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Daniel Defense pic rail vs MLOK Login/Join 
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Picture of sjames
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Using some down time to knock out some projects, one of which is a MK18 (10.3” DD barrel) style upper for my SBR’d lowers.

Most of my built uppers/carbines have MLOK rails because they’re smooth/slender. I like Troy (I know) because they use a standard barrel but and clamp up tight.

Wrapping up the current project, I’m considering the merits of a DD RIS pic rail versus MLOK. I’m not a clone guy so I don’t care about the look but wondered about future use with an IR laser.

Is the the DD RIS going to help provide a more stable option for the future use of a IR laser? Is it worth the premium over a MLOK rail?

Whatcha think?
 
Posts: 2442 | Location: Central Texas | Registered: August 22, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Freethinker
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The only advantage I see with something like the DD handguard you are evidently asking about is for mounting something with a Picatinny base anywhere and without adding a rail section to put it on. I personally don’t think that’s much of an advantage because it’s so easy to put a small rail section anywhere there are MLOK mounting points. Those Picatinny-everywhere handguards are very hand-unfriendly in my opinion unless everything that’s not used is protected with some sort of rail cover. In addition, some accessories like a sling swivel QD socket get pretty bulky if they have to be attached to a rail section rather than directly to an MLOK hole.

I once had a rifle with that type of handguard and did not care for it.




“The fundamental cause of trouble in the world today is that the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt.”
— Bertrand Russell
 
Posts: 44492 | Location: 10,150 Feet Above Sea Level in Colorado | Registered: April 04, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I default to pic rail. It suits the MK18 anyway (though you did say you don't care about looks). Concerning the laser, I'd say you're fine either way. The RIS may be better, but not enough that you'll notice, probably. Another thing I like about pic rail is how pressure switches nestle in between the rails.
 
Posts: 420 | Location: Northeast GA | Registered: February 15, 2021Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by sigfreund:
The only advantage I see with something like the DD handguard you are evidently asking about is for mounting something with a Picatinny base anywhere and without adding a rail section to put it on. I personally don’t think that’s much of an advantage because it’s so easy to put a small rail section anywhere there are MLOK mounting points. Those Picatinny-everywhere handguards are very hand-unfriendly in my opinion unless everything that’s not used is protected with some sort of rail cover. In addition, some accessories like a sling swivel QD socket get pretty bulky if they have to be attached to a rail section rather than directly to an MLOK hole.

I once had a rifle with that type of handguard and did not care for it.


Thanks for speaking to this…greatly enjoy your wisdom in threads.

The cheese grater aspect is a definite turn off on the pic rail. Most everything I use on a rifle these days…light, sling point, etc… has a lower profile mlok attachment.

Didn’t want this to be a case of milspec actually being the right choice!
 
Posts: 2442 | Location: Central Texas | Registered: August 22, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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In regards to Sigfreund comment about pic rails being less than "hand friendly" I agree but on my DD MK18 SBR I have found that adding some KAC rail covers makes it just as comfortable as any M-Lok system.

I cant speak to an IR system but the DD RIS is one of the few rails that the allows the bottom rail section to be removed for an M203 launcher to be added.

As far as the extra cost I would probably look at the Troy, BCM or a LaRue as the latter two have both served me well and are significantly cheaper than the DD.

If you can find one DD does make a Lite Rail still I believe and their mounting system is the same as the RIS 2.

Just my $0.02.
 
Posts: 406 | Location: Helena, AL | Registered: July 15, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Shall Not Be Infringed
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Before you make any decisions, you should DEFINITELY look at the Geissele Rails....They're NOT cheap, but damn they're nice! Just Sayin' Wink


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Posts: 5182 | Location: New Hampshire | Registered: October 29, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by nhracecraft:
You should DEFINITELY look at the Geissele Rails....They're NOT cheap, but damn they're nice! Just Sayin' Wink


Oh no doubt! G rails are sweet and I like their DDC. I have their mk16 on another rifle.
 
Posts: 2442 | Location: Central Texas | Registered: August 22, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I am totally sure you won't care on the method of IR mount between pic rail and mlock mounted rail section. But I am equally convinced that you probably won't even be in that discussion. Every rail I use has a pic on top. What IR device are you thinking about? The ones I have I run at 12 o'clock and most others that I shoot with do as well, but the world is a big place and people do all kinds of stuff I don't consider and think odd.


