For the last 20 years I have had zero choice/say in what I carried. So the first 14 or so years the good old Glock 22 then we switched to 9mm and it was the good old 17. Both naked as a Jay Bird.
Never shot either of them great always shot my 226 and then my 320 better.
Well, the new employer gives us a choice as long as it’s a 9mm Glock. I have always liked the feel of the 19 better and I was able to get a hold of a G19 COA the other day and since they are likely to be as rare as hens teeth figured I would get it.
So today I figured I would get some time with her before I have to qualify in a few weeks.
300 rounds went with.
100 rounds of American Eagle 115gr, 100 rounds of Aguila 124gr, and 100 rounds of American Eagle 147gr.
Glock pulled a fast one on me and gave me 2 15 round mags and 1 10 rounder. I also brought along 3 MecGar 17 18 round mags, and 3 Magpul 17 17 round mags. I have never owned a 19 so at the moment have no other 19 mags.

Just for fun started with just irons at 10 yards with the 115gr. Doing 5 shot groups. WOW did I shoot it terrible. While certainly were all hits in a qualifying target it was quite the spread. Did a few more 5 shot groups and not much better. So I turned on the dot got it pretty close but still grouping way larger than I wanted. Frankly was getting super pissed at myself. Ran out of 115gr ammo so took a breather and started to load up the mags with the Aguila 124gr.
Got the mags loaded and prepared for the worst to continue.
Nope, was grouping nice and tight (for my skills) at the 10 and 7. Absolutely nothing like the scatter with the 115gr.
Cruised through the 124gr feeling much better about my shooting but now very confused.
Loaded up the 147gr and back to it. These were grouping nearly as bad as the 115gr but nowhere near as nice as the 124gr.
I have no idea where the AE 115gr came from. I don’t ever recall buying it and I only had 2 boxes. I have not bought single boxes of 9mm in a very long time nor have I bought 115gr since I got my 9mm suppressor like 10+ years ago.
Could those have just been crappy ammo or was it me?

Good news is she ran like a top. All 3 brands of magazines ran flawlessly. There have been a bunch of “YouTube” folks saying the MecGars for Glock are no good and they just fall out of the gun with shooting.
I had no such issue and I even tried yanking the mag out of the gun with my left hand while shooting. Tried with all my might to rip the mag out without using the mag release and there is no way. When unloaded I held the magazine (they are extended in the 19) alone shook it all around tried to throw it and nothing. They were locked in solid and these are some of the original releases.
I got them from Greg Cote in the first batch he ever received.
So not sure about those claims.

Only weirdness/issue I had was I was shooting 5 round groups but to save time I loaded a bunch of mags last night and then fully loaded all my mags.
Shooting 5 round groups I would remove the mag after the 4 round and fire the 5th so the gun would would be empty and I could bring in my target to mark out my shots from that group.

3 times on the 5th shot (with no magazine inserted) the gun did not cycle/eject the case. I would go to manually pull and lock the slide back (range rule) when adjusting targets.
The case was still fully in the chamber and the cases were completely black.
It only happened with the 115gr ammo which makes me even more suspect of the ammo.

So all in all it was a good day with the soon to be new duty weapon. Started out a bit rough but I am thinking/hoping it was ammo related.

I like the 19 has a nice feel but everyone recently has been gushing about the 45. I may get a 45 at some point down the road.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Black92LX,

I'd tend to agree...it's probably the ammo. The only way to know for sure is to shoot it more. Inconsistent charge or ignition could account for both the poor accuracy and the failures to cycle properly.

What did you think of the optic? I've only just handled a COA...I have yet to shoot with one. My initial impression was pretty positive. Curious about your real-world experience.

quote:

Originally posted by Black92LX:
I like the 19 has a nice feel but everyone recently has been gushing about the 45. I may get a 45 at some point down the road.

I've been doing a lot of shooting lately with my Gen 4 19, and Gen 5 17 and G45. Every range trip just puts me more solidly in the camp that the G45 is probably one of the very best iterations of the 9mm Glock. Just got back from a range trip where that was yet again the conclusion. The recoil impulse feels less ponderous than a 17, there's more of it to hang onto than a 19, and I just shoot it better than either of the other two. If and when the G45 COA becomes widely available, I may pick one of those up and just standardize on the G45.

Also curious what your impressions of the COA are.

I am not the best person to ask about the optics. I have almost no experience behind a pistol red dot.
I have a 320 with an RMR that I have shot about 150 rounds with.

In handling the 2 I like the COA better. When I bring the gun up the physical optic is not a focus. I just see the dot. On my 320 with the RMR I see the optic and the dot.
I think the reason is the shape of the optic and the glass. On the RMR you have the housing dips down in shape while the glass arcs so you have these 2 contrasting shapes drawing my eyeballs attention. Also that the RMR sits much higher I have suppressor height sights and just adds more to look at.
The COA is just a box both the window and the housing and seems to disappear and I just see the dot and the sights are so low they don’t grab my attention. I guess it is because you don’t have these two completely contrast shapes meeting in the center of your vision.

I also have not done any holster work with either.
I am looking forward to taking the optics course at my new agency.

My 320 is a full size grip with a compact slide and I really like that setup. I have a fair amount of rounds shooting it before I put the dot on and I shot it well.
However I have the Wilson Combat full size grip module and that just feels like it was made for my hand.

The 17/45 grip in NO way feels good in my hand and I prefer the feel of the 19 grip. So I am interested to see if I like the 45.

