In fact I think you have a combination of a rifle that is way overgassed with a suppressor, and hot ammo.

The rifle is cycling early and trying to extract the case while it is still obturated to the (dirty?) chamber walls.


I would say you need a heavier buffer, not lighter, and possibly an adjustable gas block as well.

I would not shoot any more of that ammo until you get some things checked out.

Contact Federal with the lot # and as them if they have seen popped primers.

Clean the chamber and see how the rifle acts with different ammo.

If it matters I've ran 100+ rounds of this case through my SBR suppressed with zero issues.

I'll clean it extremely well and continue with caution.

quote:

Originally posted by myrottiety:
If it matters I've ran 100+ rounds of this case through my SBR suppressed with zero issues.

I'll clean it extremely well and continue with caution.

What chamber do you have in the second rifle you tested the AE .223 through? On the surface it sounds like a tight or dirty chamber in the original rifle, but if the second rifle is NATO 5.56 then it's not a direct comparison.

quote:

Originally posted by SgtGold:

quote:

Originally posted by myrottiety:
If it matters I've ran 100+ rounds of this case through my SBR suppressed with zero issues.

I'll clean it extremely well and continue with caution.

What chamber do you have in the second rifle you tested the AE .223 through? On the surface it sounds like a tight or dirty chamber in the original rifle, but if the second rifle is NATO 5.56 then it's not a direct comparison.

Bahh... Good point. I thought they were both .223 wylde but went back. The SBR has a 10.5" Faxon in 5.56 so not apples to apples.

quote:

Originally posted by myrottiety:
Bahh... Good point. I thought they were both .223 wylde but went back. The SBR has a 10.5" Faxon in 5.56 so not apples to apples.

I wouldn't seat it. There are so many variations of Wylde chambers, just as there are of 5.56 you can't depend on the name to mean much of anything.

The reason I focused on the FTE manifestation is because in my experience, when an AR is overgassed and extraction is difficult, you either get rims ripped off, a broken extractor or a nasty case and sometimes all three. In your case you're not getting any of that and that's strange.

Diagnosing these issues on a forum is difficult at best and fraught with frustration but here goes.

If your buffer is too heavy, it means that by the time your BCG starts going backward to unlock the bolt (rotating the case at the same time to break any remaining seal against the wall,) the bullet has left the barrel and the pressure has dropped substantially and the carrier stops where it is.

If the gas pressure was adequate or more than adequate, a part of the rim would have been torn off or you would have a broken extractor as the one in the AR-15 is not the strongest design. Either way, the BCG was going back. Don't ask me how I know this.

I cannot explain the popped primers in light of a BCG that did not damage the case or get its extractor broken.

The fact you can mortar the BCG and case right after it refused to come out indicates to me there is not as much resistance in the chamber as one might think.

I think there is something that is not yet known.

try putting a popped primer back in the case and see what happens.

Plot thickens. I pull the upper when I get home. Looks like last round was a squib. I can see the round in the barrel not far From the chamber.

Need to get a full length rod to remove. Damn.

quote:

Originally posted by myrottiety:
Plot thickens. I pull the upper when I get home. Looks like last round was a squib. I can see the round in the barrel not far From the chamber.

Need to get a full length rod to remove. Damn.

Is the squib from the AE .223 55gn ammo?

I went back and looked. It’s actually independence ammo.

Squib

Well, I was prophetic now, wasn't I?

Anyway. this story has so many changes and flips, I'm totally confused. I'm happy to continue the discussion but I think we need a refresh.

Would you be so kind as to start again, from the top and provide as much detail as you can?

quote:

Originally posted by myrottiety:

quote:

Originally posted by NikonUser:
I might have missed it but when you say "failure to eject," does that mean the case stayed in the chamber hand the extractor jumped over the rim?

Not even. Like just locked up in the chamber. To eject spent shell had to mortar the gun. Didn't try to double feed so I can only assume the BCG didn't move at all.

