I was tested at a recent OpSpec class, and ran the Bill drill fairly well. However while shooting I can only move the trigger so fast, and cannot get my finger to work faster. In the test it seemed like I was in slow motion. I wanted to shoot faster, but my finger could only go medium speed. My splits were about .22. Some of the other shooter's splits were .16 to .19.

I am using a P320 that has Gray guns trigger work. the pull is about a 4 lbs. In our muscles there are both slow and fast twitch muscles. I have read that a person can train to change their ratio of slow vs fast twist muscles.

Does anyone have any recommendations as to training so that fingers can move faster? Lately, while driving to work in the morning, I have been working my trigger finger (without a gun) to work faster. However I do not see much progress.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: c1steve,

I’m curious as well because I have the same issues. I’ve always assumed that the difference in how fast people can operate a trigger at maximum speed were the same as the differences among athletes: some are always going to be capable of performing better due to genetic differences no matter how they all train.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: sigfreund,

I've wondered the same thing at times and it usually comes to my attention when I'm with a buddy of mine who shoots really fast splits. I can't figure out how he does it. His first shot is slow and his hits aren't as neatly clustered as mine so I still run the drill faster than him but damn can he let those rounds rip.

If you are trying to run a better bill drill you could focus on increasing your accuracy while maintaining the same splits or increase the distance of the target but still keep the same splits. You could also focus on that time to first shot.

If you are trying to shoot better times in a match I would try running the bill drill but on to 3 targets. 2 rounds per target but work on running the same time of your regular bill drill.

Remember splits are for show and transitions are for dough.

I know this doesn't answer your question about faster splits but hopefully it's still useful info.

I know the Russians studied slow and fast twitch muscles in athletes, and determined that with training the athletes could change the ratio. I am doing okay on accuracy, and just bought a size large grip module for my P320. At the OpSpec class I just went to, JLJones recommended using a large rather than a small. I have not shot it yet, but it feels much more stable in my hand.

My goal is .20 or faster, with excellent accuracy. Trying to work on both these improvements at once.

A useful exercise is to use a partially full water bottle as a resistance to your trigger finger. Squeeze it more and more rapidly to gain reflex agility and strength. Easy to do while driving or relaxing in a chair. In a weeks time your rapidity can significantly increase.

I wish my splits and transitions were only limited by the speed of my trigger finger.

Another thing to keep in mind is that the tighter your grip with your strong hand, the more difficult it is to move the trigger finger quickly. Try relaxing the grip with that hand a little bit and see if it helps.

I am trying the water bottle technique kallotterg recommended. It appears to work better than working my finger with no resistance. This mini workout is great in that I can do it while driving.

Let us know if it gets those splits down .

quote:

Originally posted by DBS:
I wish my splits and transitions were only limited by the speed of my trigger finger.

DBS is right.

Split times may be the least important factor in improving your shooting speed. Improving your target to target transitions and speeding up your movement from shooting position to position will be the things that can improve your real-world shooting speed.

Split times, merely pulling the trigger fast, matters almost not at all.

Are you also prepping the trigger during recoil or waiting for the sights to settle? If you are already aggressively prepping the trigger in recoil, I don't know any other high-speed techniques...

Are you having trouble hitting things at those speeds?
- variations on the Bill Drill is one fix.

Are you physically incapable of pulling the trigger faster?
- dryfire rapid trigger pulls using a metronome. Start around 200 beats per second and increase by 20 at a time. Keep in time with the metronome.

Don't know which is the problem?
- Get a timer and shoot a bill drill into the berm and see what you are capable of (speed) without the limitation the ego places on us when we need to hit the target. The dirt don't care where you hit. So you will be fast.

quote:

Originally posted by hrhawk:
Are you having trouble hitting things at those speeds?
- variations on the Bill Drill is one fix.

Are you physically incapable of pulling the trigger faster?
- dryfire rapid trigger pulls using a metronome. Start around 200 beats per second and increase by 20 at a time. Keep in time with the metronome.

Don't know which is the problem?
- Get a timer and shoot a bill drill into the berm and see what you are capable of (speed) without the limitation the ego places on us when we need to hit the target. The dirt don't care where you hit. So you will be fast.

Harold for the win! As usual this is good advice and will really give you an accurate starting point.

I am liking the tone of this thread!

