Hi Guys, long time no post but I have been lurking.

I will be getting my grand father's firearms in the next few weeks, he didn't have much money and while he appreciated quality, he was generally very thrifty. So when he was looking for hunting rifles instead of buying anything new he would get a cheap surplus and sporterize it himself.

The rifle in question is a type 38 Arisaka. I believe he stock was original but it has been cut down, and mounting points have been drilled into the receiver to mount a scope.

The issue I have is that I want to shoot it and take the rest of our family to shoot it, but 6.5x50 Jap is next to impossible to source in CA. I'd like to shoot it regularly if possible and reloading for it is not a path I want to go down.

So my question is what are my options for a simple caliber conversion to something that is much more common in 2023 Ideally that I can pick up at a well stocked LGS? I've wanted a 6.5 Creedmor rifle but the pressure difference between 6.5 Creedmor and 6.5x55 has me a bit concerned. Grandpa would want the rifle used not sitting in a safe which is what will happen if I cant source ammo.

Options, opinions?

See if something here has anything you think is helpful.

leave it be,


take your time searching for factory ammo,
it is out there, you just have to be patient and check secondary markets like gunborker for loaded ammo, (Norma and others used to load it, and it pops up now and again)

if you are planning on putting lots of rounds down range, then either spend the $$ on the ammo, or reload,


rechambering, or rebarreling, would make it no longer Grandpa's prize deer gun,



if it were mine, I would see if that recoil pad was still flexible and replace if needed and find a Lyman, Redfield, or Pacific rear sight ( see the holes in right side of the receiver) or upgrade the scope


and shoot it as is,

IMO the stock was a new stock that was purchased to sporterize this rifle. Because the original stock for these rifles have a much more blended in shape to the pistol grip. If this is a modified original stock someone spend a good bit of time re-shaping the pistol grip. In addition there is the matter of the checkering, that did not exist on the original type 38's. BTW, that checkering looks 100% Professional and not something done by a "shade tree mechanic". Note, if your grandfather was a gunsmith by trade then he would have had the skills to produce this rifle.

Ammunition. First off, per Wikipedia the ammunition for this rifle is 6.5 x 50mm, not 6.5 x 55mm. It's also a semi rimmed case and this may cause feed issues when trying to convert it to 6.5 Creedmore. It may be possible to re-chamber this rifle in 6.5 Creedmore but you'll need to locate a very good gunsmith to do the work and I suspect that it will cost more than setting up a single stage reloading press to fabricate this ammunition. Note, Lee and Hornady both make 2 part die sets for the 6.5 JAP ammo. In addition RCBS has case forming dies that can allow the Arisaka case to be formed from 30.06 brass.

Good news is that you have 2 options available, converting the rifle or keeping the rifle as is and making your own ammunition. BTW, I expect that there are also online sources for this ammunition available. Unfortunately California won't allow you this option so you may want to consider purchasing a vacation cabin in Nevada.

From Stylophile's thread right below this one:

Graf & Sons has ammo (if they'll ship to Calistan.)
https://www.grafs.com/retail/c...gory/categoryId/164?

From what I have read, the Type 38 action is more than strong enough to handle 6.5 Creedmore. But not sure what it would cost to re chamber, and if the bore size matches up, etc, etc.

6.5 mm Japanese is really a great “almost” intermediate cartridge that would be a great caliber as long as you weren’t expecting to run hundreds of rounds through it regularly.

Bill R

I had a Type 38 carbine that was rechambered by the Chinese post-war for 7.62x39. It did alright.

quote:

Originally posted by Scooter123:
Good news is that you have 2 options available, converting the rifle or keeping the rifle as is and making your own ammunition. BTW, I expect that there are also online sources for this ammunition available. Unfortunately California won't allow you this option so you may want to consider purchasing a vacation cabin in Nevada.

Actually, a CA resident who gets an 03 FFL (Curio and relic) and a CA Certificate of Eligibility (COE) is exempt from the ammo ban and can order online. Not all online vendors will ship to CA residents with an 03 FFL and a COE, but a lot of them will.

ETA: Ammoseek shows two vendors, Get Loaded PA at $2.29 per round and Steinel Ammo at $2.30 per round with better shipping costs. I wasn't able to figure out if Get Loaded PA would ship to CA resident holders of an 03 FFL and a COE, but Steinel's shipping policy starts off with:

"We can not ship ammunition to California or New York residents that do not hold an FFL and COE (Certificate of Exemption). Please submit a copy of your documents to sales@steinelammo.com or indicate the ship-to address of your local FFL, with their permission."

So there is one option for buying online.

Something I failed to mention is the condition of that stock. That split will need to be repaired by a Pro or it will be in two pieces rather quickly. Hopefully that crack isn't saturated in oil, if it is there will be some long soaks in acetone of methanol to get the oil cleaned out so that a high grade glue or epoxy will give a good hold. The bad news is that this soaking will remove all of the oil in the stock that gives it the current well aged appearance.

