Velocities at the end of this post.

This is hardly a new subject, but may still be of interest to some.

As I was picking up payment for the last couple of guns I had on consignment at my nearest gun shop, I was surprised to see a P365 with manual safety in the display case. I had decided that if I were going to carry a small striker fired pistol I would want it with the safety, but didn’t really expect to see one for sale, especially these days. It caught my eye, though, and I debated about a minute before saying I’d take it. After the three day wait that background checks are taking these days I picked it up yesterday, and to the range this morning.




When I paid for the pistol I noticed that it was $60 less than a similar gun without the safety. After I got home I began to wonder if there was something different about it, perhaps it didn’t have night sights—? But yes it does, evidently the same X-Ray sights I have on several other models, so that was a good start.

The safety lever is ambidextrous and small and unobtrusive. It is nevertheless easy to engage/disengage, and has a very positive feel in both positions.

The pistol came with two 10-round magazines, one with the finger extension, and one without. I bought two more at the time and I’ll probably pick up at least a couple more from Gun Mag Warehouse.

And about the magazines: This is mentioned in other reviews, and it’s true: Loading 10 rounds is a chore. I can manage it even with my old and decrepit fingers, but just barely. I definitely appreciated having an UpLULA even though I seldom use it otherwise. What I did find, though, was that the two extra mags I purchased at the same time as the gun and which I left loaded for several days were easier to load than the ones fresh from the gun box.

Another thing I discovered is that I cannot rack a closed slide on a seated magazine loaded with 10 rounds. It’s evidently just a hand strength thing, but it made me realize that if I carry the gun, any reload mags can’t be loaded with more than nine rounds in case I find myself trying to chamber a round from a closed slide. At this point the factory 12 and 15-round magazines seem to be unobtainable, but if I can ever find any they will be what I carry for reloads. I did test the functioning of firing the gun when loaded with 10 plus one in the chamber, and the one time I did that there was no problem—as I was somewhat concerned about.

As is visible in the photo I switched the magazine catch to the right side of the grip so I can depress it with my trigger finger, something I do with all my pistols when possible. Unlike larger guns, though, it’s necessary to rotate the gun in my grip to reach back for the catch, and because of the small size of the grip that interferes with the magazine’s dropping free. That was also the case when I switched my grip on the gun to my left hand and depressed the catch with my thumb. My procedure is to therefore pull the magazine out after it’s released so I can insert the reload.

The measured trigger pull weight out of the box was 6 pounds, 12 ounces, or significantly more than that of my two full size P320s. I didn’t, however, find it to be excessive. The pull stroke is creepy (as I like it), and it was easy to control the letoff.

In this first session I fired a total of 100 rounds, 85 rounds of 115 grain Blazer Brass FMJ, and 15 rounds of Speer 124 grain +P Gold Dot hollow points. There were no malfunctions and despite its small size the gun was easier to control and use to engage targets quickly than I anticipated. The short sight radius of 4.9 inches versus 6.5" for a full size P320 seemed to make the front sight appear enough larger that I didn’t feel I had as precise a sight picture when aiming for precision shots, but I was satisfied with my practical accuracy as pictured below.

Some reviewers have complained about the felt recoil of this small pistol, and I wondered how bad it would be. As it turned out, I had nothing to worry about. A small, light pistol will obviously produce the sensation of more felt recoil, but I didn’t find either the Blazer training ammunition or the Gold Dot +P stuff to be unpleasant to shoot. The Gold Dot obviously had more recoil due to its greater power, but I find the recoil from shooting 40 S&W ammunition from a full size P320 to be more noticeable and somewhat painful to my arthritic hands and wrists.

I fired several different types of strings, from (attempts at) precision to rapid fire. The gun is hardly a target pistol, but I am completely satisfied with my practical accuracy with it. Some of my groups impacted left of the point of aim, but because that wasn’t a consistent result I believe my grip and trigger control may have been at fault. I have a Grayguns straight trigger on order to match several of my other handguns, so we’ll see if that makes any difference. The stock curved trigger does not fit my finger well.

