I was thinking the other day. What if there was a solar flare or an EMP ,would my battery powered optics in the safe survive. I have a power cable going into the safe for lights and a golden rod.

I tried to look this up on the Intrnet but could not find any answers. (not trying to go tin foil hat??)
but just curious.
Thinking about thermal optics storage.
Any thought on this?

Thank you in advance.
Jsjac

This message has been edited. Last edited by: jsjac,

Something I have considered as well. I get the impression that true EMP info is not necessarily known; most of it seems speculative.

Some folks are confident that their safe in a subterranean basement will provide adequate protection; they may be right. Some say that the enclosure must be constructed with thorough overlaps, with attention paid to a lack of cracks, and made of aluminum.

I decided a reasonable compromise was an "EMP bag", inside my safe, in a half-subterranean basement. I was motivated by the desire to safely store night vision and it's related equipment. The PVS14 itself, my Eotech, and any other potentially compromised small items are in one bag, and two laser-equipped uppers are in another.

You may get more relevant help if you mention EMP in your thread title.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: KSGM,

You want a grounded Faraday cage. The conductive material should have sufficient area and low enough resistance to handle the anticipated power level. Then, the protected devices inside must also have sufficient isolation from the ground to avoid large induced currents which can overstress the silicon junctions inside the IC's.

I only mention this to illustrate the fact that an EMP large enough to concern you, will be attached to a nuclear blast large enough to render all your concerns irrelevant.

I approach the EMP protection idea with a "something is better than nothing" attitude. For what I paid for the US-made "EMP bags", I feel like I took some precaution without breaking the bank.

I know I'll never have the funds to build a proper cage.

are you using amazon bags or something else

would need a fairly large bag for the thermal stuff.

how about putting the stuff inside ammo cans?

I guess I need to a bunch more reading. To see what I can figure out.

This is what I have.

https://shop.faradaydefense.co...p-70mil-faraday-bag/

I am not an EMP expert. It sounds like DoctorSolo has a better understanding than I do. I have read about hypothetical "tactical EMP" devices, which aren't associated with a nuclear blast. I don't know how realistic those devices are.

As stated earlier, these bags make me feel like I did something to mitigate the EMP threat. It gives me small preparedness warm-fuzzy, at the very least.

One thing I will say about the bags, is they degrade with use. Mine are likely due for a refresh. The material will crease and crinkle, presumably degrading it's effectiveness. Maybe it's all for nothing, because they aren't deliberately grounded; I dunno.

This is an interesting question.
I have various reasons why I haven’t given the possibility of a massive nuclear strike against the US much thought, and less possible preparation. My views can therefore be given the weight they deserve.

When I think of this specific issue and the possibility that I might want to have effective sights after such an event, though, I’d be planning for the longer term as well. For that reason I’d want my weapons to be usable without relying on electronics and batteries of any sort for a long time, and perhaps forever. Yes, the small batteries used in things like red dot sights have long shelf lives, but not indefinite. Even if we’re not planning for the total collapse of civilization, sometimes commodities of all kinds become scarce to unobtainable.

Because of all that, I’d first make sure I had vital equipment that wasn’t dependent upon electronics and electricity. I have my share of electrooptical sights and they would be preferred for certain situations, but in addition to my LPVOs and precision rifle sights whose batteries are only for reticle illumination and not to make the sights usable, I also have an old Leupold Prismatic sight sitting forlornly in a box awaiting the day when my Aimpoints are nothing more than paperweights.* If for some reason I didn’t want to use an LPVO, that sight could readily fill a short range role. And of course all the guns with Aimpoints also have irons.

Even if a sight that didn’t use electronics wasn’t something I’d prefer or rely on if I had alternatives, if I seriously feared losing my electronics, I’d just make sure I had at least one or a few of the alternative. It would be a lot easier and more reliable than trying to protect against an unpredictable event of unknown magnitude, duration, and possible repetition.

* I also switched to that Leupold for a time when my dominant eye cataract got so bad that the illuminated Aimpoint red dots were about unusable. Something else to consider for the long run. I could still see well enough with conventional reticles even at the worst my vision got. How long do you plan to live without advanced elective medical care?

Added: None of that is of course intended to say that EMP protection is not something to pursue. There are no nonelectrical thermal or night vision devices available.

There are any number of YouTube videos about the subject, and perhaps some of the presenters even know what they’re talking about. One thing that seems valid to me is that when using something like an ammo can, the rubber seal should be removed and replaced with something conductive like many layers of aluminum foil after removing the paint. But what do I know?

This message has been edited. Last edited by: sigfreund,

quote:

unknown magnitude, duration, and possible repetition

That's something that played into the choice I made. I assume there are potentially varying magnitudes of the EMP phenomenon; my devices are likely not protected against the more extreme end of the spectrum. However, the relatively minimal expense of $85, combined with the ease of procurement of the bags, seemed like a reasonable measure to take, to potentially protect about $10,000 worth of stuff. The dollar value, in this case, is not what we're trying to protect. We're hoping to shelter something that provides an invaluable advantage, in any number of "worst case" scenarios.

Of course we all have iron sights; most of us have optical sights that don't require batteries to operate. I don't know that I ever would have given EMP protection a thought, had it not been for the night vision equipment. The OP seems to have been similarly motivated by his thermal. The night vision and thermal stuff gives you an edge that I'd like to retain, if I can.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: KSGM,

There have been 3 recorded EMP events in history. Two of those were nuclear weapon tests by the US at a very high altitude and the third was an x class solar flare back at the beginning of the electric era in the United States. What all these events had in common was the Van Allen belts got seriously disrupted, and the resulting EMP was picked up by long electrical lines, acting as giant antennas, and then the pulse was transmitted along the lines to electrical equipment. This was before modern electronics and computer chips.

Faraday cages can protect from an EMP, but you need to know what frequencies you are trying to block. Like a microwave oven. Or you can just use a tightly enclosed conductive container, preferably grounded.

I have a couple of these to protect my Thermal and Night vision. They are well made and have protected the optics well.

https://mosequipment.com/colle...-molle-faraday-pouch

This is a "it depends" answer. What exactly are you trying to defend against? Massive solar flare? Nuclear EMP? Device like in Ocean's 11 or Goldeneye that don't exist according to those who know but who knows what's in Pandora's Box?

My understanding of the 1st is that it is really only going to affect long lines, like electrical and copper transmission line. Bad, but not eating your local battery powered stuff or catching almost all the wires in your house aflame.

The second is either a high burst, which is more like above but honestly isn't really well studied due to, the obvious testing problems.

The third is just an unknown.

So, I do the best I can without going crazy with EMP bags for the "portable" optics and backup emergency radios and then BUIS for the rest.

As lomg as the device you want to protect from an EMP is off, your chances of being effected by an EMP event are minimal. If you're worried about an active device, it has to be hardened against EMP activity.

My "plan" is to dump the optic and flip up the backup irons. If we ever suffer an event that fries the red dot on the rifle inside my safe, and I actually live through it, I'm going to have bigger concerns like refrigeration and getting my well pump and furnace running. A functional electronic rifle optic will be so far down the list that I doubt I'll even care.

If I had a massive investment in night vision and thermal, I guess it starts to make a little more sense, but what is your plan to keep those going long-term without power to charge the batteries? If an EMP is strong enough to nuke your optic in your safe, it's also going to take out the grid, and likely your generator, solar/wind charge controller, etc. as well.

If we ever come to that place, those who are prepared to live without dependence on anything powered are going to have an easier time of it than others.