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| The Quiet Man |
I've got 23 years on a department of roughly 2200 officers. Weapon mounted lights were a "NO" 10 years ago. Now a significant percentage of officers qualify annually with the WMLs. They have to shoot the flashlight course twice. Once with the WML and once with a handheld light. If the department would issue a WML holster instead of requiring officers to purchase out of pocket, I think the percentage would be even higher. My duty weapon has a TLR-7 mounted on it and I wouldn't go back to not having one. I've had to juggle the need for light and a free hand more than once. WMLs have training issues, but that's what they are: Training issues. Back on topic. For a personal CCW, I was anti WML until recently. The TLR-7 is the first light that "I" consider small enough for CCW while remaining bright enough to be usable. The new models with the new switches fix my only gripe with the original TLR-7 and still fit in all of the holsters I have for guns with the original version mounted. I tend to cover the lens with electrical tape if I'm going to be doing a lot of shooting, but I don't do it when I shoot qualifications and have never had an issue cleaning the residue of 300 rounds or so off immediately after the courses. I have a Sig M18 with a TLR-7 on my nightstand. My Scorpion Micro, both ARs, and both shotguns all have WMLs mounted. I'd feel negligent to NOT have a WML on a weapon intended for home defense where concealment isn't an issue. For concealment purposes, holsters are a little bit of an issue. Most WMLs are fairly bulky and result in fairly bulky holsters. WMLs have gotten a lot smaller over the last few years, but they tend to extend well beyond the muzzle of most CCW pistols and holsters can get pretty long. They poke out below cover garments and poke you IWB. That's why I like the TLR-7. It ends flush with the muzzle of a Glock 19 or 320c sized pistol and add very little in the way of weight. A kydex rig will be SLIGHTLY wider than the same holster without the light, but the difference is (for me) not significant. When I'm off duty I usually don't carry a weapon with a WML, but I always have a Fenix pd35 in my pocket. A WML is only useful when you have a weapon in your hand. A small flashlight is ALWAYS useful as a light source. | |||
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Fighting the good fight |
I agree completely. | |||
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The Blue Machine |
I’ll 3rd that! I tried an InForce APLc for a little while. I liked the size and switching, but the light output was anemic. When the TLR-7 came out, I almost jumped, but the switches were problematic for me. With the introduction Of the TLR-7A, I found a very user friendly, CCW sized light with sufficient light output. I now use a TLR-7A on my G23 duty weapon. The light stays on the gun all the time, and makes for a perfect duty and off duty weapon for me. (OK, perfect would be if it were a G19, but hey, you have to go with what the bosses issue!) | |||
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| Member |
I've got nothing to contribute other than if I punched every copper I've seen misusing a WML I'd have punched a lot of cops. | |||
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Member |
This thread really drifted. I'm not a cop. I've never been a cop. I don't play one on TV. And I didn't stay at a Holiday Inn Express. But here are my thoughts to the original questions: 1)- What Lumen do you recommend? And why? 300 minimum. I run a Surefire X300 Ultra on a Glock 34 MOS that outputs 600 and that's a pretty decent brightness. My Surefire handheld light is supposedly 1000 but side by side with the X300 it looks pretty similar. 2)- Battery or rechargeable? Battery, and I keep a few spare CR123s stashed around. You're not using your WML very much and for very long so the CR123 batteries last for a very long time. 3)- Do holster makers all accommodate you when you order your holster with a light? Or do you need to order for a specific gun/light combo? I had a custom light-bearing holster made by KT Mech for the gun with the RMR and the specific model of light. 4)- Do you leave the light on the gun during range sessions? Does un-burned gunpowder damage the lens? I leave it mounted but usually not turned on. Yes, there is some carbon build-up but it's easy enough to wipe off. The lenses on quality weapons lights are a Pyrex-like glass and aren't damaged from the heat. Overall this not an issue. Other thoughts... On a big, full-size gun like a Glock 34 a light is a non-issue. The extra weight on the muzzle in fact helps with muzzle rise. I really like having it mounted on there -- it's a nice package and the X300 Ultra extends right to the end of the muzzle. Mounting a light on a shorter gun means using a shorter light. There are a lot more of these coming out. I'm never an early adopter of gear -- I prefer the YouTube and internet crowd to beat on them for a while first before buying anything. The Surefire XC1 has received mixed reviews. The Streamlights TLR-7 seems to be a superior light. I love my X300 but if I were to mount something on a compact handgun I'd probably opt for the Streamlight. __________________________________ An operator is someone who picks up the phone when I dial 0. | |||