Are you “aiming” the dot, or completely target focused? What kind of group do you shoot with the optic occluded? What are you considering a “crappy group” at 10 yards?

Going to say dot focused as I still have to close one eye.

Without the dot I would say 5-6”

Today with the dot
At 10 yards With the 115gr we are talking like a 10” group.
With 124gr we are talking 4”
With 147gr closer to 6”

At 7 yards with both the 124 and 147 I was shooting out the 1” bull easily and the 115gr was more like a 4”.

Certainly all would fall in the center of mass hit on a qual silhouette target and pass quals with no issue. But was certainly not happy with it

So, visual convergence will f your groups. The dot is not made to be “aimed”. It’s made for you to focus on the target, place the dot over the spot you want to hit and send it.

If you try to aim the dot, you’ll wind up with bigger groups than if you use the dot the way it’s designed. Both eyes are supposed to work together.

I highly suggest the three day red dot course at the academy. It’s actually really good.

So you close one eye to shoot? With irons and a dot?

That could be part of the issue. Try both eyes open and just sort of see the dot “appear” over what you want to hit. Almost like a flash sight picture with a front sight so to speak. Just pay attention to where on the target you want to hit.

Now all that said I don’t know shit about shit, I have just always shot two eyes open more or less target focused so dots were never that different for me.

Good luck with it.

I would also turn the brightness of the dot down as well. A big problem I had transitioning to red dots (and especially green dots) is I'd ramp the dot so bright that not only would the dot get bigger, but I'd lose all target focus like I was just paying attention to my front sight.

quote:

In handling the 2 I like the COA better. When I bring the gun up the physical optic is not a focus. I just see the dot. On my 320 with the RMR I see the optic and the dot.
I think the reason is the shape of the optic and the glass. On the RMR you have the housing dips down in shape while the glass arcs so you have these 2 contrasting shapes drawing my eyeballs attention. Also that the RMR sits much higher I have suppressor height sights and just adds more to look at.
The COA is just a box both the window and the housing and seems to disappear and I just see the dot and the sights are so low they don’t grab my attention. I guess it is because you don’t have these two completely contrast shapes meeting in the center of your vision.

That's an interesting observation. Now I really want to try one.

I agree with Jones. Take the class. It sounds like you already may have something lined up through work, which is great. I struggled to try and teach myself the dot, and it never really clicked until I got some in-person formal instruction. Once that happened, it all made sense.

Definitely take the class. They force you to shoot with both eyes by blocking the sight with tape. It forces you to see the target with one eye while the other sees the dot. It works. I have an DPP on my duty pistol and an RMR on a Glock I also shoot. Will be issued the COA in hopefully less than a month. Shoot both red dots I have equally well.

Class is a for sure. So I am looking forward to that.
I have never been able to shoot with both eyes open. I have tried and tried but had zero luck.

quote:

Originally posted by Black92LX:
Class is a for sure. So I am looking forward to that.
I have never been able to shoot with both eyes open. I have tried and tried but had zero luck.

They'll help you with that. There are a number of drills that will teach you to target-focus with both eyes, the one with the tape that Alyron mentioned being one of the most effective, at least for me. It forces you to keep both eyes open as you have to leverage your binocular vision to superimpose the dot over the target.

At least your academy is willing to teach the dot. We had to go somewhere else. It recently came to my attention that our basic academy isn't even allowing trainees to use the optics on the issued guns we send them with .

quote:

Originally posted by Black92LX:
Class is a for sure. So I am looking forward to that.
I have never been able to shoot with both eyes open. I have tried and tried but had zero luck.

Are you cross eye dominant? I am left eye dominant shoot mostly right handed. Shooting with both eyes open is one of the things that IDPA/USPCA forced me to learn.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I used to be when I first started shooting like 25 years ago. But was able to get my left eye to cooperate and now it closes naturally and not my right.

quote:

Originally posted by Black92LX:

I have never been able to shoot with both eyes open.

I know a woman who closes both eyes and smacks the trigger.

quote:

Originally posted by Alyron:
They force you to shoot with both eyes by blocking the sight with tape.

This.

Tape over the front of the RD with painters tape and use both eyes.
Look at the target and start with simple low ready and lift the gun on target. Don't look for the dot.

Both eyes open?
I had no idea.
Perhaps this is why I didn't care for the red dot on the P365XL I sold.

Plan to buy another pistol as a retirement gift for myself.
I'll make sure it has at least a cutout for an optic.

quote:

Originally posted by 92fstech:


At least your academy is willing to teach the dot.

Hasn’t always been that way. Back 15 years ago if you showed up to the academy with a rifle with a dot on it, you were given the choice to remove it, or voluntarily withdraw from the class. Then for the first 45 minutes of the class, the lead instructor would make the class stare at an EoTech that had been in a cooler full of ice overnight until it was unfogged enough to use. Then he would spend another 45 minutes on how red dots were a fad, and they were unreliable and they made your rifle useless. All of the staff at that time were in their 60s and 70s and hadn’t been on the road in 20 years.

That lasted until the day a new commissioner was installed by Governor Bevin. Dude was a legend in the state police. Anyway two state police troopers assigned to SRT showed up to a class and they were given the ultimatum. They told Baird to go fuck himself and left. The next week, the staff was retired and since then they have been replaced with guys that aren’t insistent in teaching 70s techniques.

^^^^^^^^^^^^
I one upped that nonsense and took my rifle course for an optic with these fellas named jljones and DocSteve.