Page 1 2
Go | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
| Member |
Is it prudent to improve the DA and SA of a TDA CCW? | ||
|
| Member |
TDA? I'll give a generic answer. People argue this a bunch. I have upgraded sights and a different trigger on my carry gun. The mods I know of that have actually got real people in trouble in court are things like the infamous "You're Fu€ked" dust cover and things like that. If someone has contrary evidence that someone's actually been hemmed up for a mod beyond something like the above I'd like to hear about it. In court, in my experience, I will say that lawyers argue any and everything under the sun often things the layperson would find incredibly stupid. I would be ready to explain why I modified my CCW but as long as I can articulate it, I don't have a problem with it. | |||
|
Still finding my way |
You may get better responses if you'd articulate what exactly it is that you want to do, why, and with what specific pistol. Your vague question along with obscure acronym (tda?) don't give us much to go on. | |||
|
War Damn Eagle! |
TDA = Traditional Double Action aka Double Action/Single Action. I have zero reservations about trigger jobs on any of my CCW pistols. All of the DA/SA pistols I carry concealed have had some sort of trigger work done -to varying degrees. | |||
|
| Member |
If you have an over zealous prosecutor who is looking to make a name for himself then it doesn’t matter whether you have modified your EDC firearm or not, he is going to try and come after you even if you have done everything correctly. A recent example of that would be the prosecution of James Love in Illinois by Assistant State's Attorney Brian Kerr. During the trial Kerr stated that Love intended to kill someone based simply upon the hollow point ammunition that he had loaded in the LC9 pistol. If it is his intention to get a conviction (whatever his motivation) then the prosecutor will throw everything at the wall to see what sticks and it won’t matter what you or haven’t done to your pistol. Laughing in the face of danger is all well and good until danger laughs back. | |||
|
| Thank you Very little  |
I think that further drives the reasons not to modify the firearm, specifically with sayings such as "Smile Wait for Flash" its going to be used to portray you in a negative light to the jury, why help the DA just to exercise your rights to modify the firearm. Its important especially if you live and work in an area of the country that isn't firearm friendly, or have one of those politically driven DA's that lives for this. Other than that it's not going to matter as was said if you have a DA like Brian Kerr, and you can do whatever you wish. Just understand in the long run you might be just making it harder on your attorney and yourself. | |||
|
| Where liberty dwells, there is my country  |
A clean shoot is a clean shoot. You either responded correctly under the law or you did not. It would be a good idea to know the laws that govern prudent use of deadly force and follow them. Know how to articulate your situation and actions, but most importantly, learn to shut the f*ck up until you have spoken with an attorney. The number of people that screwed themselves into a conviction by being a dumb shit or talking to police before their attorney, far outweigh the odds of going to jail because you polished your trigger parts. "Escaped the liberal Borg and living free" | |||
|
| You're going to feel a little pressure... |
If you're really concerned, have it "improved" by the factory custom shop. Certified safe by the manufacturer. That would limit the discussion. YMMV, Bruce "The designer of the gun had clearly not been instructed to beat about the bush. 'Make it evil,' he'd been told. 'Make it totally clear that this gun has a right end and a wrong end. Make it totally clear to anyone standing at the wrong end that things are going badly for them. If that means sticking all sort of spikes and prongs and blackened bits all over it then so be it. This is not a gun for hanging over the fireplace or sticking in the umbrella stand, it is a gun for going out and making people miserable with." -Douglas Adams “It is just as difficult and dangerous to try to free a people that wants to remain servile as it is to try to enslave a people that wants to remain free." -Niccolo Machiavelli The trouble with fighting for human freedom is that one spends most of one's time defending scoundrels. For it is against scoundrels that oppressive laws are first aimed, and oppression must be stopped at the beginning if it is to be stopped at all. -Mencken | |||
|
Member |
This makes the most sense. A DIY action job might not be in your best self defense interest. If people would mind their own damn business this country would be better off. I owe no one an explanation or an apology for my personal opinion. | |||
|
| Member |
IANAL, but based on what I've read, I think that modifying the action of a DA/SA CCW gun (or any action type) is not likely to cause an issue if you 1) use a reputable gunsmith or a factory custom shop, and 2) stay within factory specs, or at least within a generally accepted standard for a particular gun (i.e., 4lbs or heavier trigger pull for a 1911) for carry/duty use. This is in addition to making sure the action remains safe and reliability hasn't been compromised. And it helps if you can articulate a legitimate reason for the work done... Prosecutor: Why did you have your gun's trigger lightened? Defendant: I had my gun's trigger pull smoothed and lightened, within factory specifications, so I could shoot more accurately, reducing the risk to innocent bystanders. Of course, as has been stated, the safest approach would be to keep the gun's action stock. "It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts." Sherlock Holmes | |||