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| Member |
I do not use a WML on my EDC concealed carry gun. This is due to bulk, not any other issue. I carry a small high power LED handheld light as part of my EDC kit. My HD gun has a TLR-3 mounted. I feel it is the best bang for the buck. I have practiced with it and its "splash" is more than enough to light my surroundings without covering an unintended target. The "splash" is enough to light the sights if they become needed. I have shot my HD gun quite a bit with the light mounted so I can be familiar with its handling characteristics and to ensure reliability. The powder residue was easily wiped off. Like any other firearms gear, training with the WML is a must. End of Earth: 2 Miles Upper Peninsula: 4 Miles | |||
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| Member |
——————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————— I’ve been researching lights for my 320 X-Compact and decided to get the Olight PL Mini2. It’s very compact and doesn’t extend past the slide. About $89.00. It’s rechargeable, 600 lumens and comes with a magnetic charger. You can leave it on the gun while charging. In fact, Tuxton Tactical makes an IWB holster specifically for many Sigs with this exact light. You can even leave the gun in the holster while charging. Whether you decide to mount a light on your weapon or carry one separate, it’s important to have one for many reasons posted here. Another reason is that if you ever have to defend yourself in a dimly lit place, having a light is going to help you when you’re in court. What were you shooting at in the dark? Did he really have a gun....or was it a flashlight....or cell phone? Were you aware of your surroundings? | |||
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| Member |
——————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————— I’ve been researching lights for my 320 X-Compact and decided to get the Olight PL Mini2. It’s very compact and doesn’t extend past the slide. About $89.00. It’s rechargeable, 600 lumens and comes with a magnetic charger. You can leave it on the gun while charging. In fact, Tuxton Tactical makes an IWB holster specifically for many Sigs with this exact light. You can even leave the gun in the holster while charging. Whether you decide to mount a light on your weapon or carry one separate, it’s important to have one for many reasons posted here. Another reason is that if you ever have to defend yourself in a dimly lit place, having a light is going to help you when you’re in court. What were you shooting at in the dark? Did he really have a gun....or was it a flashlight....or cell phone? Were you aware of your surroundings? Carry a light of some kind. | |||
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Sigforum K9 handler |
I recommend somewhere between 300-700 linen. With the pinnacle being the Surefire X300U. The easiest way to keep debris off the lens is to place a little painters tape on the end of the light during daytime live fire. And don’t pay any attention to the naysayers. I’m surprised that one member hasn’t showed up to state to everyone how WMLs violate safety rules. | |||
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Web Clavin Extraordinaire |
I can't really get behind those gonzo lumen LED lights these days. I've found they blind me behind the gun with whatever splash light is coming off the floor or the backstop. On a blacked out range, that guy with the 20 million lumen light basically makes a class moot for everyone else because he lights up your target, and the guy next to you, and they guy next to him, etc. The X300U is a good middle ground, IMO. It's bright enough to light up FO sights, but not absurdly bright. That said, I do have an XC1 on my 320, which I find is a decent compromise of size and output. The light has other issues, like battery life, but it's bright enough for target ID at indoor distances, which is what I figure it would be most likely used for. ---------------------------- Chuck Norris put the laughter in "manslaughter" Educating the youth of America, one declension at a time. | |||
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| Member |
I have no dog in the hunt, but I find it both comical and telling that such is referred to as “WML”, rather than “LMW”. | |||
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| Member |
My favorite argument. None of them think twice about searching with a long gun with a light on it, but somehow when it's on a pistol... | |||
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Member |
At the risk of getting flamed (again) I will say what I've said in previous threads like this: I think putting a light on a gun (long or short) is a bad idea. I understand that with proper training and experience it might be helpful and not a problem. But most of the folks here are not going to go to the time and expense of getting this.... my fear is the average person in a high stress situation is going to be using the light on the gun to search for a 'target'.... this is a violation of one of the cardinal rules of gun safety. My Native American Name: "Runs with Scissors" | |||
