With aging eyes, coupled with the beginnings of a cataract annnnd Juxtafoveal Telangiectasis (a retinal problem), red dot sights are on the very near horizon. So my questions for the more knowledgeable here: 1. What dot size for general use? 4-6 up to 8 for normal handgun ranges (for me 25-50 yards max). 2. Dot color, red or green? Personally I think I would prefer green. Again not deep into research, what brands are available in green? 3. Starting out, I probably would not go for the top of the line/premium price models, so what at the general recommendations for the right size green dot moderately priced units? Thanks for the guidance.
Bill Gullette
February 29, 2020, 04:21 PM
1KPerDay
Red works best IME.
Trijicon RMR type 2 is what I would do.
~3 MOA dot is good for precision, ~6 MOA is good also and slightly easier to see and less tremor.
I recommend you actually try some before buying. Nobody can predict what your particular eyes will prefer.
--------------------------- My hovercraft is full of eels.
February 29, 2020, 04:44 PM
mark60
RMR type 2 in 3.25 for me. The red works fine for me but if someone posts something as good in green I'd probably buy it, I usually prefer green to red.
February 29, 2020, 05:14 PM
Scooter123
Definitely make sure you try before buying. Red Dots can produce oblong or odd shaped dots for those with Astigmatism and how much distortion you see is dependent on the lens and how it interacts with your individual eyesight.
As for dot size, I prefer something in the 4 MOA range, easy to see but with enough precision to shoot at 2 inches at 25 yards. I also like Red because if you are shooting in a green area in the summer picking up a green dot dot can be a real challenge.
Final note is that once you start using them you can become completely dependent on them. I limit my use of Red Dots on handguns or rifles specifically to maintain my skills with iron sights.
I've stopped counting.
February 29, 2020, 05:46 PM
T.Webb
I am anxiously watching this thread.
I'm looking at this very topic.
1) To buy an RMR ready gun, a gun/red dot combo, a machined slide, or have an existing gun machined? Tough question ... I'm thinking about a G19, machined for an optic, or a Sig P320 with the Sig Romeo optic already installed.
2) If I opt for the machined G19, what brand optics will fit?
3) Now I need to worry about dot size as I learned today. It's not getting easier.
************************************************ "Tonight, we are a country awakened to danger and called to defend freedom. Our grief has turned to anger and anger to resolution. Whether we bring our enemies to justice or bring justice to our enemies, justice will be done". {George W. Bush, Post 9/11}
February 29, 2020, 05:52 PM
hrcjon
I think I can say I've tried just about every available dot size. ON a pistol I prefer the 3-4moa. My go to is and has been a Trijicon RMR06, and I've used them a lot and am very happy. In practical terms its a bit of a speed tradeoff, if you didn't put the max range at 50 you might be happier and faster with a bit bigger, but at 25-50 you want a modest sized dot. I have not used green so no comment on color, but unfortunately the RMR (which is the best of the choices in my experience is not available in green). Although I have not used it I think there is a holosun that has an RMR footprint that is available in green. I would definately try and get your slide milled/setup for one of the common footprints as that will give you options as you learn what you like. Good luck.
“So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong, and strike at what is weak.”
February 29, 2020, 06:17 PM
bcjwriter
quote:
Originally posted by mark60: RMR type 2 in 3.25 for me. The red works fine for me but if someone posts something as good in green I'd probably buy it, I usually prefer green to red.
This one... I just made the transition to a Red Dot on my duty gun. First with my G19.5 MOS, then I had my G17.4 milled for the AOS system by Agency Arms. It is a new way of shooting - and very humbling at first.
Trijicon or Leupold for professional use is kind of the standard - although I’m hearing good things about the Holosun.
February 29, 2020, 06:20 PM
ALLEGRO1957
quote:
Originally posted by bcjwriter:
quote:
Originally posted by mark60: RMR type 2 in 3.25 for me. The red works fine for me but if someone posts something as good in green I'd probably buy it, I usually prefer green to red.
This one... I just made the transition to a Red Dot on my duty gun. First with my G19.5 MOS, then I had my G17.4 milled for the AOS system by Agency Arms. It is a new way of shooting - and very humbling at first.
Trijicon or Leupold for professional use is kind of the standard - although I’m hearing good things about the Holosun.
It will definately redefine your initial presentation. But, once you find the appropriate presentation and can replicate it over and over, using the optic is a "game changer" and well worth the practice-effort to gt yourself ready for carry.