|
| Member |
The only problem with this line of thinking is that you're not the one who determines if it's a clean shoot. "It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts." Sherlock Holmes | |||
|
| Member |
The path I went involved finding an off-the-shelf pistol that met my expectations and didn’t require any additional work. I currently carry a P225-A1 because it is an outstanding and comfortable pistol but I also choose it because it shipped with G10 grips and a SRT kit installed from the factory. The trigger pull is smooth and crisp and it included night sights. My Sig is factory original but it has all the upgrades that I have installed in my other Sigs. Laughing in the face of danger is all well and good until danger laughs back. | |||
|
| Member |
I agree. I'd doubt they'd disassemble the firearm and inspect for trigger jobs anyway. | |||
|
| Member |
I think it could be more problematic in an accidental shooting case. I'm not talking about a regular negligent discharge, but if an innocent bystander is shot while you are defending yourself. If their family sues you, their attorney might claim the you did not intentionally fire at the bad guy and miss, but that you did not intend to fire and the gun went off while it was pointed at their deceased relative because the trigger was too light. That being said, I personally don't worry about it. If an aftermarket trigger or lighter spring will afford me better accuracy without compromising safety, I will use it. ------------------------------ "They who would give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." - Benjamin Franklin "So this is how liberty dies; with thunderous applause." - Senator Amidala (Star Wars III: Revenge of the Sith) | |||
|
| Member |
We are talking about DA/SA not a competition SAO. About the lightest DA I've heard of in a TDA gun is 7 1/2 lbs DA for a competition level job. That is still 2lbs heavier than the Glock in every Cops holster with a longer trigger stroke. A duty level DA/SA job should end up around 8.5-9.5 lbs DA and smooth with a 4-4.5 lb SA. I dont see how that isn’t as defensible as anything else out there. A competition 1911 with a 2lb pull and a pinned grip safety is another thing altogether. “People have to really suffer before they can risk doing what they love.” –Chuck Palahnuik Be harder to kill: https://preparefit.ck.page | |||
|
| Member |
From what I understand, when the gun is seized as evidence, a firearms examiner will inspect the gun to make sure everything works the way it's supposed to and that it's within specs, including the trigger pull. Any anomalies would be noted in the report. Of course, the specifics and amount of detail involved may vary according to the agency, the jurisdiction, the context of the investigation, etc. "It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts." Sherlock Holmes | |||
|
| Member |
I think the thing alot of folks forget when we all get into the weeds on this stuff is, it is far more important to be able to explain why you had to shoot someone than what mods are on the gun you shot them with. I've been to alot of armorers courses and met alot of people who would be in the position to make evaluations on guns. I'd be alittle surprised if some of them would know a short reset trigger kit or an aftermarket guide rod. It's generally barrel length, trigger pull weight and is it mechanically functional. It's not a slam on anyone but remember we are gun people. Alot of people who work in the field are not unless they have a random interest. I don't see it effecting you unless you are claiming you didn't intend to shoot. Then I can see mods being a big deal. Otherwise your justification for shooting is the big deal. | |||
|
Member |
I’ve said the same thing for a decade or longer concerning this. Prosecutor tries the “he/she modified” bs on a DA/SA that is 10#/4#. I’d have the defense attorney bring a Lyman gauge and test the pistol. Then test any cop in court’s pistol which will be most likely a striker, and most likely a Glock. This is something I will never bat an eye about. What am I doing? I'm talking to an empty telephone | |||
|
| Member |
What do the police in that jurisdiction use for ammunition? | |||
|
| my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, saves lives |
https://www.galesburg.com/news...not-guilty-of-murder He was also acquitted after a very short jury deliberation (1 hr 15 min). It takes 60 minutes or so to elect a jury foreman and get settled in the room. A deliberation that short usually means that the jury was unanimous on the first vote, or in this case, That the hollow point argument made no difference and was ignored. Apparently the only way for him to avoid that trial was to move years ago. ***************************** "I don't own the night, I only operate a small franchise" - Author unknown | |||
|
| Powered by Social Strata | Page 1 2 |
 | Please Wait. Your request is being processed... |
|
© SIGforum 2024