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Member |
I ordered the TLR7. It should be here today. ************************************************ "Tonight, we are a country awakened to danger and called to defend freedom. Our grief has turned to anger and anger to resolution. Whether we bring our enemies to justice or bring justice to our enemies, justice will be done". {George W. Bush, Post 9/11} | |||
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| Freethinker |
If we’re going to blame an inanimate object for how it’s misused and therefore decide we can’t be trusted with it, then don’t have it. But if we’re going to be governed by that philosophy, there’s no reason to start with a harmless object like a light. The hoplophobes use precisely the same argument for banning guns: “Some people misuse guns, therefore no one should have guns.” Some people might have to worry about an encounter with a drunken teenaged son in the middle of the night and therefore must be extra careful about where they point their defensive weapons. Others of us, however, don’t have that concern. To reiterate, if an uninvited intruder is in my house at night, having a gun pointed at him will be the least of his worries. ► 6.4/93.6 ___________ “We are Americans …. Together we have resisted the trap of appeasement, cynicism, and isolation that gives temptation to tyrants.” — George H. W. Bush | |||
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| A day late, and a dollar short  |
Your going to love that TLR-7 T. Webb. I keep one mounted on my G19 that is stored in a handgun vault on my nightstand. I used to remove the light for CCW use, and reattach it at night. Since acquiring a P365, that same G19 serves me solely as a bedside gun. ____________________________ NRA Life Member, Annual Member GOA, MGO Annual Member | |||
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| Leatherneck |
That didn’t take long! Just a few posts below yours. “Everybody wants a Sig in the sheets but a Glock on the streets.” -bionic218 04-02-2014 | |||
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For real? |
I was using a TLR-1HL for years on my duty weapon. I picked up a TLR-7 for off duty carry and now that the 7A was released, I switched to it on my duty weapon. The 7A is bright enough (I'm on permanent night shift) for it's intended purpose. I still have a brighter handheld if I need some throw. We're not mandating WMLs (we got some old fogeys) but every new officer that starts with us is issued a WML from the get go. I don't have as much time on (22years) or being a trainer (18years) as some of you but I believe we're doing fine. No negligent discharges yet. Not minority enough! | |||
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| Fighting the good fight |
My P320 duty gun sports a TLR-7A sometimes too, when it's wearing the X-Compact grip. It's a great light, for both duty use and concealed carry. (I swap in the X-Carry grip with TLR-1HL when in full uniform.) I think a Glock 19 or P320 Compact with a TLR-7A is right about the perfect "all around" gun out there on the market today. An ideal size and setup for duty/carry/home defense/range. | |||
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| Member |
For the larger carry guns I think you'll find the TLR1-hl and x300u are popular for a very good reason. Good switches and a well balanced amount of light out of the front. For the super small I like the olight plmini 2 but I understand some don't love rechargeables. You go a long time between charges and usbs are everywhere for a plug in. I'll agree with the 300-1k lumens , I know candela is the better number but I rarely see it advertised. I find you can get just about any kind of holster for wmls now days. I typically like kydex for wml rigs but have made a leather one for my hellcat with the pl Mimi 2 as there aren't many out there so holsters are just coming on line I leave my wmls mounted for training shoots as my grip shifts on the gun without a wml. You want your grip going to the places it's going to ideally go in stress. You probably know that I'm just reiterating. For cleaning I find most of the crap that doesn't come off of lenses is baked on and allowed to cure if you get my drift. Give the lens a wipe down after a day of shooting after coming off the line and you'll have no issue. If you have stubborn crap on there or forget on the range then a pencil eraser will remove the stubborn stuff. I am a strong advocate of wmls on carry or house guns. We are the good guys and can't hose down the wrong person and proper ID is part of that. I also strongly advocate people carry a good primary flashlight they can use independently. There are times you may need your other hand and you still need to ID or post up on a BG while addressing a threat while opening a door, driving a car, grabbing your scared family member and dragging them away from the problem etc. | |||
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