Thanks, fritz. Makes sense and definitely something to avoid.

Over the past few weeks I have spent some time assessing the accuracy of my 22lr ammo inventory. First, it was groups at my 50 yard zero. Even at this close range two things were evident -- (1) ammo among brands and product lines are quite different and (2) my technique isn't always so consistent from one group to the next.

At 50 yards I was able to drill a few purdy clover-leaf groups. The better loads from Eley, Lapua, and RWS showed their pedigree, with some groups in the .2s and .3s. But banging away at 50 yards does only so much for long distance training. My next step was to look at vertical variation by load at 100 yards. I rarely have calm conditions at my range for 100 yard targets, therefore I decided to ignore the effects of the wind.

This was a good decision, as wind drift at 100 yards varied from virtually nothing to over 5 inches, with a generally right-to-left wind. Making things worse, I suspect I experienced some down drafts, as there were some serious WTF moment low fliers with good ammo. My lowest vertical of the day was with Lapua Center X -- a mere .42" for five rounds. The most consistent ammo was RWS Rifle Match -- four separate groups with vertical of between .50" to .76".

I have tested only half of my ammo brands at 100 yards, so I have more paper to punch. I'd really like to see if the funky winds skewed the results, however calm days just don't seem to be in the cards. Then it's on to 150 or 200 yard targets, in order get a real feel for what works with "long distance 22lr".

fritz, exx1976....

http://nationalrifleleague.org/

Alpine is involved setting up a match in Craig, Co.

Yeah, saw the announcement. Knew about it maybe a month ago. I'm talking with Travis to see if he wants a section over on PRF.

Didn't know Alpine was involved. I'll have to find a way to get to that match!

quote:

Originally posted by exx1976:
Yeah, saw the announcement. Knew about it maybe a month ago. I'm talking with Travis to see if he wants a section over on PRF.

Didn't know Alpine was involved. I'll have to find a way to get to that match!

Alpine has been sharing some of the details, rules.... I like this one, there will be a holding area some distance from the shooting positions, can't leave the holding area until RO calls us over.

Anything you would like to see, post it up.

Mile High Shootout, 22/23 July. Halfway between Craig and Maybell Colorado, North side of U.S. Hwy 40.

NRL is finializing the rules as we speak. Match directors will have finial say how each match is run, for example: NRL rules say chamber flags will be used, but we can waive the requirement if conditions warrant i.e. Rain, Snow, Mud, etc.

We have a huge Ranch available with diverse tarrain, and plan on having as many natural shooting positions as possible, limiting the amount of props and barricades. Elevation is 6500-ft plus.

My goal is to have no Special Olympics in this match like PRS has. However, I am one of three running the match, and the three of us have to come to common ground on how the match will be run.
Offgrid has provided some input, which has been passed on and will likely be incorporated.

Input and suggestions are welcome, and will be considered. We are making and running the match for the shooter, not some administrative board in another State.

You will not be required to be a NRL member to shoot the match, and those who volunteer to be an RO will have a guaranteed slot in a future NRL match. We also plan on having a condensed course of fire Friday morning for the RO's to shoot, and possibly have awards and prizes for the best shooters in that group.

Check-in, Sight-in, Practice Range will be open 1300 to 1800-hours on Friday.

One thing we are going to add to the event, each Stage will have a sponsor, and the top shooter of each stage will win a prize provided by the sponsor.

We plan on having 18-Stages, and NRL rules say from what I recall, we have to shoot a minimum of 140-rounds per match.

Awards ceremony and Pig Roast will be Sunday afternoon. Those flying in/out from out of State, Hayden (Yampa Valley) Airport is the closest airport with commercial flights, just under one-hour from match location. Denver is four and a half hours away. Camping is free in Maybell City Park (first come, first served), and there's a KOA camp ground in Craig, both 30-min from the match location. Craig has numerious hotels, motels, (Hampton, Clarion, Best Western) and we are working at getting a block of rooms reserved with discount pricing.

Thanks, We're hoping to provide a great match for you guys.

Yeehaw, this sounds like a fun match. I should be able to attend, assuming I can have one of my staff do the travel duties for the show that's scheduled for that week in Oklahoma.

No Special Olympics??!! What will I do with my short bus?

Wow.. 4.5 hours from Denver? I just looked up Craig, and that's 18 hours from me. Now we might be talking about a flight for this match. Have to see what airfare costs look like. Sounds like a fantastic match though, and I hope I'm able to make it. I like the natural position stuff. That's how the first Nebraska match was - shooting from downed trees, haybales, trucks, prone.. I think they only had one man-made prop at that match - a shoot house. The old t3 matches were similar, I only recall the shoot house. Everything else was natural.

Sounds like it'll be hot, too. I'll have to make sure to get squadded with fritz. At least I have a sling now, and my rifle is about 4# lighter than last time he caddied for me.

