I was reading the Sig web site last night and found that Sig sets its sights up to "cover the bull". I have always shot a pistol by having the top of front sight even with the top of back sight and the bull sitting on top of the front sight. or "pumpkin on the post" Which do you use, 'cover the bull' or 'pumpkin on the post" LOL I feel silly saying that but it is accurate. Carl
May 29, 2017, 12:15 PM
Bofire
this is from sig, FAQ's
My SIG SAUER pistol is not accurate. Why? What should I do?
All SIG SAUER production duty/combat pistols are set up to use a “combat” sight picture. This is where the front sight completely covers the bullseye of the target. Using a six o’clock (“pumpkin on a post”) or center mass (“half’n’half”) sight picture will result in low impact. SIG SAUER, Inc sights in all non-sporting and non-target pistols for 2.5 inch groupings @ 15 yards. If you are still having trouble please contact Customer Service for further help and instruction. Please have your serial number ready. There are also very helpful free Internet sites that cover pistol group analysis.
May 29, 2017, 01:56 PM
az4783054
HK and many other manufacturers use the same "combat" sight picture since they're primarily defensive pistols shot at defensive ranges. It's common knowledge of anyone who has owned SIG pistols for awhile.
Some accept it, others change the front sight to provide them with a "6 o'clock" picture. Those are more "bulls eye" shooters.
The sights are not set in stone and most learn to shoot their SIG pistols in that manner and do fine. Set up your pistol to whatever combination of sights that you shoot well with using the sight picture you prefer.
I've enjoyed my time here, but tired of the whining and general management. Time to move on.
May 29, 2017, 02:39 PM
jljones
quote:
Originally posted by Bofire: this is from sig, FAQ's
My SIG SAUER pistol is not accurate. Why? What should I do?
All SIG SAUER production duty/combat pistols are set up to use a “combat” sight picture. This is where the front sight completely covers the bullseye of the target. Using a six o’clock (“pumpkin on a post”) or center mass (“half’n’half”) sight picture will result in low impact. SIG SAUER, Inc sights in all non-sporting and non-target pistols for 2.5 inch groupings @ 15 yards. If you are still having trouble please contact Customer Service for further help and instruction. Please have your serial number ready. There are also very helpful free Internet sites that cover pistol group analysis.
"Combat Sight Picture" was a whizbang answer that customer service came up with to "combat" the rising tide of complaints they received when SIG stopped actually shooting the guns for zero when they leave the factory. Few, if any will zero worth a damn at any kind of distance because they throw the flavor of the day sights on them before they leave the door.
The SIG Sauer Academy does not teach "combat sight picture" despite what customer service may tell you their guns are designed for.
"It's a bold strategy, Cotton. Let's see if it works out for them"
May 29, 2017, 06:31 PM
GaryBF
You can achieve any sight picture you want by changing the front or rear sight as needed. Almost all of my SIGs have a #9 rear sight so I can aim sub-center.
May 30, 2017, 01:26 PM
JonFrost
quote:
Originally posted by jljones:
quote:
Originally posted by Bofire: this is from sig, FAQ's
My SIG SAUER pistol is not accurate. Why? What should I do?
All SIG SAUER production duty/combat pistols are set up to use a “combat” sight picture. This is where the front sight completely covers the bullseye of the target. Using a six o’clock (“pumpkin on a post”) or center mass (“half’n’half”) sight picture will result in low impact. SIG SAUER, Inc sights in all non-sporting and non-target pistols for 2.5 inch groupings @ 15 yards. If you are still having trouble please contact Customer Service for further help and instruction. Please have your serial number ready. There are also very helpful free Internet sites that cover pistol group analysis.
"Combat Sight Picture" was a whizbang answer that customer service came up with to "combat" the rising tide of complaints they received when SIG stopped actually shooting the guns for zero when they leave the factory. Few, if any will zero worth a damn at any kind of distance because they throw the flavor of the day sights on them before they leave the door.
The SIG Sauer Academy does not teach "combat sight picture" despite what customer service may tell you their guns are designed for.
What do they teach for sight picture?
p229Extreme/P226Tac-Ops/P226 Extreme/P226 SAO) P226 X-5 Blue Moon/P226 X-5 Black and White
May 30, 2017, 01:39 PM
Chris17404
IMO, this is the only sight picture that makes sense, and all pistols should be zeroed as such. I just don't see any other logical option.
May 30, 2017, 05:59 PM
10X-Shooter
Amen. I can't stand that new pistols are sent out with sights meant to obscured the target. The above sight picture is the only one I use. If I recall, the 6-8 combination is the one that provides the above sight picture, correct?
May 30, 2017, 06:28 PM
Cobra21
quote:
Originally posted by jljones:
...The SIG Sauer Academy does not teach "combat sight picture" despite what customer service may tell you their guns are designed for.
This is what I love about SIGforum. Very few fanboys here. I love my SIG's, but I'm old enough to be told the truth. Thanks to all of you who willing to set the record straight.
