Hey all, newbie to rifle calibered pistols, but do have an Adams Arms piston upper. I know short barrels in rifle calibers are particularly loud, so, other than a suppressor, what does the Forum suggest as the best break to lessen or deaden the sound from this short length?

Try THIS

quote:

Originally posted by craigcpa:
..the best break to lessen or deaden the sound from this short length?

Every effective brake will increase muzzle blast volume to both the shooter and the people to the sides of the shooter. Every single one.

The best device to quiet the gun is a suppressor.

A blast forward device will push some of the blast volume down range, but it won't really quiet down the rifle report.

Noveske KX3 or KX5 or whatever they call the current iteration.


They were damn lucky the ATF never classified that device as a silencer. It is basically a single chamber silencer but is considered a flash hider by the ATF.

There’s also the PWS CQB Gen 2.

That KX5 looks promising, at 4.5 ounces.

I'm gonna start out with either a PWS FSC or an old dd muzzle climb mitigator I've got laying in the parts bin, for my 11.5" pistol build. If those are too obnoxious, then I'll give the KX5 a try.

quote:

Originally posted by IndianaBoy:
Noveske KX3 or KX5 or whatever they call the current iteration.


They were damn lucky the ATF never classified that device as a silencer. It is basically a single chamber silencer but is considered a flash hider by the ATF.

This. It’s basically a 1 baffle suppressor if you take one apart.

quote:

Originally posted by myrottiety:
This. It’s basically a 1 baffle suppressor if you take one apart.

The question, though, is not how it’s designed, but does it reduce the overall sound of the discharge? (I.e., not just what the shooter hears, but what the total sound signature is.)

quote:

Originally posted by IndianaBoy:
Noveske KX3 or KX5 or whatever they call the current iteration.


They were damn lucky the ATF never classified that device as a silencer. It is basically a single chamber silencer but is considered a flash hider by the ATF.

Considering how it’s called a “flaming pig”, it seems hard to believe that they are selling it as a “flash suppressor”.

As others have noted, it's called a "brake," but if quiet is what you want, you don't want a brake.

A 7.5" barrel is going to be loud almost no matter what you screw to it short of a suppressor.

quote:

Originally posted by Dwill104:

quote:

Originally posted by IndianaBoy:
Noveske KX3 or KX5 or whatever they call the current iteration.


They were damn lucky the ATF never classified that device as a silencer. It is basically a single chamber silencer but is considered a flash hider by the ATF.

Considering how it’s called a “flaming pig”, it seems hard to believe that they are selling it as a “flash suppressor”.

It's best termed a "flash director" so too with the sound. They're selling it as a flash suppressor because of the way things are named, and how it actually still IS a flash suppressor compared to an unadorned barrel.

The Flaming Pig is probably the best suggestion, such that it focuses the boom-boom downrange off the firing line.

I believe a better term to use is "linear comp".

5 of us retirees meet twice a week to shoot. Between us we have many SBR's/short uppers. The blast can be obnoxious to anyone standing to the side or shooting. We gathered all the linear comps we had and did testing with all of us voting to the effectiveness in shooting the 5.56. Between all of us we had 5 different types/brands, and we had a couple types we had multiples of.

Tied for 1st place - Noveske Flaming Pig and Spikes Barking Spider. Downside was the weight, cost, and diameter, but they sure work well. Could tell no difference between the 5.56 caliber and 30 caliber Barking Spiders. 30 caliber Spider was used with a 5/8x24 to 1/2x28 adapter. Reduced the recoil some due to the weight on our opinion. Even makes 16" bbls more pleasant to shoot/be around.

2nd place - KAW Valley and Midwest Industries Blast Diverter. KAW is nice and small and looks nice with its flutes; Blast Diverter looks kinda neat to some...sorta looks like it came off the end of a space age blaster weapon. I liked the Blast Diverter so much that I bought a 2nd one; made out of steel, it does add a little weight over aluminum or an A1/A2, but not a gross amount.

3rd place (but very close to 2nd place) was the Harbinger. Least expensive and simple; no need for any indexing, just screw it on. Not large either. Wait for a sale, and they can sometimes be under $20. I use mine on a 7.5" 5.56 upper.

Every linear comp did good compared GI A1 and A2 flash hiders and a bare muzzle in reducing sound to the shooter and bystanders. None took away the muzzle flash, just made the flash go more in front and/or narrowed the cone diameter of the flash.

Muzzle blast/flash was more intense from WC844 and WC846 powder than with W748.