Tempatures could be anywhere between 60 to 95-deg., depending on what Mother Nature has in store for us. Morning could have everything from freezing with frost on your windshield, to a 60-deg. start.

For those coming from the mid-West, just take Colorado Hwy-13 down from I-80., which will drop you right in Craig.

Went out and set up some steel at 510, 755, and 1035-yards on BLM yesterday, West of where we will have the July match.

Good times, wind was averaging around 15-mph, going up to 20-mph, and gusting even higher.

Started off shooting the 223 with 69-gr SMK's. Was only able to hit the 1035-yard plate once out of five shots, blaming the wind (5.3-Mil wind hold). Then it was one of those "Oh" moments when I noticed the bullet went subsonic at 913-yards.

The new (used) 6.5x47L I picked up a few weeks ago was hammering the targets. Then suddenly at 510-yards I'm shooting 0.2 to 0.3-Mils consistently high??? About then we called it a day. Last night I go to clean my rifle, start cleaning the brake ports with a Q-tip, and the brake comes loose. Guess that explains the last few shots of the day.

That's a long hike with 69 SMK. I shot them at distances where they go subsonic, but it's been awhile. I can't recall if it was 100 or 200 yards beyond the Mach 1 threshold that they started tumbling badly. I do recall that they flew pretty true to just below Mach 1. But the wind really tosses that bullet around at distance.

Interesting that a loose brake pushes your rounds high. On my ARs and bolt guns a loose muzzle device (especially suppressors) pushes my rounds low.

My ongoing testing of .22lr ammo types can be both enlightening and frustrating. I'm the loosest nut in the equation, however on days when I'm on, the inconsistencies of some ammo is a real challenge.

What's accurate at 50 yards may not be accurate at 100 yards.
Wind drift for top-of-the-line match ammo is often no different than that of low- and mid-tier match ammo.

I've come to believe that wind shifts at my range can affect both horizontal and vertical POI at 100 yards, and beyond. My best 100 yard targets today were with Geco Match ammo.
- The first group of five impacted 1/4" left of POA, horizontal variation was only 1/4", vertical dispersion of only .60".
- The second group had horizontal variation of 1-1/4" (with impacts on both left and right of POA), vertical dispersion of 1.44". The wind seemed to flop back and forth like a fat fish out of water.
- The third group impacted 1/4" right of POA, horizontal variation was only 1/8", vertical dispersion of only .47". Which means yes, this was a .47" group at 100 yards. I believe this is the best group I've produced with a 22lr at 100 yards.
- In other words, when I had no left-to-right variation from wind, my vertical dispersion was really small.

Today's breezes from my shooting location to 30-ish yards out were mainly from 6 o'clock, although fish-tailing often, and in the 3-6mph range.
- From 30-75 yards the winds switched from 8-9 o'clock (sometimes approaching 10mph), sometimes calm, sometimes from 3 o'clock at around 5mph.
- From 75-100 yards the breezes were similar to my shooting position.

I think the combination of terrain and trees makes for up- and down-drafts that I don't yet understand.

On a high note, I shot my best ever five-round group at 50 yards -- .162" with RWS Special Match. I also had groups .201" with Eley Target and .207" with Eley Club. Lots of groups over 1/2", too, as the crosswinds didn't help matters at 50 yards.

fritz,

absolutely the wind will push those tiny little low BC bullets up/down, very challenging trying to shoot groups in wind. Also can be very expensive/frustrating chasing consistent tiny groups with our 22's.

Bulk of the ammo I shoot out of my 40X is SK Plus, many thousands of rounds of that stuff. In calm wind it will hold a 1 1/4" at 100yds. I use my 40X as a trainer, not a BenchRest 22 tiny group shooter. Most of the positional targets in matches are in the 2 ish MOA range. With SK Plus holding 1.25 MOA, I shoot at those 3" wide diamonds at 100yds, off of tripod..... hit or miss. To practice for stage 7 at Raton will set up those diamonds at 75, 100 and 125yds shoot off of tripod. SK will hold 1/2" at 50yds, do tons of 1/2" dot drills at 50yds prone, commonly getting up and down between each shot. Good for that rear bag thing!!! Will clearly show if you're getting back on your rifle consistently, consistent cheek pressure, consistent POI.... I strongly believe dot drills are far better training then shooting groups. Do get occasional flyers with the SK, learn to recognize those. I occasionally shoot a 22 steel match, get out the Lapua Center-X or Eley Match for that. Let you know next time I'm going shoot a 22 match.

My goal really isn't bench rest precision, as my sporter 22 rifle isn't the right tool for it. When I started shooting smaller steel targets I was seeing POI variations at 100+ yards that didn't make sense. The goal is to figure out which ammo performs consistently over the distances my range is set up for -- from 50 to 200 yards. Then it's back to steel targets, positional shooting, and dot drills.

Over the years I have accumulated many brands of ammo, and thus I want to trim the ranks. The better 22lr is currently available, so it's time to stock up.

