimum. And for Home Defense, I will probably want to mount a light. So those things -- magazines and light -- will add another hundred bucks at a very minimum, probably more than that.

On the other hand, you can find a decent shotgun in your price range.

quote:

Originally posted by CD228:
For $300-350 I'd look at used Glocks, Rugers, S&W Sigma or a Ruger or S&W Revolver. Maybe a used older Remington Wingmaster refit with an 18" barrel or a Mossberg 500 .

I'm not a fan of AKs, especially cheap AKs.

The cheapest I'd for an AR would be an S&W Sport or a Ruger.

This. The days of the $350 Ak are well behind us, and even with the current glut in AR's I wouldn't trust a $350 AR in a defensive role.

quote:

Originally posted by RogueJSK:
<<snip>> If ~$300 is all you have to spend, I'd skip the long gun altogether in favor of ensuring your handgun was outfitted with night sights and/or a weaponlight, some premium defensive ammo, sufficient spare magazines, and a quality holster and gun belt, and then spend the rest on practice ammo and range fees.

My SP2022/9mm came with factory night sights, I have multiple factory mags, and I keep them stoked with Hornady Critical Defense ammo when not plinking at the range. Still have several cases of range ammo to burn, and a free outdoor range to shoot on, an excellent gun belt from Mike Bissell and several choices in holsters, most of which I made myself from horsehide.

I have a decent little backup pistol also, but going on the concept of what many instructors teach: "The purpose of the handgun is to fight your way to your rifle" (or something to that effect), I just feel the need for a long gun in the safe instead of only handguns and the sole rimfire. I know my budget makes this a very difficult thing to attempt, but it is what it is, and I'm just trying to see if there is any way possible to accomplish it without bankrupting what little funds there are available. Sounds like the AR platform is the way to go... or a pump-action scattergun. Can't really shoot the shotgun for fun/sport/plinking like "normal" so would still prefer the AR if possible... just gotta figure out how to afford one.

Expand your range of options to include the SKS. You may also want to think about buying a good, complete AR upper and then putting together the lower (which will be significantly cheaper) as time and funds permit.

Nowadays, FWIW, you have a better chance of finding a good, cheap AR that works than you do of finding a good, cheap AK that works unless you get lucky on the used market.

Agree the AR is the way to go. My dear father taught me patience and if I were on a tight budget would start slowly by buying a good stripped lower for an Ar ( under $100) then as time and budget allows buy part by part to get a better quality result. A good quality compete upper can be had under 400 these days, and a parts kit to assemble the lower will run about $60. A stock and associate parts can be obtained for roughly $60 as well. So for a total of under $600 you can have a really solid rifle, and buying a bit over time will ease the money burden

quote:

Originally posted by cmr076:

quote:

Originally posted by DoctorSolo:
350 is not even close to enough to build/buy something I'd stake my life on.

Good luck.

It can get you a remington 870, which I reach for at my house when something goes bump in the night before I reach for an AR.

Good for you.

quote:

Originally posted by bronicabill:
I know my budget makes this a very difficult thing to attempt, but it is what it is, and I'm just trying to see if there is any way possible to accomplish it without bankrupting what little funds there are available. Sounds like the AR platform is the way to go... or a pump-action scattergun. Can't really shoot the shotgun for fun/sport/plinking like "normal" so would still prefer the AR if possible... just gotta figure out how to afford one.

Given that statement, I'd say you are good with that SIG for now. Unless there is a looming threat in your AO, I would recommend you start saving, skip some beer here, a dinner out there, a video or movie and you can build up capital. I suspect that the glut of ARs available will remain so for a while unless there is a major shift on congress. Another option is to get a preassembled lower from an outfit like Colt and then add an upper as funds become available.

I understand the saving up thing, and I also considered building one, but the wifey is having some pretty serious kidney surgery the week before Christmas and will spend a week in the hospital, so whatever I do will have to happen before that as afterwards all funds will be diverted to paying medical bills for the next 162 years!

Save your money up and you can build it yourself. Of course, you could always do what this guy did; build an AK from a shovel!

quote:

Originally posted by bronicabill:
I understand the saving up thing, and I also considered building one, but the wifey is having some pretty serious kidney surgery the week before Christmas and will spend a week in the hospital, so whatever I do will have to happen before that as afterwards all funds will be diverted to paying medical bills for the next 162 years!

All the more reason to toss a few hundred bucks more at it now. Id even consider selling the backup handgun.

this is about as low as I would go on the AR totem pole
https://grabagun.com/ruger-ar-...-16-1-inch-30rd.html

I'd get a S&W Military and Police AR-15. Still will cost $500, but it probably is "good enough" to take care of your needs and you will not be compromising anything of critical necessity.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w81PRJmG1LM

https://grabagun.com/smith-and...rt-ii-5-56mm-16.html

$500 is over your budget, but if you can't swing it, stay out of the game. A quality AK that you can buy once and probably have no qualms regarding quality, fit and finish, especially canted sights, and retaining a chrome lined barrel, will cost you at least $700, and more like $1000 (Arsenal).

If you are truly limited to $300, just get a $50 stripped lower, and go after the Federal Rebate deal for 1000 rounds of 5.56mm 55 grain ($250 post rebate at Palmetto State Armory). Build you gun as your funds get replenished, whenever that might be.

You could get a Remington 870 express with an extended magazine tube for your price range. That would be a devastating long arm. Ammo is everywhere. But of course, it seems that you are set on a semi-auto combat style rifle.

I'll leave this here.


https://youtu.be/DX73uXs3xGU

https://youtu.be/YAneTFiz5WU

The M16 platform is more reliable, hands down. Plus
Better sights.
Better safety.
Better triggers.
Better magazine release.

Plus more user serviceable. Plus more stuff, and easier to configure to the way YOU want it.

In all, the M16 platform family is a better weapon. To top it off, Special Forces carry it that use a different rifle as standard issue. Even the Russians, so yeah. AR 15/M16 platform all day long and twice on Sunday.

https://youtu.be/IgXad9x9n9E


ARman