Glock vs. a Box of Hammers (Picture Heavy Comparison)

October 25, 2018, 08:30 AM

cslinger

Wow Beretta must have had a price increase. That FS compact isn’t that old and was bought at Academy locally for like $580 IIRC putting right in Glock territory.

I did just do a quick web search and prices have jumped recently.

That being said I was trying to provide more subjective information then hard facts. Hard facts are easy to find but don’t always tell the story. Car guys and gun guys are notorious “magazine racers” if you will. Myself included. What that means is car X did the quarter .2 of a second faster hence it’s better then car Y. Gun X holds 1 more round so it’s better then gun Y.

When dealing with facts like sizes etc. the nuances can be lost. For example I was shocked at how heavy my loaded P99 came out. It feels as light as the Glock if not lighter.

Anyway. I appreciate the feedback.

Chris.

October 25, 2018, 10:48 AM

OLD_COP

Good read. Not a fanboy but the G19 is the standard by which others are judged. Thank you.

October 25, 2018, 11:58 AM

AllenInAR

That was a fun read.

I have 2 G19s (Gen4 & 5) and 3 1911 Commander types. I love them all but I carry the G19.

October 25, 2018, 12:38 PM

soggy_spinout

Nice read; a big thanks for putting it all together.

I'm still not buying that the Beretta is more reliable, not with that open slide of theirs. Out in the real, rough world I think I'd rather have far less openings in the slide of my pistol than to have one huge one that's just begging for all sorts of crap to find its way into. Which is another reason why I don't get all of these crazy slides with their lightening cuts and such for carry guns.

October 25, 2018, 01:04 PM

Warhorse

Well done, thanks for writing posting that!

October 25, 2018, 01:52 PM

dc54

I would put the CZ P07 in this category as well. My CGW P07 beats out my Sigs in a lot of ways and weighs close to the G19.

October 25, 2018, 02:07 PM

cslinger

quote:
I would put the CZ P07 in this category as well

I will happily take firearm donations....my FFL info is......

I have actually never shot any polymer CZ. It’s on my list though.

October 25, 2018, 03:48 PM

dc54

The trigger reach on the polymer CZs is easier for those of us with normal size mitts.

October 25, 2018, 04:45 PM

villageidiot

Give that Man a Cigar! Excellent post and Great pictures to go with it. VI

October 25, 2018, 10:37 PM

ruger357

This post caused me to buy an HK p2000 today. Thanks!

October 26, 2018, 08:41 AM

cslinger

I hope it works out for you. Your post was what made me throw this together.

A couple of HK 9mm caveats.
-They are tight and sprung heavy

-run a box or 3 of 124 grain NATO or 147 grain or defensive ammo early on. Basically hotter and or heavier. 115 grain plinking stuff may not have enough oooomph until they loosen up a bit.

-Clean and lube out of the box. Leave the slide locked open overnight, this will mitigate some break in.

-the steel tabs the slide runs on are covered in polymer that will quickly wear off. This is not a defect or problem in any way.

-Once you loosen them up as above they should run damn near anything. I cannot speak to steel cased as I tend to avoid it.

-you many very well need none of the above. Just don’t get bummed if you do. The guns are designed for LONG life and HOT ammo hence the minor break in early on. (None of my 9mms needed a break in but they were clean and locked back before the first range trip and I mostly run 124 NATO but all of mine run 115 grain powderpuff fine.

-If you run a light just use the Glock Key or whatever insert is for attaching whatever light to a Glock.

-Don’t pay more then $36 for mags.

-you may find the P2000 will fit some Glock 19/26 holsters.

-when shooting.....no the gun is not shooting low you are. Use a combat hold and cover what you are aiming at.

-This is just me but I make it a habit to wipe down my steel magazines after handling them for any brand. Probably just my OCD but keeps my mags in good shape.

-HK P30/VP9 mags fit and function perfectly. In the picture with all the contenders you will see a loose mag. That is a P30/VP9 mag that usually lives in that particular P2000. It has an XGrip adapter on it.

-I tend to run grease but have run everything from CLP to Ballistol to 3 in 1 oil with no issues.

-That flat baseplates make a big difference for carry. They are specific for the 9mm and .40 so make sure you get the right one and if you want them buy them as soon as you find them. They can be a PITA to find.

Congrats and I hope it works out for you.

As always,
Take care, shoot safe
Chris.

October 27, 2018, 08:16 AM

ruger357

quote:
Originally posted by cslinger:
I hope it works out for you. Your post was what made me throw this together.

A couple of HK 9mm caveats.
-They are tight and sprung heavy

-run a box or 3 of 124 grain NATO or 147 grain or defensive ammo early on. Basically hotter and or heavier. 115 grain plinking stuff may not have enough oooomph until they loosen up a bit.

-Clean and lube out of the box. Leave the slide locked open overnight, this will mitigate some break in.

-the steel tabs the slide runs on are covered in polymer that will quickly wear off. This is not a defect or problem in any way.

-Once you loosen them up as above they should run damn near anything. I cannot speak to steel cased as I tend to avoid it.