As for the brands that seem to work me:
- SK Standard Plus shows promise, although SK Rifle Match doesn't.
- Wolf Target shoots better than Wolf Extra.
- Eley Target & Club perform better than Eley Tenex & Match.
- RWS Rifle Match & Target Rifle perform better than RWS R50 and R100.
What's interesting is my rifle is more accurate with the mid-level match ammo than the top of the line stuff. Even in the Lapua line, Center X is more accurate than Midas Plus.

Ultimately it may come down to using Geco Match (made in the RWS factory) for most of my 22lr practice. At $60 per brick it's reasonably priced -- same as SK Standard Plus at SGammo.

Have CG Extreme two stage triggers on my rifles. One of the triggers has 16,000 rounds of live fire, easily 5 times that many dry fires, I dry fire a lot. It quit cocking my bolt. Called CG, they said send it in. CS called asked me how many rounds on it, what kind of shooting I'm doing.... I asked what it would cost to fix it. We're sending you a new one, no charge. Cool! Got it today, round trip two weeks.

Definitely great CS from CG.
*******

Another fun steel match at the town of Rifle today. Good shooting with you, Alpine. Offgrid pulled yeoman's duty locating targets, pointing them out to us, and spotting impacts.

I still have challenges with pointing my rifle at the high up-angle to the farthest targets -- the ones high on the mountain side. I thought the Atlas bipod leg extensions would help, but I still spent a lot of time futzing with them and the rear bag. Yep, the dreaded RBS -- rear bag syndrome -- reared its ugly head again. Honestly, I didn't feel very confident with my shooting until we got to the last targets, the decreasing-size targets at 500-something yards. Running all 6 of them allowed me to finish on a high note.

And my 15x scope really needs to be upgraded to a 25x model. Finding that 4" or 5" target way high at 750-ish (?) yards to the left of the painted rock wasn't easy.

For anyone who is interested, there is a new regional point-race series starting up - Border Wars Rifle Series. If you happen to live in the area, or feel like travelling to shoot in it, give it a look!

Ranges in IL, MO, IA, MN, and WI are participating.

At the end of the season, the shooter with the highest standing who is not already qualified will win a slot at the National Rifle League finale, held in Las Vegas, NV.

For those of you who don't know about the NRL already: http://nationalrifleleague.org/

More information on Border Wars Rifle Series: http://precisionrifleforums.com/index.php?topic=512.0

Finally bought the fx120i that goes along with the automated powder dispenser.

Loaded up a bunch of rounds today in preparation for a match tomorrow.

Its fast, and it's accurate. It didn't overthrow a single charge. The scale samples weight 20 times per second, so no dropping 1 kernel and waiting 3 seconds. The stepper motor is a little loud, and the dispenser is a little prone to sticking, but it's brand new, out of the box. I'm going to hit the dispenser with some 800 grit to Polish it up and it should be solid.

A very good solution. Not quite a prometheus, but at less than 1/4 the cost, I think it measures up VERY well.

quote:

Originally posted by exx1976:
For anyone who is interested, there is a new regional point-race series starting up - Border Wars Rifle Series. If you happen to live in the area, or feel like travelling to shoot in it, give it a look!

Ranges in IL, MO, IA, MN, and WI are participating.

At the end of the season, the shooter with the highest standing who is not already qualified will win a slot at the National Rifle League finale, held in Las Vegas, NV.

For those of you who don't know about the NRL already: http://nationalrifleleague.org/

More information on Border Wars Rifle Series: http://precisionrifleforums.com/index.php?topic=512.0

That sounds cool.

How'd the one go the other week up by RFD?

quote:

Originally posted by entropy:

quote:

Originally posted by exx1976:
For anyone who is interested, there is a new regional point-race series starting up - Border Wars Rifle Series. If you happen to live in the area, or feel like travelling to shoot in it, give it a look!

Ranges in IL, MO, IA, MN, and WI are participating.

At the end of the season, the shooter with the highest standing who is not already qualified will win a slot at the National Rifle League finale, held in Las Vegas, NV.

For those of you who don't know about the NRL already: http://nationalrifleleague.org/

More information on Border Wars Rifle Series: http://precisionrifleforums.com/index.php?topic=512.0

That sounds cool.

How'd the one go the other week up by RFD?

I spent more time coaching the Mrs and helping out a guy who was shooting his first ever match than I did paying attention to my own stuff. Lost focus a bit. Ended up tied for 5th out of 20-some-odd shooters. Meh.

They couldn't use the long range targets for the match since they couldn't get out there to put flashers on them due to the rain the day before. But after the match, someone rode out there on an atv and hid behind a stand of trees a few hundred yards off to the side with binos. The Mrs got first round hits at 1420 and 1855 with her 6 dasher in a 10-12 gusty wind. She was ecstatic. She actually went 5/8 on that 1420 plate!

Match tomorrow morning in northeast Iowa. I just finished loading for that one, headed to bed now. It's 4.5 hours each way...