Note, inserting dowels will not provide an effective repair that can withstand live fire. If you want a wall hanger dowels will work for that.

I dont know if you plan to take the vintage scope off or not, but it appears that at one point, the scope moved in the mount (wear mark on the tube) and the rings were then cranked down hard and unevenly to better hold it under recoil. How does it look when you sight through it?

Dies https://www.midwayusa.com/prod...011221135?pid=335612

Press https://www.midwayusa.com/prod...101303247?pid=403729

Brass
6.5x50 Jap can be made from 270 win brass. You have to remove the expander ball, resize, trim then you can expand according to the handloaders manual of cartridge conversions. (During the first sizing you are pushing the shoulder down, that’s why you remove the expander ball)

Plus projectiles,primers and powder

It’s a bolt action hunting rifle, not an AR, so it’s not like you’re gonna run thousands of rounds thru the rifle. 6.5 Jap is a decent round, and frankly, it’d be far cheaper to stockpile a lifetime of ammo than to get it rebarreled into something else. I’d order 200-500 rounds of Norma ammo and call it a day.

As mentioned above, the stock needs a little TLC, some glue in that crack, and some tung oil will do wonders.

quote:

Originally posted by Scooter123:
Something I failed to mention is the condition of that stock. That split will need to be repaired by a Pro or it will be in two pieces rather quickly. Hopefully that crack isn't saturated in oil, if it is there will be some long soaks in acetone of methanol to get the oil cleaned out so that a high grade glue or epoxy will give a good hold. The bad news is that this soaking will remove all of the oil in the stock that gives it the current well aged appearance.

Note, inserting dowels will not provide an effective repair that can withstand live fire. If you want a wall hanger dowels will work for that.

That looks like to OG stock. If it is that “split” is supposed to be there. The Japanese used two piece stocks. I think due to age and drying out it just became a little wider.

quote:

Originally posted by 357fuzz:
That looks like to OG stock. If it is that “split” is supposed to be there. The Japanese used two piece stocks. I think due to age and drying out it just became a little wider.

Correct.

Arisaka stocks were commonly made from two pieces of wood dovetailed together, due to a dearth of wide enough stock blanks. As the wood ages and shrinks, the gap between the two pieces can widen, but such a seam is not indicative of a "crack" or "split" caused by damage.





This technique of dovetailed two piece buttstocks was also not uncommon to see on some other bolt action rifles during that time period, such as the Polish Wz. 29 Mausers:



Or on some late WW1 production Gewehr 98 rifles:

quote:

Originally posted by 357fuzz:
That looks like to OG stock. If it is that “split” is supposed to be there. The Japanese used two piece stocks.

Interesting! I learn something new everyday. If that is the surplus stock, then whoever did the recontouring and that checkering job did great work. Put a few more coats of boiled linseed oil on that stock to freshen her up, and shoot her as is.

Do you have any of your grand dad's hunting trophies?

Because here's my recommendation if so for what it's worth:
Clean it only enough to ensure it won't rot or rust, hang it on a wall near his best trophy taken with it, and admire them often.

I once sold an original condition Type 99 Arisaka online to a member of another forum. When he got the rifle, he called me mad that I sold him a rifle with a split stock and didn't tell him. He obviously knew nothing about Arisakas, but to his credit he took the time to google them after I explained about the two piece stocks and all worked out well.

quote:

Originally posted by RogueJSK:

quote:

Originally posted by 357fuzz:
That looks like to OG stock. If it is that “split” is supposed to be there. The Japanese used two piece stocks. I think due to age and drying out it just became a little wider.

Correct.

Arisaka stocks were commonly made from two pieces of wood dovetailed together, due to a dearth of wide enough stock blanks. As the wood ages and shrinks, the gap between the two pieces can widen, but such a seam is not indicative of a "crack" or "split" caused by damage.





This technique of dovetailed two piece buttstocks was also not uncommon to see on some other bolt action rifles during that time period, such as the Polish Wz. 29 Mausers:



Or on some late WW1 production Gewehr 98 rifles:

what he said,





and yes, someone did a good job working that stock

My 6.5 has the same split in the stock. Mine had the bolt handle sawed off bent and rewelded on something similar to yours.

I did noticed that your "mum" looks like it is still intact. Mine is too. I will never deface mine.

I am no expert but it looks like someone wanted to make the stock resemble a Winchester model 70.

I've seen a number of 6.5 Arisaka rechambered to 6.5x55, but if it were me, I'd buy ammo or brass and some dies to reload it with and not bother with the rechambering.

It used to be common to rechamber the 7.7 Arisaka to 30-06. A vet family member of mine had one. Accuracy wasn't much due to the slightly undersized bullet, but it worked he killed a few deer with it.