One of the SBR uppers tried was a Daniel Defense Mk18 10.3". When the Pig, Spider, and Kaw linear comps were installed, the DD upper had failures to extract the empty. Those comps were increasing the back pressure, causing the BCG to go rearward faster before the chamber pressure went down enough to allow extraction of the empty. No problems when using the Diverter or Harbinger...it was like flipping a light switch when those 2 were installed (going from no problems to failure to extract). Talking to Midwest Industries, I was told the Diverter will give minimum to no increase in back pressure to the gas system. A Diverter now resides on that upper.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Dae Zee,

quote:

Originally posted by myrottiety:

quote:

Originally posted by IndianaBoy:
Noveske KX3 or KX5 or whatever they call the current iteration.


They were damn lucky the ATF never classified that device as a silencer. It is basically a single chamber silencer but is considered a flash hider by the ATF.

This. It’s basically a 1 baffle suppressor if you take one apart.

I can't find good pics online, but it appears the KX3 and KX5, are just flash cans, like this: https://www.kakindustry.com/kak-industry-flash-can
(But since they bear the Noveske name the KX3 & 5 just cost more)

If so, it's just a cone inside a tube, and nothing like a baffle.

Now, this one:
https://www.kawvalleyprecision...p/kvp-linear-blk.htm
Seems to be more like a "single baffle."

quote:

Originally posted by DMF:
Now, this one: ...
Seems to be more like a "single baffle."

I am curious why.
Is it because the front of the expansion chamber is more like a suppressor end cap? Or is there some sort of baffle or partition inside the device?

I have a KVP Linear Comp on a 10.5" AR. It's a big improvement over a standard flash hider as far as directing the sound away from the shooter.

quote:

Originally posted by sigfreund:

quote:

Originally posted by DMF:
Now, this one: ...
Seems to be more like a "single baffle."

I am curious why.
Is it because the front of the expansion chamber is more like a suppressor end cap? Or is there some sort of baffle or partition inside the device?

The former, not the latter.

Like I said it just "seems," that way, and I'm not saying that it's in any way a "silencer," as I don't have any direct experience with them.

I use the Troy Industries "Claymore" on my 7.5" AR. It isn't that it is more quiet, but it DOES focus the blast forward, away from the shooter.



blast by Dave Steier, on Flickr



Troy Industries Claymore Break by Dave Steier, on Flickr

I run the Kaw Valley linear comp/forwarder on my HD 10.5. It does a nice job of sending sound downrange but in a house you are going to be losing some hearing no matter what you do. The flash is impressive and noticable even in the daytime on an outdoor range.

It's not what the OP asked but I wonder about the benefits of sending increased sound and flash downrange. I was reading a piece by Maj Plaster who observed suppressed weapons and standard being fired during a firefight. He stated he noticed the downside of a suppressor was that it didn't get the bad guys heads down vs a loud rifle where they would all seek cover. I have no plans to get into a running gunfight with the NVA and my hats off to those who have, but it's an interesting observation.

As well I do a lot of reading on ballistics and wounding and there is an argument that psychological stimulus ( loud bang and large flash) could play a part in stopping a subject. I think we all can agree that putting holes in the vitals is the only sure answer for a stop but again it's something interesting when it comes to break vs can.

For going quiet I'd say a suppressor is your only option or if you just want it quiet for you, a set of walker game earmuffs or the like with a linear comp.

quote:

Originally posted by Anubismp:
I do a lot of reading on ballistics and wounding and there is an argument that psychological stimulus ( loud bang and large flash) could play a part in stopping a subject.

I call BS on that for us civilians. We're not infantry or snipers in the jungle -- we're in our homes. If we're using supersonic ammo on an unsuppressed rifle, the report is in the ballpark of 160 db. Put a suppressor on that and the report is still 130 db. Still very loud -- especially up close and likely within an enclosed structure. Loud enough to damage the hearing of anyone nearby without hearing pro.

quote:

Originally posted by DMF:

quote:

Originally posted by myrottiety:

quote:

Originally posted by IndianaBoy:
Noveske KX3 or KX5 or whatever they call the current iteration.


They were damn lucky the ATF never classified that device as a silencer. It is basically a single chamber silencer but is considered a flash hider by the ATF.

This. It’s basically a 1 baffle suppressor if you take one apart.

I can't find good pics online, but it appears the KX3 and KX5, are just flash cans, like this: https://www.kakindustry.com/kak-industry-flash-can
(But since they bear the Noveske name the KX3 & 5 just cost more)

If so, it's just a cone inside a tube, and nothing like a baffle.

Now, this one:
https://www.kawvalleyprecision...p/kvp-linear-blk.htm
Seems to be more like a "single baffle."

Is Noveske stuff expensive, yes but you’re comparing CM stainless steel to the aluminum construction of the KAK. Does that make it almost four times as expensive? Probably not but I’d rather have steel right there at the exit of all that hot gas.