I'm looking for a concealable pack gun...something very light that I can pocket carry if necessary when backpacking. This will be for hiking in the east, so I'm primarily concerned about 2-legged threats up to black bears.

I have a S&W 360J that is chambered in .38+p. It's a good shooter, and I'm confident with it out to 25 yards...but I'd prefer the added penetration of a magnum round. It has come to my attention that the scandium frame of my 360J is identical to those on the magnum guns, and I can simply swap the cylinder out to turn it into a .357. I've found sources for both titanium and steel .357 cylinders that will work for my purposes, with the titanium cylinder being slightly more expensive, but not prohibitively so.

I've shot the 360PD before, so I know what I'm getting into. They're not pleasant, but it's a lot of power in a very lightweight package, and that's what I'm looking for on the trail. My concern is that I've heard bad things about the titanium cylinders...that they are susceptible to flame cutting, and that you can't clean them with certain chemicals or abrasive materials, as those will damage the protective coating on the cylinder and allow it to erode.

My question to those with experience...is all that stuff about the titanium cylinders true, and if so is it worth dealing with all that crap for the weight savings, or would I be better off accepting a few extra ounces and just getting a steel cylinder? Or is the titanium cylinder good to go and a worthwhile upgrade? Or should I just leave it alone as a .38+p as that should be adequate for the intended use?

My experience with the 340PD has been positive, no adverse issues. I bought the gun new, over ten years ago. It has the scandium cylinder.

As one would expect, the vast majority of shooting is with 38 spcl then +p rounds. It is a dirt simple, easy to carry gun.

I can reload 357 rounds on the milder side, which is plenty. I do agree, no need to go overboard just because a black bear may call the same woods home.

My gun has not shown any adverse reaction to normal cleaning.

Some may argue, but I don’t see such a gun as a high count range gun.

How much do you plan to shoot?

If it's carried often and shot seldom I think you'd be happier with the weight savings.

If you plan on shooting it weekly I think you'd be happier with the more robust material and slightly reduced recoil from the added weight of the steel cylinder.

quote:

Originally posted by Rustpot:
How much do you plan to shoot?

If it's carried often and shot seldom I think you'd be happier with the weight savings.

If you plan on shooting it weekly I think you'd be happier with the more robust material and slightly reduced recoil from the added weight of the steel cylinder.

Rustpot nailed it. Spot on.

That's kind of the logic train I've been following as well. The gun doesn't get shot much...I have other small, steel revolvers that are better at the range. It does get shot some, as I believe in staying proficient with anything I'm going to carry, but not as much as my SP101 or GP100.

The J Frame is my gun for when I can't carry a gun...backpacking, dressy social events, or throwing in a gym shorts pocket when mowing the yard. So lightweight is a big plus. Its pretty light now...light enough that it does what I need it to do just fine. But if a titanium cylinder would make it even lighter, without introducing other issues, that would be even better.

I always tend to air on the side of durability. The difference in weight is what 2-3 oz? I know ounces = pounds and pounds = pain but is 2-3 oz a deal breaker either way?

For me I would go lesser cost, more durable, “easier” to shoot.

That’s just me.

If your SP101 is 357, then thats your woods gun. Leave the Smith as is.

quote:

Originally posted by cslinger:
I know ounces = pounds and pounds = pain but is 2-3 oz a deal breaker either way?

That equation works in the adverse when it comes to recoil.

quote:

Originally posted by cas:

quote:

Originally posted by cslinger:
I know ounces = pounds and pounds = pain but is 2-3 oz a deal breaker either way?

That equation works in the adverse when it comes to recoil.

