We seldom get together, but keep in touch as best we can, and he had been recently enamored with tuning a Glock 19, informing me of his efforts via text message. He is a very smart man; excellent with mechanical things, especially vehicles, and that skillset translates quite well to firearms tinkering, I think. He had tuned the trigger, undercut and stippled the frame, mounted a red dot, etc. He was proudest of the trigger work. I am not a trigger person, but the trigger did indeed feel better than a factory Glock, when I was able to get my hands on the gun. In that same in-person moment, I handed him my MK25, which he had not seen. There is nothing done to my pistol, aside from G10 grips. He was amazed at how good the trigger was.

I have nothing against contemporary polymer-framed, striker-fired guns, nor am I a 22X elitist. I do think it's a shame that some folks are unaware of firearms outside the Glock-alike spectrum. Anyway, I thought his reaction was funny, and figured folks here might have had similar interactions, or at least get a kick out of reading this.

It happens. He was out of his bailiwick, and thus had little to judge it against. As you said, I am not a sig apologist, but an mk25 trigger versus an x5 AO, or a X5L1, CZ TSO, beretta 92 LTT/92x.

I get it. I remember years ago when I got my USP 40, (96/97) A friend and I were comparing our two duty guns. His was a 226, mine was the USP 40. Compared to my USP, his sig was a thing of beauty.

I made a commitment to train hard on the Glock platform a few years ago after being a pretty die hard DA/SA guy. I’m glad I did because it taught me how to properly run a trigger. I’ve been shooting and moving toward the P320 & P365 platforms and will most likely use a 320 in my next training class. That said, I have also been shooting my classic P22? guns lately and have been so surprised at the results. My MK25 does have a GGI SRT kit and a few new springs but the trigger is on par with a P228 that was fully tuned by GGI years ago. I shoot the Mk25 so well that I ordered some custom leather and may very well change my mind about what gun goes with me to my next class.

As to those that don’t experience other platforms it is usually from a place of ignorance. I can respect and appreciate any quality firearm. One of the range officers where I shoot makes it a point to tell me how Glocks are really poorly designed fighting weapons every time I’m there training with one. I just ignore it and keep on keeping on. As to your friend, it’s fun to watch someone realize there’s more to the world than just plastic striker fired weapons.

quote:

Originally posted by DSgrouse:
It happens. He was out of his bailiwick, and thus had little to judge it against. As you said, I am not a sig apologist, but an mk25 trigger versus an x5 AO, or a X5L1, CZ TSO, beretta 92 LTT/92x.

I am confused by your comment. Are you saying you think the 226 trigger is decent, or poor?

quote:

Originally posted by DSgrouse:
I get it. I remember years ago when I got my USP 40, (96/97) A friend and I were comparing our two duty guns. His was a 226, mine was the USP 40. Compared to my USP, his sig was a thing of beauty.

I think the USP series is quite comparable to the 22X series; at least based on current production guns. May not have been the case in the late 90s. I actually weighed a USP 9mm against the 226 before I purchased my MK25. I shot them side by side. I found the double action to be more pleasant on the 226, and the trigger was more comfortable to me. I still hold the USP in high regard, and would like to have one someday.

quote:

Originally posted by dking271:
As to those that don’t experience other platforms it is usually from a place of ignorance. I can respect and appreciate any quality firearm. One of the range officers where I shoot makes it a point to tell me how Glocks are really poorly designed fighting weapons every time I’m there training with one. I just ignore it and keep on keeping on. As to your friend, it’s fun to watch someone realize there’s more to the world than just plastic striker fired weapons.

The MK25 is my go-to "combat sidearm", but I will always love the Steyr L9A1, as my choice for a plastic striker-fired. It is crazy comfortable to me, and has, in my opinion, one of the best out-of-the-box triggers on a gun of it's type. Has to be the A1 though, not the A2MF. I bought one of the A2s when it came out, based on my love of the A1, and didn't have it long.

quote:

Originally posted by KSGM:

quote:

Originally posted by DSgrouse:
It happens. He was out of his bailiwick, and thus had little to judge it against. As you said, I am not a sig apologist, but an mk25 trigger versus an x5 AO, or a X5L1, CZ TSO, beretta 92 LTT/92x.

I am confused by your comment. Are you saying you think the 226 trigger is decent, or poor?

quote:

Originally posted by DSgrouse:
I get it. I remember years ago when I got my USP 40, (96/97) A friend and I were comparing our two duty guns. His was a 226, mine was the USP 40. Compared to my USP, his sig was a thing of beauty.

I think the USP series is quite comparable to the 22X series; at least based on current production guns. May not have been the case in the late 90s. I actually weighed a USP 9mm against the 226 before I purchased my MK25. I shot them side by side. I found the double action to be more pleasant on the 226, and the trigger was more comfortable to me. I still hold the USP in high regard, and would like to have one someday.

I am saying that to some folk, they might complain that the 226 is meh for a trigger, To others like your friend that double/single action gives a very nice tactile feel when compared to another gun. It all depends on what they have shot and liked.

This would have been west (it was a yellow cardboard box IIRC) german gun p226, he bought it through his department letterhead. The mid to late 90's p226's have, I think (subjective and annecdotally) a better trigger than the modern guns. The USP has a fair trigger, but they can be gritty and can stack up, whereas the p226, his specifically, did not. While I was jealous of how nice his trigger was, it did not convince me that my USP was bad or that his was better.

I have as many usp's as I do 226's Or close to.

