Dumb M4 5.56 Question

April 27, 2017, 10:03 AM

fritz

quote:
Originally posted by mrmn50:
At this time, I am not in a hurry. It is just that I would like to prep for the future and get going on my research for what will be a fix for the pain increase in my AC joint.

In all honesty, a 223 AR-15 is one of the lightest recoiling rifles on the market -- its recoil energy is in the 3-4 foot pounds ballpark. This is 1/4 to 1/5 of the recoil energy of popular firearms such as the .308 Win rifles and 12 gauge shotguns. As a result, the vast majority of gun owners will state that "my AR-15 is soft shooting" or "it has no recoil". Well of course this is a common sentiment, especially after we just shot a 300 Win Mag prior to shooting an AR-15.

The combinations listed earlier in this thread of gun weight, muzzle devices, recoil pad, and gas system will incrementally reduce recoil -- likely dropping a 223's recoil energy to the 2 to 2.5 foot pounds range.

I can honestly state that my 24" truck-axle barrel AR, pigged out with a PRS stock, bipod, big honking scope, full-length rail, and suppressor recoils noticeably less than my light weight 16" over-gassed carbine. This ain't rocket science, it's a matter of physics.

Now such changes may, or may not, work for you. Another option is to consider a caliber change, by going to a different upper. Like the 22lr upper, which probably has recoil energy of 1/2 foot pound or less. Uppers in 17 HMR and 204 Ruger also come to mind, if a little more oomph is desired. I suspect there are other light-recoiling AR-15 upper chamberings out there.

April 28, 2017, 06:47 PM

Scooter123

quote:
Originally posted by maladat:
Oh, also:

It is my understanding that overgassed AR-15s recoil more, and that most AR-15s are at least somewhat overgassed (because there is a lot of variation in ammunition and too much gas is still reliable while too little is not).

You may be able to reduce recoil at least somewhat by getting an adjustable gas block and adjusting it down to just enough gas to reliably cycle the action.

I have adjustable gas blocks on all 3 of my AR's and they do reduce the muzzle rise and mitigate recoil to some extent. Another positive and the reason I initially started using adjustable gas blocks is that less gas into the receiver means a cleaner shooting rifle. On my 300 Blackout using handloads built with H110 I can put over 100 rounds downrange with no pain at all and a rifle that looks like it only shot 5 or 10 rounds.

Another tip is to look into longer barrels or barrels with a heavier profile. Because mass added to the rifle can reduce felt recoil. In addition a longer barrel means a more complete gas burn so you'll get less blast if you are using a muzzle brake.

April 28, 2017, 07:38 PM

sigfreund

quote:
Originally posted by fritz:
[I]t's a matter of physics.

Yes, “Ye canna change the laws of physics, Captain!”

One of the things about coming to the Internet for advice and information is that many people view questions through very narrow filters that reflect their own likes, dislikes, and interests. I’ve read many posts that extol the virtues of ultra light rifles. “Pencil” barrels, minimum to no accessories, the smallest, lightest optics and no backup sights, etc. People get caught up in the enthusiasm and think, “Yeah! Pare that puppy down.”

But if added weight reduces felt recoil, reduced weight increases it. The guy who always gets stuck pulling four or five hours of perimeter duty may decide that extra recoil in the unlikely event that he has to actually shoot the weapon is more than made up for by not feeling like he’s holding a couple of cinder blocks by the end of his shift. How many people, though, does that apply to?

A stout aluminum handguard; long, heavy barrel; a big flashlight rather than a svelte X300; a “precision” type stock; hefty optics and metal backup sights; and even hanging a bipod on the front will all reduce felt recoil. Weights can even be added to standard stocks. For A2 type stocks, Brownells offers a dedicated buttstock weight. If something like that wouldn’t work, some stocks are available that have compartments designed to hold spare batteries or parts. Those could be filled with lead weights to produce a similar effect.

April 28, 2017, 08:13 PM

mrmn50

quote:
Originally posted by sigfreund:
quote:
Originally posted by fritz:
[I]t's a matter of physics.

Yes, “Ye canna change the laws of physics, Captain!”

One of the things about coming to the Internet for advice and information is that many people view questions through very narrow filters that reflect their own likes, dislikes, and interests. I’ve read many posts that extol the virtues of ultra light rifles. “Pencil” barrels, minimum to no accessories, the smallest, lightest optics and no backup sights, etc. People get caught up in the enthusiasm and think, “Yeah! Pare that puppy down.”

But if added weight reduces felt recoil, reduced weight increases it. The guy who always gets stuck pulling four or five hours of perimeter duty may decide that extra recoil in the unlikely event that he has to actually shoot the weapon is more than made up for by not feeling like he’s holding a couple of cinder blocks by the end of his shift. How many people, though, does that apply to?

A stout aluminum handguard; long, heavy barrel; a big flashlight rather than a svelte X300; a “precision” type stock; hefty optics and metal backup sights; and even hanging a bipod on the front will all reduce felt recoil. Weights can even be added to standard stocks. For A2 type stocks, Brownells offers a dedicated buttstock weight. If something like that wouldn’t work, some stocks are available that have compartments designed to hold spare batteries or parts. Those could be filled with lead weights to produce a similar effect.

sigfreund, me boy, I have been waiting for you to join this thread. Thank you.