Be a productive citizen but always be prepared
February 29, 2020, 06:31 PM
DaBigBR
quote:
Originally posted by bcjwriter:
quote:
Originally posted by mark60: RMR type 2 in 3.25 for me. The red works fine for me but if someone posts something as good in green I'd probably buy it, I usually prefer green to red.
This one... I just made the transition to a Red Dot on my duty gun. First with my G19.5 MOS, then I had my G17.4 milled for the AOS system by Agency Arms. It is a new way of shooting - and very humbling at first.
Trijicon or Leupold for professional use is kind of the standard - although I’m hearing good things about the Holosun.
Holosun is definitely making huge inroads. I wouldn't hesitate to use them for anything.
February 29, 2020, 06:32 PM
mike56
I'm 64 and need glasses with irons. I shoot about 1K rounds a month. I'm sold on dots. I can shoot without glasses out to 25yds plus without them. They all have some down side. The Shield sight is on all the time, but is small. Trijicon all have batteries on bottom so sight removal is needed. 3-4 moa is good for about everything. The amber dot on the trij no-battery model tends to wash out in bright sun. So far red has been best. Still experimenting. Not sure how durable they will be for daily carry. They do get dusty/dirty quick. I think all the makers offer some optic ready version now. I'm a believer now.
February 29, 2020, 06:38 PM
BGULL
Thanks for the inputs so far! Some good aspects to consider. The added inputs about going with a factory milled slide vs an aftermarket solution is something else to factor in. I haven’t decided what my first handgun with a red dot will be either revolver or semiautomatic. The revolver would be a GP100 and if it’s a semiautomatic, I’m thinking about an FN 509 Midsize MRD, that will accept about 10 of the most familiar brands/models. A Glock with aftermarket milled slides or a 320 might be down the road.
Bill Gullette
February 29, 2020, 07:31 PM
SgtGold
I have a G19 and P226 that are both factory MOS slides. I have Trijicon RMRs on both. With everyone offering an RDS ready slide I personally don't see the need to machine anything. As always, YMMV.
_____________________________ 'I'm pretty fly for a white guy'.
February 29, 2020, 08:31 PM
hrcjon
I am not aware of a factory 226 slide that takes an RMR so you will have to expand on what that is? There are lots of guns that there is not a factory MOS version and so you have to machine them. Its not a big deal at this point for most guns.
“So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong, and strike at what is weak.”
February 29, 2020, 08:52 PM
hrcjon
I'm going to expound a bit on this topic. I originally started with an optic on an open competition gun a couple of decades ago. That setup looks really silly now with a huge machined bridge and an aimpoint or cmore on top etc. As the technology advanced and my eyes aged I decided that I was fully committed to a red dot on everything. I tried a lot of options over the years. I've been carrying an RMR equipped gun for several years now. THE substantive issue is dust on the optic, which in daylight is not an issue, but sure is at night. Suppressor night sights are mandatory. I generally make some effort to wipe it off every few days FWIW> I've been shooting one in competition for a very long time. While I do still shoot irons I am so much faster and accurate with the dot its silly. To some of the above comments, the battery on the bottom of an RMR is a non issue. You don't have to change it very often and it returns to zero, even if I do check it. In the Trijicon world you want an RMR06 or 07 depending on your dot size preference. The rest of the product line is useless for a defensive (or even range) pistol. I've milled a zillion guns, from non MOS glocks, to sigs which have no RMR option (226,229,220, 320), to HK (USP, P30),1911 and probably a few I can't think of at the moment. Its a non issue nowadays to get it done. If the gun you want has a factory option I think that's better and more likely to be useful long term. I've mounted them on revolvers to the OP comments, but S&W using the Trijicon mount, that's a good setup. Don't know if they make one for the GP100. On specific brands. The sig optic has not worked well for me. Same for the delta point. The type 1 rmr's had an occassional issue, but I have had no issues with the type 2. I am testing the Aimpoint Acro and so far no issues. I have not use the holosun, but since they have one that is the rmr footprint that would be a good one to try. All the above FWIW and my experience.
“So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong, and strike at what is weak.”
February 29, 2020, 08:58 PM
1s1k
I read an article a few years ago that said men typically pick up green better and women typically pick up red better.
My XDM came with both red and green fiber optics and it does seem like the green is easier to pick up quickly in low light conditions.This message has been edited. Last edited by: 1s1k,
February 29, 2020, 09:19 PM
Anubismp
I've looked through a bunch and I've since sold off my rmr and am sticking to holosun. The rmr is hands down most durable but the holosuns aren't terribly far behind and I like the 1 moa dot with the 32 moa circle.