Risk the consequences of honesty...
May 30, 2017, 06:37 PM
NavyGuy
An Exeter built P226 I had shot to the "cover the target" hold, and another one (W. German) shot properly as pictured above except with 3 dot sights. My P228 also shoots aligned as above with Mepro NS.
Men fight for liberty and win it with hard knocks. Their children, brought up easy, let it slip away again, poor fools. And their grandchildren are once more slaves.
-D.H. Lawrence
May 30, 2017, 07:36 PM
Bofire
Is a Sig sight #6 taller or shorter than a #8? Carl
May 30, 2017, 07:56 PM
hrcjon
SIG rule, numbers up groups up. So as a physical matter taller.
“So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong, and strike at what is weak.”
May 30, 2017, 08:15 PM
GP229
So now we have three of these threads going...
Two in the "Armorers" forum and this one.
May 30, 2017, 08:20 PM
jljones
quote:
Originally posted by JonFrost:
quote:
Originally posted by jljones:
quote:
Originally posted by Bofire: this is from sig, FAQ's
My SIG SAUER pistol is not accurate. Why? What should I do?
All SIG SAUER production duty/combat pistols are set up to use a “combat” sight picture. This is where the front sight completely covers the bullseye of the target. Using a six o’clock (“pumpkin on a post”) or center mass (“half’n’half”) sight picture will result in low impact. SIG SAUER, Inc sights in all non-sporting and non-target pistols for 2.5 inch groupings @ 15 yards. If you are still having trouble please contact Customer Service for further help and instruction. Please have your serial number ready. There are also very helpful free Internet sites that cover pistol group analysis.
"Combat Sight Picture" was a whizbang answer that customer service came up with to "combat" the rising tide of complaints they received when SIG stopped actually shooting the guns for zero when they leave the factory. Few, if any will zero worth a damn at any kind of distance because they throw the flavor of the day sights on them before they leave the door.
The SIG Sauer Academy does not teach "combat sight picture" despite what customer service may tell you their guns are designed for.
What do they teach for sight picture?
Tip of the front sight is where the bullet goes was the last thing I saw in their manuals. I had a picture of the page on my old photo bucket, but no longer have access.
"It's a bold strategy, Cotton. Let's see if it works out for them"
May 30, 2017, 11:53 PM
kkina
quote:
Originally posted by JonFrost: What do they teach for sight picture?
I've exchanged a few emails with Adam Painchaud of Sig Sauer Academy. They teach "Put the dot where you want the bullet to go". In other words, use the front dot just like the electronic red dot on a rifle.
They indeed do not seem to use the term "combat sighting" very much, if at all, but the official use of this term is not technically inconsistent with their definition of it, i.e. using the dot as the aiming reference.
quote:
Hi Kevin,
We typically teach to use the dot as the aiming reference much like using a red dot on a rifle. Put the dot where you want the bullet to go....
-Adam
Adam A. Painchaud Senior Director adam.painchaud@sigsauer.com
This message has been edited. Last edited by: kkina,
Originally posted by Chris17404: IMO, this is the only sight picture that makes sense, and all pistols should be zeroed as such.
What if you need to shoot smaller/farther away targets?
(the usual answer is "I don't")
_____________________________________________________ Sliced bread, the greatest thing since the 1911.
May 31, 2017, 06:18 AM
Chris17404
quote:
Originally posted by cas:
quote:
Originally posted by Chris17404: IMO, this is the only sight picture that makes sense, and all pistols should be zeroed as such.
What if you need to shoot smaller/farther away targets?
(the usual answer is "I don't")
The need to shoot smaller/farther away targets is exactly why you want to use this sight picture.
May 31, 2017, 06:18 AM
Skins2881
quote:
Originally posted by cas:
quote:
Originally posted by Chris17404: IMO, this is the only sight picture that makes sense, and all pistols should be zeroed as such.
What if you need to shoot smaller/farther away targets?
(the usual answer is "I don't")
I find that picture easier to shoot farther/smaller. Combat sight pic covers the entire target when I do matches with 3-4" steel, especially this one I do where they set the little buggers 20 yards out.
Jesse
Sic Semper Tyrannis
May 31, 2017, 08:02 AM
soggy_spinout
quote:
Originally posted by Chris17404: IMO, this is the only sight picture that makes sense, and all pistols should be zeroed as such. I just don't see any other logical option.
Yup, that's the sight picture I prefer, straight-8s, 3-dot or single-dot. All of my Glocks are set up this way, few of my stainless slide SIGs and HKs are, at least straight out of the box.
May 31, 2017, 11:33 AM
John3200
quote:
Originally posted by Bofire: Is a Sig sight #6 taller or shorter than a #8? Carl
As stated, number up impact up. But if you must know. A rear 8 is taller then a rear 6, but a front 8 is shorter than a front 6.