Shooting Results:

The first five shots out of the box at 5 yards. The three upper shots were with the front sight dot covering the aiming paster diamond. The other two were with the top of the front sight blade bisecting the paster.





7 yards rapid fire; splits were about 0.5 second.





3 yards unsighted fire. The pistol was pushed toward the target starting from the low ready and fired when I could see it in my peripheral vision, but without acquiring the sights. Each shot was timed separately and the times were about 0.8 second from start signal to discharge. The results are about as well as I expect with a full size pistol.





Nondominant (left) hand only, 5 yards; splits were about 1.0 second.





15 yards, Speer 124 grain +P Gold Dot hollow point. Deliberate fire.





25 yards, Blazer 115 grain FMJ. Deliberate fire.





In summary I am very pleased with this gun for its size and features. I was anticipating that it would be more of a “desperation” weapon rather than one I could be confident of under the same conditions that I train for with my full size handguns. Now I’m looking forward to shooting one of my comprehensive skills courses with it to see how well I can really do with more of a challenge.

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Update 18Aug20:

I have straight triggers on several of my SIGs these days and decided this P365 also needed one. I ordered a Grayguns version from Top Gun Supply, partially because it was available, but mostly because it had a setscrew adjustment.

After TGS's usual outstanding service, I received it quickly and got around to installing it today. Unfortunately the install was a very frustrating experience. It appeared that the finish had been applied after the setscrew was installed, and the screw was frozen solid. Despite resorting to pliers and even some torch heat, I rounded off the hex wrench without budging the screw.

I finally filed down the screw so that the trigger would move far enough to release the striker, and then the YouTube installation video linked at the Grayguns site made the job relatively easy.

After that, things were great: I really like the feel of the straight trigger, and although I don't know if it was due to the design of the trigger and its better leverage, or the 100 rounds I fired with the factory trigger, the pull weight dropped from a measured 6 pounds, 12 ounces, to 5 pounds, 6 ounces.

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Update 19Aug20:

Above I mentioned my plan to fire a comprehensive handgun skills course with the P365, and I wasn’t sure how well I would do because the grip is so much smaller than those of the pistols I’m accustomed to. Today I got around to firing the 30-round course three times using an oversized holster and drawing from under a cover garment which I don’t normally do. The course tests a variety of skills includes clearing a random dummy round malfunction and shooting at modified IDPA targets at 3, 7, and 15 yards, including two stages with dominant and nondominant hands only. I also used the safety throughout the courses. The two reload stages of the course were the most difficult because dropping the empty magazine is a little awkward due to the small grip.

Somewhat to my surprise, I passed on speed and accuracy for 26 of the total 27 stages for the three course runs. The failed stage was due to a miss out of the modified scoring zones at 15 yards. To say I am pleased with how well I can shoot this little pistol is a gross understatement.

And to top off today’s activities, I just got notice from Gun Mag Warehouse that 12-round magazines are back in stock.

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Update 25Aug20

Velocities measured today with LabRadar chronograph.

First figure is the average velocity of 10 shots from the P365. Prior figures for the same load from P229/P225 and P226 follow in parentheses.

Winchester Q4318 NATO, 124 grain FMJ: 1081 fps (P229: 1130; P226: 1160)

Speer 124 grain +P Gold Dot hollow point (13 shots for this): 1128 fps (P229: 1206; P226: 1213)

Federal 115 grain +P+, 9BPLE: 1218 fps (P225, 3.9" barrel: 1245)

Note that some loads were from different lots over a period of time.

As reported before, shooting hot loads with the P365 was “snappy,” but I have not found any thus far to be unpleasant or uncontrollable.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: sigfreund,

The straight trigger is an improvement.

Good review. I haven’t yet seen a 365 with a safety. I would probably be tempted to buy one as well, particularly if it was priced at a discount like yours was.

Congratulations on your new 365, sigfreund!

With the reduced price you paid, was it a Blue Label gun?

quote:

Originally posted by ARMT Guy:
With the reduced price you paid, was it a Blue Label gun?

No. The prices on the two guns were just what were marked on the shop tags.