P226 9,22lr,357si,40,9mmsao,x5AO,X5L1
USP, 9,9tac,9expert,40,45,MK23

The only thing they really share in common is caliber and being hammer fired.

quote:

Originally posted by DSgrouse:
I am saying that to some folk, they might complain that the 226 is meh for a trigger, To others like your friend that double/single action gives a very nice tactile feel when compared to another gun. It all depends on what they have shot and liked.

Gotcha.

quote:

Originally posted by DSgrouse:
The only thing they really share in common is caliber and being hammer fired.

I think the DA/SA functionality is the meaningful cross-over between the two. That's why I was comparing them, when I was in the market for a DA/SA gun. I appreciate the CZ and Beretta designs as well, but don't care for the controls on either as much.

quote:

Originally posted by KSGM:

quote:

Originally posted by DSgrouse:
I am saying that to some folk, they might complain that the 226 is meh for a trigger, To others like your friend that double/single action gives a very nice tactile feel when compared to another gun. It all depends on what they have shot and liked.

Gotcha.

quote:

Originally posted by DSgrouse:
The only thing they really share in common is caliber and being hammer fired.

I think the DA/SA functionality is the meaningful cross-over between the two. That's why I was comparing them, when I was in the market for a DA/SA gun. I appreciate the CZ and Beretta designs as well, but don't care for the controls on either as much.

I agree, the DA/SA slipped my mind during that typing

quote:

Originally posted by KSGM:
I think the USP series is quite comparable to the 22X series; at least based on current production guns. May not have been the case in the late 90s. I actually weighed a USP 9mm against the 226 before I purchased my MK25. I shot them side by side. I found the double action to be more pleasant on the 226, and the trigger was more comfortable to me. I still hold the USP in high regard, and would like to have one someday.

The USP has the worst DA trigger pull I can ever remember using. The SA is good, but the DA pull is what I expect out of a $200 gun. I'm saying this has someone who has owned $300 DA/SA guns and been pleased w/ them.

Last week I saw a USP9c at the LGS w/ a CA (2020) date code. I asked to check it out to see if recent production USPs felt any different. Nope, the DA pull as long, gritty & stacky as ever. I've used stapler guns w/ better pulls.

But hey, it was Jack Bauer's favorite.

My LGS has a USP-9 Expert on the way. I am not in the market, but I am looking forward to checking it out.

quote:

Originally posted by KSGM:
My LGS has a USP-9 Expert on the way. I am not in the market, but I am looking forward to checking it out.

Do it, join the dark side.

Oh I have always liked them. I have shot one too. The one thing that burns me a bit is threaded barrel availability. It falls into the "combat sidearm" category for me; I seldom shoot with a pistol silencer, but it is a requirement that the gun be able to accept one. I'd also swap to a fixed rear sight. I am sure I am a weirdo, in how I consider the 9mm Expert.

Adco, did the following three-barrel extensions for me. I would be concerned that you would loose the Oring on the Expert. You could call and ask.


I have the tactical for me the suppressed use, and I get it. what little hearing I have left I want to keep.

In researching, there is this option. fuck I may have to do this for shits and giggles.

https://jarvis-custom.com/prod...ert-threaded-barrel/

quote:

Originally posted by DSgrouse:
In researching, there is this option. fuck I may have to do this for shits and giggles.

Heck yeah. That's cool.

I knew it was possible to have the existing barrel extended and threaded but, like you, I wasn't crazy about sacrificing the original. I hadn't ruled it out though. Form follows function, and I typically have a strict policy of not regarding future resale when considering gun purchases and modifications.

Right now the expert is my only USP with out a TB. so I may give this Jarvis a try. It says it has an o-ring. IT would make the USP a quasi 9mm mk23? there about as far as barrel length.

Sadly Jarvis does not make a TB for my X5 AO and X5 L1.....

quote:

Originally posted by iron chef:
The USP has the worst DA trigger pull I can ever remember using.

This is the near universal, if not universal, acknowledgment among USP owners.

quote:

The SA is good, but the DA pull is what I expect out of a $200 gun..

I wouldn't even call the SA good. Average at best, for me.

What's mentioned above applies only to the standard USPs. You'd have to go to their Tactical, Expert and Elite models to get a much better trigger action. But, even they still are not what I would call exceptional.

quote:

Originally posted by 12131:

quote:

Originally posted by iron chef:
The USP has the worst DA trigger pull I can ever remember using.

This is the near universal, if not universal, acknowledgment among USP owners.

quote:

The SA is good, but the DA pull is what I expect out of a $200 gun..

I wouldn't even call the SA good. Average at best, for me.

What's mentioned above applies only to the standard USPs. You'd have to go to their Tactical, Expert and Elite models to get a much better trigger action. But, even they still are not what I would call exceptional.

Though not hardly a standard USP, my Mark 23 has a long and heavy, but smooth DA pull. The SA pull is quite excellent.

quote:

Originally posted by 12131:

I wouldn't even call the SA good. Average at best, for me.

What's mentioned above applies only to the standard USPs. You'd have to go to their Tactical, Expert and Elite models to get a much better trigger action. But, even they still are not what I would call exceptional.

Now you see here, I will have you know that the Holy Church of HK and the Apostle USP,......

Yeah, I got nothing they are not great. After 50k my USP 40 has an acceptable trigger. Put it up to any of my p226's and it is the least out of 7 p226s.

My M25 is one of my BBQ guns for sure... the other pistol that always just feels right in my hand is my P226 Legion in 357sig.

Dern now I need to go fondle it.....

Nothing wrong with Glocks. I shot a friends 229 and I'll be a Sig fan from here on out. My 229 is accurate, reliable, and eats anything I feed it.
TF