“So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong, and strike at what is weak.”
 
Posts: 9769 | Registered: October 14, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Originally posted by hrcjon:
I am totally sure you won't care on the method of IR mount between pic rail and mlock mounted rail section. But I am equally convinced that you probably won't even be in that discussion. Every rail I use has a pic on top. What IR device are you thinking about? The ones I have I run at 12 o'clock and most others that I shoot with do as well, but the world is a big place and people do all kinds of stuff I don't consider and think odd.


I feel certain…when I get to that point…IR aiming device will be mounted at 12 but I agree it’s a big world and there’s a great deal I don’t know, hence the thread.

Stability of the rail would also factor into clip-on NV if I go that route in the future.
 
Posts: 2442 | Location: Central Texas | Registered: August 22, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by hrcjon:
I am totally sure you won't care on the method of IR mount between pic rail and mlock mounted rail section.


I was under the impression he was referring to the strength of the interface between the HG and receiver, in regards to laser mounting.
 
Posts: 420 | Location: Northeast GA | Registered: February 15, 2021Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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After thinking about the question for a bit it occurs to me that in deciding to go with an MLOK-compatible handguard it’s important to ensure that the mounting points permit putting the accessories where we want them. Something like the DD Picatinny-everywhere probably offers more options in that regard. That mounting flexibility isn’t enough to overcome its disadvantages in my view, but it’s something to consider, and especially if we have a specific accessory in mind.

If rigidity of the handguard is a factor to consider because of the possibility of mounting a laser, that would be another matter.

The first question I’d have then is do you want/need a free floating handguard? Although I have only limited experience with free floating HGs, the ones I’ve had seemed to be strong and rigid. There’s also the question of how rigid the mount must be for practical use of a laser. Because of lasers’ usual intended uses plus their limited effective usability range and the size of the aiming dot they project, I would think that a bit of small movement in their mounts wouldn’t matter. I don’t know if many people mount their sights on free float handguards, but if someone did then ensuring that the HG didn’t move would be much more critical.




“The fundamental cause of trouble in the world today is that the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt.”
— Bertrand Russell
 
Posts: 44492 | Location: 10,150 Feet Above Sea Level in Colorado | Registered: April 04, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Yes sir, a free float rail is what I need/use. I have no real use for a FSB because every AR I have has optics (mostly T1/T2 but some glass) and BUIS.

You raise a good point though: if the rigidity/stability of the MLOK rails I have is sufficient for my BUIS, then reason would point to them being sufficient for any IR laser that I may use in the future.

Good point regarding the more versatile placement options on a pic rail but I find the ability to mount on MLOK cuts at roughly 1:30, 4:30, 7:30, 10:30 in addition to 12, 3, 6, and 9 provides better use than the pic rail.
 
Posts: 2442 | Location: Central Texas | Registered: August 22, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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The DD quad rail is one of the most robust rail systems out there. And although it’s pricy, it’s still worth it. There’s also a reason that when SOCOM moved to MLOK on the URG-1, they used the Geissele. And it has to do with rigidity and remounting of accessories.

For most users, you’ll not see much a difference in any of the quality rails. You just need to decide if you want to go old school with quads, or MLOK. Either choice is great.




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Posts: 35507 | Location: Logical | Registered: September 12, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I like everything Daniel Defense. Furthermore I’m a fan of pic, keymod, and mlok. I like them all and with use them all for whatever build I decide.

If you’re not doing the “clone” thing then go MLOK.

quote:
Originally posted by sjames:
Using some down time to knock out some projects, one of which is a MK18 (10.3” DD barrel) style upper for my SBR’d lowers.

Most of my built uppers/carbines have MLOK rails because they’re smooth/slender. I like Troy (I know) because they use a standard barrel but and clamp up tight.

Wrapping up the current project, I’m considering the merits of a DD RIS pic rail versus MLOK. I’m not a clone guy so I don’t care about the look but wondered about future use with an IR laser.

Is the the DD RIS going to help provide a more stable option for the future use of a IR laser? Is it worth the premium over a MLOK rail?

Whatcha think?
 
Posts: 700 | Location: NE Pennsylvania | Registered: December 10, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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