Both of you are absolutely correct! I typically err on the overbuilt, overly heavy side myself, which is why I own a lot of Rugers...but this one is something a little different. And yeah..2-3oz probably doesn't make much difference...I should probably just go with the steel cylinder...it's cheaper, too. But there's that voice in the back of my head that keeps saying that if I can go even lighter, why not do it?

quote:

If your SP101 is 357, then thats your woods gun. Leave the Smith as is

The SP101 IS my woods gun...when I go to places where nobody cares that I'm carrying. If it was up to me, we'd do all our hiking out west, where 90% of folks you encounter on the trail are open carrying....but my brother is a whiner about driving any significant distance, so we end up hiking in places where carrying a gun is less socially acceptable. Hence the need for something small and light.

quote:

Originally posted by cslinger:
I always tend to air on the side of durability. The difference in weight is what 2-3 oz? I know ounces = pounds and pounds = pain but is 2-3 oz a deal breaker either way?

For me I would go lesser cost, more durable, “easier” to shoot.

That’s just me.

This is my thinking as well. Plus you don't have to worry about rounds shaking loose.

I view it differently. Every ounce is worth saving. Then the question becomes how many guns do you have? For the poor guy with only one or two carry guns, the answer will be different from the guy with a half dozen or more. I prefer the gun that's right for the task. I even have a very early model 60, a great gun by the way. Some where along the way I picked up an oddball model 360 with an early, small window. Its a 38, not a 357. Pretty much identical to my 337, another good, make that great gun.

The guns pretty much shoot the same, until the fireball exits the barrel. I no longer have a J frame 357. If I want that kind of power I just carry a little bigger and slightly heavier 327. They all shoot pretty much the same. Once you've become familiar with the gun and action, you find none are great range guns. If its self defense you're seeking, don't bother to go. A 12 gauge is a much better defense gun than a 357 regardless of loading. You'll find that a 38+ P is plenty in a J frame, maybe too much.

At some point in your accumulation of guns, you may decide that special purpose guns are better. I have a few () and I prefer a gun that is ideal for the task at hand. There was once upon a time the theory that you should select a multi purpose gun that didn't do anything really well, but could do most anything. I've rejected that idea and moved to the idea its more fun to have a dozen special purpose guns. I'm not indecisive and worry about which gun is best. But I also don't own an old Model 36 either.

If you're pretty sure you're going to need a gun, don't go. Or carry way too much gun for ordinary walking. Lets go for a Shockwave, just for fun. Its big, obnoxious, and probably adequate for the task. Or just a 1911. If you want to compromise, at least have a few guns to choose from. Its getting to be fall. Larger guns can be concealed well. Its a fashion statement, carry a 12 gauge to reduce risk. S&W came out with a huge line or pipsqueak J frame guns for the indecisive. The L frame and N frame guns in Scandium might be better suited for situations you'll face. I prefer to stay home if there is even a 1% chance of trouble. In jacket weather, a J frame isn't the best choice (neither is some off brand junker).

So the question the OP asked was is a Titanium cylinder worth it, or just stick with one made from an old frying pay. Buy one of each, its more fun.

I've owned a 340 and they are very light but no fun to shoot in anything but 38's. It's the only gun I've seem make someone bleed...

I love my 640 all steel for magnums...while not "pleasant" to shoot it's very manageable.

I guess if all you're worrying about are 2 legged predators then .38 will work. You could look at the 642/442 series and save some money as well.

Then again, maybe the answer is to just leave it alone and load it with these...

https://www.buffalobore.com/in...product_detail&p=288

I've had both the titanium and the current steel cylinder. I found that the bit of extra weight of the steel increased my accuracy. And yes, significant increase in durability, and ease 9f cleaning with the steel. And it still pockets easily.

First off, what is your barrel length? If it's 1 7/8 inch what you will get is the ballistics of a rather weak 9mm. The problem is that 357 Magnums have to be loaded with a fairly slow burning powder and as a result you need barrel length to get it up to speed. BTW I once loaded 21.5 grains of H110 behind a 125 grain Hornady XTP and the result produced 1370 fps from my 4 inch model 620. According to witnesses it also shot a flame 20 feet downrange and the muzzle blast mimicked the 500 Magnum. Out of a 1 7/8 inch barrel that same load would likely clock in the range of 850-900 fps with a really impressive amount of blast and flash.

