So entering the world of red dots. I bought the new version of the Ruger Mk IV 22/45 that has a top rib designed for red dot sights. It accepts the Shield RMS pattern, meaning I can use a Holosun K-cut optic directly without adapter plates. Playing around with it in the shop it will also accept Leupold Deltapoint and Sig Pro cut optics as well. So yeah, latest justification for buying a new gun, cheap rimfire ammo to practice getting the hang of using a red dot sight.

I've had the pistol for a few weeks now, thrown it in the bag for every range trip and probably put over 1,000 rounds through it. I like it, not as accurate with it as I am my Buckmark which I've probably had for 30 years. But, I'm used to it now, it shoots, now I don't feel like I'm taking a risk buying an optic for a gun I'm not comfortable with.

I just need to decide what to get. Don't want to cheap out and also don't want to spend a fortune. Goals are direct mount with no plates, ability to co-witness the iron sights, and have something that will be beneficial for training. I've narrowed it down to 3, but still haven't decided on a dot size.

Holosun 407K - Cheapest at $229, haven't decided between 2MOA or 6MOA dot if go that route, both available locally.

Holosun 507K - Available with the Vulcan reticle for $349 and would have to be ordered. Intrigued with the Vulcan reticle with the 230MOA outer ring as an aid to, "Finding the dot". Not sure how much of a training aid that might be.

Holusun EPS - 3MOA available locally for $329, 6MOA version would have to be ordered. Enclosed emitter and this would be the standard size not the, "Carry" version, much larger lens than the 407K and 507K. That appeals to me, I think the larger lens would be useful since I'm just getting into red dots and I have no intention of ever carrying this gun. They do have the multiple reticle version available with the dot, circle and circle/dot, but it's about $100 more, that's more than I'm comfortable spending on a red dot sight at this point.

So what says the all knowing oracle of knowledge that is SigForum? Pros and cons of what I'm considering. Anything I may need to look at as well?

And obligatory pics of the gun.

I strongly prefer enclosed optics for any not concealed carry (protected by garments) or range toys. I’m probably going to get an EPS for my 22/45 Lite, unless I can find an ACRO or Trijicon enclosed for a good price. It depends on how much I think I’ll really use it under night vision.

Enjoy your new pistol. DaBigBR, a forum member and dealer, has great prices on Holosun optics. You should check with him. Brad is a good guy to deal with.

I have a 407C on my Mk IV w/ the 2 MOA red dot. I've been happy with the optic...zero issues so far. For what I'm using that gun for, there's no huge need for anything more fancy, or an enclosed emitter IMO.

I also have 2 P320s set up with optics. My personal gun has a Trijicon RMR on it. At the time I bought it, the RMR was kind of the gold standard for durability, but I have to admit I don't much like the tinted glass or the tiny window. That gun has kind of migrated into an HD role, so it doesn't get carried much.

My duty gun is a P320 with a Romeo 1 Pro (also 2MOA red dot). I've been using this setup for a little over a year. I wanted at least a Romeo2 or some other enclosed emitter optic, but this is what they bought us. To be honest I have had no issues related to the open emitter in the time that I've been carrying it. I have had a few issues (keep in mind that this is a duty gun that gets carried every day, shot A LOT, and has been out in pretty harsh conditions and through a few pretty intense classes):

1. My zero has shifted a total of one time. Part of my morning routine is to check the dot against the irons, and I immediately noticed that it was off. Unfortunately, my original witness marks had worn off so I can't say if was something internal or if the adjustment screws (Which have very weak, almost non-existent "clicks") got bumped, but I re-zeroed it and etched new witness marks into the housing with a knife. It hasn't moved since.

2. This sight is equipped with Motac motion activation. One morning I picked it up and it was off. I shook the gun and it didn't come on. I pressed one of the brightness buttons and the dot came back. It hasn't happened again since.

3. There's no warning when the battery dies. It was working just fine in the morning, by noon it was gone. It's not really a flaw...more of a design issue, but something to be aware of.