I just won my 3rd GSSF pistol in my 3rd match -> Hello "master" (small 'm' intentional). No more easy guns!
Looking at my scores and other Master scores from previous matches, I need to really up my game. I cut almost 20 seconds off some of my old scores by focusing on accuracy with some speed added but now I really need BOTH.
One TV show had "TGO" Rob Leatham saying that pulling the trigger wasn't the slow part for most shooters but getting OFF the trigger, (cutting down on the follow through), was what was *really* needed to speed up.
Anyone hear of this or able to add any insights?

I just bought a real shot timer to get rid of the app on the iPad so I can get in some much needed practice especially if I don't bring along a shooting buddy. (the app was a PITA to use alone)

**amhaynie** - email inbound!

TGO FOR THE WIN. If you are not resetting in recoil then you are some version of slow.

quote:

Originally posted by KMitch200:
I am liking the tone of this thread!

I just won my 3rd GSSF pistol in my 3rd match -> Hello "master" (small 'm' intentional). No more easy guns!
Looking at my scores and other Master scores from previous matches, I need to really up my game. I cut almost 20 seconds off some of my old scores by focusing on accuracy with some speed added but now I really need BOTH.
One TV show had "TGO" Rob Leatham saying that pulling the trigger wasn't the slow part for most shooters but getting OFF the trigger, (cutting down on the follow through), was what was *really* needed to speed up.
Anyone hear of this or able to add any insights?

I just bought a real shot timer to get rid of the app on the iPad so I can get in some much needed practice especially if I don't bring along a shooting buddy. (the app was a PITA to use alone)

**amhaynie** - email inbound!

This shooting buddy just got your email and responded.

Lets hit the range and work on it!!

Metronome, copious amounts of dry fire.... be mindful of the sights, running the trigger at .15 splits does nothing if your trigger control goes to shit in the process.

Another way to get faster bill drill times is to start with doubles.... when you get the split between the two shots down to where you want it to be, add a 3rd shot, rinse, repeat.

This is all most helpful, lots of experience giving out tips. I will try the metronome.

I have tried the shot timer without a target, and still my splits are about .20 or slower. However I do find that shooting into the berm is very beneficial. It helps me concentrate on the front sight, and not the target.

"If you are not resetting in recoil then you are some version of slow."

I may be pinning the trigger to the rear under pressure, as mentioned above. Thanks for mentioning it. I recently installed a larger grip on the P320, which is helping. The smaller grip reduced my accuracy and appeared to affect my trigger manipulation.

I can transition quite well, that part is good.

To those following this thread, I found only one metronome that would go above 250 BPM. However there are hundreds of metronome apps, for both smart phones and computers. I tried a few, and found the Metronome 4 on the Microsoft store site to work well.

https://www.microsoft.com/en-u...onome-4/9nblggh09q15

Most shooters on this forum will probably be in the 240-300 beat range.

We had the good fortune to work with some of the fastest shooters in the world. One seemed to me to focus on the finger as you are questioning.

The other focused on the need to get the P320 to reset much faster and harder. If the reset is pushing your finger forward, it seemed to me that instead of thinking of the finger as merely not losing contact with the trigger face and then prepping the next shot, the shooter could produce very fast splits by letting the trigger push his finger forward to break the shot again once the reset was felt.

Anyway, that was my analysis as I tried to work on the issue for the shooter.

Of course, there is the other thought process of finding the reset balance in the sweet spot for something like a controlled bump fire - so long as you can keep a good sight alignment for the speed.

I remember ROing a match where the shooter was required to start with the pistol in hand, shooting under a table while seated. The start position was loaded with the pistol directly in front of the body under the table with, as I remember, 3 targets. During the day several people bump fired because, it seemed to me, that they changed their grip and finger placement, leaving them on the sweet spot.

This is obviously all for whatever it is worth. I am just on the path myself but I've seen some amazing shooting by others and have asked and studied a bit of what they do.

I bought a response time app for my iPhone that was supposed to help someone improve one's times. It didn't really help, although it taunted me a lot; so, I'm on to thinking about just how to prep by staying in contact with the trigger face by letting the reset push my finger forward instead of waiting for it to catch up to where I stop to wait for it.

Hopefully, some more of the fast split folks will give you more thoughts about his/her technique. It is a very interesting question. Is it equipment? Is it nature? Is it technique? All of the above?