While it would weigh a tiny bit more I would choose something like my Ruger LC9S or a Sig P365. You not only get more energy due to the longer barrel length you also get more rounds in the gun. Yeah I know it's an additional 8 ounces. That's 1/2 lbs. In the west that's a cup of water and is significant where access to water is limited. However in the Eastern US access to water isn't nearly as difficult because in most areas you can't hike 5 miles without crossing a stream or creek. Sum it all up and you can handle an additional 8 ounces.

quote:

First off, what is your barrel length? If it's 1 7/8 inch what you will get is the ballistics of a rather weak 9mm. The problem is that 357 Magnums have to be loaded with a fairly slow burning powder and as a result you need barrel length to get it up to speed. BTW I once loaded 21.5 grains of H110 behind a 125 grain Hornady XTP and the result produced 1370 fps from my 4 inch model 620. According to witnesses it also shot a flame 20 feet downrange and the muzzle blast mimicked the 500 Magnum. Out of a 1 7/8 inch barrel that same load would likely clock in the range of 850-900 fps with a really impressive amount of blast and flash.

It's a 1 7/8 barrel. I've done some chronograph work with snubby revolvers before, and while slow burning powders commonly used in magnum loads do see huge advantages with longer barrels, they still push bullets significantly faster out of short barrels than typical .38+p loads (albeit inefficiently, with tremendous flame and muzzle blast).

What I've found is that the short-barreled guns will generally be between 800-900fps with .38+p, 1100-1200 with the same weight bullet in .357, and 1800+ with the .357 out of my 18" carbine. No, it's not fun to shoot, nor is it efficient, but that ~200FPS translates to significantly higher muzzle energy than the .38+p.

For pretty much every other purpose, I'm right there with you...I like guns that are good to shoot. I will happily sacrifice carry-comfort for shootability....and my gun collection and daily carry choices reflect that. Backpacking is different, though...I'm spending money on lightweight gear and going as minimalist as possible, doing without anything that I don't absolutely need. I even eat cold food because I don't like carrying a stove. It kinda negates all that effort to strap on a 2lb sidearm when there are options available to me that weigh less than half that. I know there may be better options out there, but I already have the 360...for $140 I can shave a few ozs off, and make it more potent...seems like a pretty good deal to me. But I want to make sure the titanium cylinder is going to be a reliable, functional option...I don't want to end up spending money to make the gun worse.

To paraphrase rburg above, if you think you need a gun, you probably shouldn't go. I agree with that...and honestly, If I sat down and cranked the numbers, I probably don't NEED a gun on the trail at all...it would be easy to save that weight altogether and not take it. But all of us being gun guys, I'm sure just about everyone here understands why I want one.

I would opt for the 360PD if weight is a consideration. The weight difference is noticeable when compared to a normal alloy frame J frame with steel cylinder, even though it is only a few ounces. You will not have any issue with the cylinder using normal cleaning methods; just don't scrub it with a stainless steel brush. I had a 337PD and then switched to the 360PD, as I much preferred the fiber optic front sight. I practice using light reloads, and carry it with Speer Gold Dot short barrel ammo. I'm currently carrying the 135 gr. Gold Dot short barrel Magnum load. It seems just a bit hotter than the similar 38 +P load. Recoil is fairly stout but it is shootable. I would not care to shoot normal 357 ammo like a 125 gr. round. I carry this gun often and find that the light weight does make a difference, at least to me.

I agree with Savoy. I have the original .38 342, that came in the padded grey case. This is the one that started the whole titanium revolution back in 2000 or 2001 there abouts. I have probably 1000 rounds thru it with regular nylon brush cleaning and Fireclean solvent. At 11 oz. its a great carry gun, and i would never shoot or carry magnums out of one of the lightweight revolvers so the .38 only aspect suits me perfect.
Get one if you can find it because even compared to your standard 442/642 airweight the titanium lightweigh is much easier to carry especially if you use these for pocket carry as i do.

Steel cylinder 340PD here. With the effectiveness of modern 38+P ammo, what I lose in Velocity I make up for in accuracy & recovery. I don’t feel the need for using magnum loads.