-you many very well need none of the above. Just don’t get bummed if you do. The guns are designed for LONG life and HOT ammo hence the minor break in early on. (None of my 9mms needed a break in but they were clean and locked back before the first range trip and I mostly run 124 NATO but all of mine run 115 grain powderpuff fine.

-If you run a light just use the Glock Key or whatever insert is for attaching whatever light to a Glock.

-Don’t pay more then $36 for mags.

-you may find the P2000 will fit some Glock 19/26 holsters.

-when shooting.....no the gun is not shooting low you are. Use a combat hold and cover what you are aiming at.

-This is just me but I make it a habit to wipe down my steel magazines after handling them for any brand. Probably just my OCD but keeps my mags in good shape.

-HK P30/VP9 mags fit and function perfectly. In the picture with all the contenders you will see a loose mag. That is a P30/VP9 mag that usually lives in that particular P2000. It has an XGrip adapter on it.

-I tend to run grease but have run everything from CLP to Ballistol to 3 in 1 oil with no issues.

-That flat baseplates make a big difference for carry. They are specific for the 9mm and .40 so make sure you get the right one and if you want them buy them as soon as you find them. They can be a PITA to find.

Congrats and I hope it works out for you.

As always,
Take care, shoot safe
Chris.

Thanks again.

Best place to find mags and flat floor plates?

Sights?

How about the da trigger? Does it need work?

October 27, 2018, 02:20 PM

cslinger

Top gun supply, cdnn, copes distributing have all done good by me. HKparts is EXPENSIVE but might have hard to find stuff.

Trigger, if V3, is typical crappy HK. Nowhere near as bad as the DA on the HK45c but it ain’t no SIG. I have heard lighter springs are easy and go a long way but I don’t monkey with my triggers in general and honestly the P2000/P30 trigger isn’t all that bad.

My HKs are all the LE versions with tru Dot night sights so I haven’t changed any out.

October 28, 2018, 06:50 AM

ruger357

quote:
Originally posted by cslinger:
Top gun supply, cdnn, copes distributing have all done good by me. HKparts is EXPENSIVE but might have hard to find stuff.

Trigger, if V3, is typical crappy HK. Nowhere near as bad as the DA on the HK45c but it ain’t no SIG. I have heard lighter springs are easy and go a long way but I don’t monkey with my triggers in general and honestly the P2000/P30 trigger isn’t all that bad.

My HKs are all the LE versions with tru Dot night sights so I haven’t changed any out.

Thanks again. I really enjoyed this post. By the way, I got a heck of a deal on the p2000. New on gunbroker for $499. Hopefully it will be here Tuesday.

October 28, 2018, 08:43 AM

Bulldog7972

quote:
Originally posted by soggy_spinout:
Nice read; a big thanks for putting it all together.

I'm still not buying that the Beretta is more reliable, not with that open slide of theirs. Out in the real, rough world I think I'd rather have far less openings in the slide of my pistol than to have one huge one that's just begging for all sorts of crap to find its way into. Which is another reason why I don't get all of these crazy slides with their lightening cuts and such for carry guns.

That's what we said when the Beretta first came out. That that huge hole in the slide would cause malfunctions, allow dirt inside etc. But in reality none of that happened. I finally purchased one and it was probably the most reliable pistol I ever owned. I shot thousands of rounds through that gun and never had one single malfunction.

October 28, 2018, 01:06 PM

corsair

Sigs are my first love and continue today to hold a special place however, my G19 has rapidly risen up my ranks of favorites. When I need to carry, it's my G19 or, 225 that get the call.

October 28, 2018, 07:51 PM

ScooterX

I really enjoyed your in depth review of hammers vs G19 Cslinger. Well done Sir, and ready for Handgunner magazine.

October 28, 2018, 11:55 PM

cslinger

quote:
Well done Sir, and ready for Handgunner magazine.

That would require true skills like the arcane arts of ...... spelling and proofreading .

Appreciate the thought though very much.

Once again for anybody reading this I am simply a gun dork. I am not running kill houses from 8-5. These are nothing more then my own personal regular guy who can barely find an x ring observations. My own preference for DA/SA comes from both my initial experience as well as a shift back to it when my daughter was born as my thoughts, no matter how erroneous they might be, were that kids accidentally bouncing into my holstered handgun were less likely to cause an AD with a heavy DA trigger vs a fairly light striker trigger. Again this is not meant to be I AM RIGHT!!! Just what I deemed more comfortable as far as safety. But again I am an idiot so always measure what I say against that.

October 29, 2018, 12:57 AM

lunchbox

quote:
Originally posted by BBMW:
An interesting comparison, but I have some methodology issues. I'll focus on one, price. You seem to be confusing objective price vs subjective value. Lets look at the Beretta 92 compact. A quick check shows it's street price (the street being Gunbroker) around $670-700+. A new Gen 5 Glock 19 $550-570. On price, that makes give Glock and unquestionable win.

Value is more subjective. I hear you point about all metal construction, and maybe better ergonomics as increasing the value of the Beretta. But those are likely better covered by other categories, or be their own category (ergonomics / shootability should definitely be a category.)

That's just one example.

Ooohhh.... your that guy.