Now your comment about the BCG not moving is making more sense. It appears that you have under powered ammo. I've actually seen this happen in real time. In some cases the BCG doesn't make it far enough back to fully extract the empty shell and it ends up rechambering the empty.

Independence had some super hot ammo a year or three ago that was problematic.

https://sigforum.com/eve/forums...935/m/9190013904/p/1

And that doesn't look like a squib. It looks like a too tight/improperly machined chamber, and the projectile is getting stuck in the lands while loading. If you don't fire the gun, you have to mortar the case out, and the projectile gets stuck and left behind.

My limited understanding of the Wylde chamber is that its purpose is to increase accuracy and it uses a shortened throat. The shortened throat can result in increased pressure, especially when the bullet contacts the lands prior to firing.

Hence overall length of the ammo would be of interest.

Hornady lists OAL for .223 as 2.260 while 5.56 is listed as 2.250.

Bill

quote:

Originally posted by bubbatime:
And that doesn't look like a squib. It looks like a too tight/improperly machined chamber, and the projectile is getting stuck in the lands while loading. If you don't fire the gun, you have to mortar the case out, and the projectile gets stuck and left behind.

That’s my impression as well. And if a round is fired with the bullet touching or forced into the rifling, that will raise chamber pressures which would account for the blown primers and deeply indented mark from the extractor channel on the case head.

As for what could cause the bullet to extend far enough to contact the rifling, it could be how the bullet is seated in the case, but that seems unlikely if the rounds fit into a magazine with no problem. The fact that the gun has been fired many times before without a problem complicates the issue, but perhaps it’s a combination of things. If the leade (distance to the rifling) is too short and the ammunition was loaded too hot the combination might have produced pressures that were great enough to blow the primers and cause timing problems.

I would have thought you would have noticed a significant absence of recoil or muzzle blast with a squib like that.....


You probably had to mortar it out because you were pulling the bullet from the cartridge case. Did it dump powder all over the place when you got it out?

Did you actually pull the trigger on the last round that you chambered, or did you extract the unfired cartridge?

quote:

Originally posted by SgtGold:

quote:

Originally posted by myrottiety:

quote:

Originally posted by NikonUser:
I might have missed it but when you say "failure to eject," does that mean the case stayed in the chamber hand the extractor jumped over the rim?

Not even. Like just locked up in the chamber. To eject spent shell had to mortar the gun. Didn't try to double feed so I can only assume the BCG didn't move at all.

Now your comment about the BCG not moving is making more sense. It appears that you have under powered ammo. I've actually seen this happen in real time. In some cases the BCG doesn't make it far enough back to fully extract the empty shell and it ends up rechambering the empty.

Except popped primers and brass flow into the ejector hole doesn't indicate underpowered ammo.


I'm honestly not sure what's going on. Need a more detailed breakdown of how the malfunctions transpired.

There may be more than one bullet in that bore.... but if that is the case it should have kaboomed.... maybe one of them stopped beyond the gas port and allowed enough relief to fire another......

quote:

Originally posted by MrMcGoo:
My limited understanding of the Wylde chamber is that its purpose is to increase accuracy and it uses a shortened throat. The shortened throat can result in increased pressure, especially when the bullet contacts the lands prior to firing.

Hence overall length of the ammo would be of interest.

Hornady lists OAL for .223 as 2.260 while 5.56 is listed as 2.250.

Bill

From the Wilson Combat website.

'The .223 Wylde is a hybrid .223/5.56 chamber designed by Bill Wylde to yield the accuracy advantages of the match .223 Remington commercial chambering, but without pressure or reliability failures when using high velocity 5.56 NATO spec ammunition. The .223 Wylde achieves better accuracy by having a chamber throat that is tighter than 5.56, but will still function reliably with military 5.56 ammunition because the case dimensions are the same. These facts lead to the .223 Wylde having superior target and varmint accuracy, a compatibility with all .223 and 5.56 NATO ammunitions, and being a top choice for competition shooters.'