Definitely try them and see what looks best to you.
February 29, 2020, 10:18 PM
FJRider
quote:
Originally posted by hrcjon: I'm going to expound a bit on this topic. I originally started with an optic on an open competition gun a couple of decades ago. That setup looks really silly now with a huge machined bridge and an aimpoint or cmore on top etc. As the technology advanced and my eyes aged I decided that I was fully committed to a red dot on everything. I tried a lot of options over the years. I've been carrying an RMR equipped gun for several years now. THE substantive issue is dust on the optic, which in daylight is not an issue, but sure is at night. Suppressor night sights are mandatory. I generally make some effort to wipe it off every few days FWIW> I've been shooting one in competition for a very long time. While I do still shoot irons I am so much faster and accurate with the dot its silly. To some of the above comments, the battery on the bottom of an RMR is a non issue. You don't have to change it very often and it returns to zero, even if I do check it. In the Trijicon world you want an RMR06 or 07 depending on your dot size preference. The rest of the product line is useless for a defensive (or even range) pistol. I've milled a zillion guns, from non MOS glocks, to sigs which have no RMR option (226,229,220, 320), to HK (USP, P30),1911 and probably a few I can't think of at the moment. Its a non issue nowadays to get it done. If the gun you want has a factory option I think that's better and more likely to be useful long term. I've mounted them on revolvers to the OP comments, but S&W using the Trijicon mount, that's a good setup. Don't know if they make one for the GP100. On specific brands. The sig optic has not worked well for me. Same for the delta point. The type 1 rmr's had an occassional issue, but I have had no issues with the type 2. I am testing the Aimpoint Acro and so far no issues. I have not use the holosun, but since they have one that is the rmr footprint that would be a good one to try. All the above FWIW and my experience.
I also started out with an Aimpoint mounted sideways using a preditor mount on a double stack 1911 in 38 special super comp. I made this switch from my 226 I did this only as stated because of my eyes. I was missing the steel too many times or taking 4 and 5 rounds. The polish plate rack was just a joke that I took a lot of rib poking about. The first time I shoot in open with the red dot I cleaned all of the steel first time and it was the first time that I cleared the plate rack. I was still ok out to 25 yards with steel sights on full-size targets but if I had to take a headshot I just could not trust myself to do it. The red dot resolves this. I started out with a spare slide on my P229 and am now waiting for the Romeo Zero that I have on backorder and will when I have the funds to set up one for one of my 226s. I really like the RMR type 2 LED that self adjust to the light level and I am using the 6MOA dot. FOr now when I have time and money to shoot I have been shooting Carry optics with the P229. IN the long run, I guess what I am saying is that it is not worth the extra money to buy an entirely new gun but milling the ones that I have and know. Where I can I pick up and spare slide so I can set the gun up ether way. I also 100% support the practice of putting the suppressor night sights on to co-witness that gun just in case. If any one is in the DFW metroplex reach out and we can get together and let you try it.
March 01, 2020, 06:34 AM
hawkeye58
Just purchased a Sig P320 RX full size . Romeo 1 mini reflex red dot sight. Suppressor-height night sights that co-witness through the reflex sight’s optical window.
Couldn't be more pleased at age 62.
Chris
March 01, 2020, 07:33 AM
just1tym
I went thru this kind of searching myself many years back. The best I found for me also with astigmatism was green fiber optics. I found that especially in lo-light conditions fiber optics did the job. I wasn't all too concerned as my 1911's weren't holstered for conceal so I've never had one break or loosen. They were professionally installed on my Ed Browns. I also have a gold bead up front on a Wilson that works well but not as good in lo-light conditions as the fiber optic. Pictured is my green fiber optic front mounted a a Nighthawk. All my 1911's have blacked out rears for a much clearer sight on the front, at least for me. I do have a red ramp on the python that is quite visible, but for the 1911's the best so far is the green. I found the fiber optics to "pop" more than just a painted colored front dot, YMMV. Red fiber's came in a close second favorite.
Regards, Will G.
March 01, 2020, 05:19 PM
SgtGold
Factory P226 slide with Romeo RDS. I think I got it on a closeout from Sig.
quote:
Originally posted by hrcjon: I am not aware of a factory 226 slide that takes an RMR so you will have to expand on what that is? There are lots of guns that there is not a factory MOS version and so you have to machine them. Its not a big deal at this point for most guns.
_____________________________ 'I'm pretty fly for a white guy'.