I haven’t checked on the availability of that particular model as an individual officer purchase item in quite some time, and just assumed that that would be a futile search now. Even after charging for the gun, tax, and a couple of full price magazines the shop still owed me almost $200 from consignment sales, so it was almost like it was free ( ). I therefore didn’t feel any hesitation in snapping it up.

Congratulations, and thanks for a great review! I bought my P365 with a manual safety as well. I migrated over from a P938, and I was so used to ("muscle memory") disengaging the safety before firing, I thought I might as well just keep those muscles trained!

Got my wife this exact model. When we visit the range, I was surprised how well she shot will this, she rang a 12” steel plate repeatedly at 7 yards. She shot this much better than her S&W Shield.

Congrats and great shooting! Sig hit it out of the park with the current P365 line.

I bought the same gun, early July. It was $499 at Dunham’s, surprisingly.

I’ve been happy with it. I agree, with the slide closed trying to insert a fully loaded mag can be problematic. The idea of shorting one round in a magazine creates various discussions, I’m not bothered doing so.

I got a few extra 15 round mags, the 12 rounders seem about ideal.

I was also very pleasantly surprised the first time I shot a P365. I describe it as that it shoots like a larger gun. Felt recoil is not bad, and it’s just surprisingly easy to shoot well.

For me, the small size and shorter sight radius mean I have to work a little harder to maintain sight alignment, but getting good hits at moderate distances (15-25 yards) is definitely doable. I can’t be as cavalier about it as with a larger gun. It’s easier to get movement of the gun with each trigger press because of the small size.

I like the safety model and I got it at a pretty good price at Bass Pro last year. The safety locks solid and is big enough to maneuver, unlike some other pistols I have owned. I am pretty impressed with the gun overall.

Great review Sigfreund. I waited until they came out with the safety models and got both the 365 and the XL with safety. Extremely happy with both of them.

Great write up, thank you. I was finally able to fire one a few weeks ago. As you stated, really no recoil to be concerned with at all, it confirmed what I already knew, I need one!

They really are pretty incredible guns.

When I bought my XL the dealer had two in the case, one was $50 less. They were both new and identical guns. I asked and was told that they paid less for the new one so it was priced lower.

Nice pickup. I have one of each, originally one for me (no-safety) and the MS for the missus. She didn't like the recoil so now both are mine. They've run flawlessly to date but yeah, the factory-supplied 10-round mags really sucked at first. For me reliance on the Maglula was a must in order to get the rounds in. The springs have softened considerably since, but it's still a task to get the last couple of rounds loaded into those mags without the loader. And similarly to you, both the extra 10 round and 12 round mags that I've since bought were a bit easier to manage during loading. However neither of mine has any issues chambering from a full mag, either 10 or 12 round.

Normally it might seem weird that the two guns that you found were priced differently; everything being the same except the manual safety, dealer cost for the guns is the same. However as we know, these times are not normal. Most dealers are scrambling for product as their usual supply chains are stretched thin and deliveries are fewer and farther between. It wouldn't surprise me if your MS version was bought direct from SIG and the other was obtained through a distributor. In our shop I've had to resort to that with certain gun brands and models. That scenario would certainly explain the price difference, where the increase with the more expensive no-safety version would be about right to take into account the usual middleman markup on guns in the P365's price range.

The manual safety is required for some nanny states as well as the loaded chamber indicator or witness hole, sometimes known as the Masshole as it is required in MA

Update about straight trigger at end of first post.

I put the straight trigger in my P365's; I have the Grayguns trigger and the factory straight trigger. I went with straight triggers in all the P320's, and really like them.

The damaged setscrew should merit a factory replacement, though if you're happy with the travel and it functions, then it's probably fine. The fact that its stuck and rounded out would drive me nuts.

I knew that TGS would have taken the trigger back with no questions, but I have a session later this week that I wanted to use the pistol for, and I knew that once I had the screw filed to the proper length it wouldn't matter that I couldn't adjust it directly.

My only concern would be that the set screw might loosen with vibration when firing; if it rotates out no problem, but if it rotates in, then it could disable the pistol.