My favorite of the three that I own is the 407C, and not just because it was the cheapest. The glass is clearer, the window is big, and the construction is rugged. The backup solar panel is a great feature, and you don't have to pull the optic off to change the battery. The recessed buttons are better than the ones on the Romeo (although with the shroud on the Romeo I've never had an issue), but not quite as nice as the big ones on the RMR.

Everything you've listed is a good pick. A couple things:

407k is only available in 6 MOA. It's a good dot size for .22 and the low to no recoil makes the smaller window not a big deal.

The EPS line is great and the full-size one would be great on a Mark IV. Dot size doesn't really matter that much to me beyond personal preference. I would not spend my money on the multiple reticle system. Most people end up using dot only.

The same is true for the ACSS Vulcan. Some folks really like the giant ring, but I think that long term is a crutch and learning on a dot only will yield the best results the fastest. Pistol optics success is all about efficiency and consistency.

quote:

Originally posted by 2Adefender:
Enjoy your new pistol. DaBigBR, a forum member and dealer, has great prices on Holosun optics. You should check with him. Brad is a good guy to deal with.

Thanks for the referral! Glad to help.

quote:

Originally posted by DaBigBR:
407k is only available in 6 MOA.

I'm shocked! You mean Cabela's got something wrong in their catalog listing?

I recently migrated a Holosun 507k onto my MkIII 22/45 using a Lobo Industries mount.

My other 22/45 is my match 22. C-More optic, comp, blah blah blah. All that to say I actually prefer the 507k/Lobo mount to the traditional C-More setup. The smaller “k” Holosun seem perfect size wise for the Ruger.

For a 22 I could give a shit about closed emitters. For that matter I really could give a shit anyway lol. Eventually over time I will probably transition to closed emitters but in my experience I have never had an issue with a “blocked” emitter using RMR, SRO, DPP, 507k’s or even the original DP. While I think the closed emitters is an improvement, it isn’t a revolutionary improvement. Wildly overthought for most civilian deployments. IMO. And my experience.

407k for the win. I almost never use the fighter pilot reticle.

Edited to add: my BIL just started into optics so I don’t know if this is a him problem or something to watch for. We went shooting and his battery door got unscrewed enough to launch itself. Never found the screw. Had to get Holosun to send out a new one. Witness mark it was my advice, I think he also purple loctites it now. I have never had this issue on either of mine.

Since this is a fun gun, the EPS Carry would be a little overkill but perfect for a CCW gun. The only real difference with the 407 v 507 is having the option for a circle dot reticle. I don't think the Vulcan reticle would do much on a .22 since there's very little recoil.

If you think the circle dot would help, do the 507, otherwise the 407 should be fine.

quote:

407k is only available in 6 MOA.

Holosun's own product page for the 407 series currently shows only 2 MOA sized dots being available, with the lone option being either a red or green emitter. Same size dot for the 507 series as well when set to using only the single dot reticle.

.

What helped me decide to jump into the Red Dot was renting a few pistols at the local range that had different red dots attached.

Dot size mattered to me more than dot color or the dot type. If you haven't had a chance to try different red dot versions, this will give you some personal experience.

Also factor into your decision the red dot's controls, battery access, some are easier to use than others and you might want some play time to figure out what you like and what you hate.

I think any of the models you listed are acceptable, but they are your eyes and your fingers not mine that truly matters.

.

507 the outer ring makes a world of difference in getting used to finding the dot, which for me was difficult initially. They certainly find the flaws in your firearm presentation and aiming!

IF you have astigmatism, which a lot do, you'll see a bigger blurry dot the larger the MOA. See if your LGS will let you look through them, I found that Sigs Optics tended to reduce the flare from my astigmatism.

quote:

Originally posted by monoblok:

quote:

407k is only available in 6 MOA.

Holosun's own product page for the 407 series currently shows only 2 MOA sized dots being available, with the lone option being either a red or green emitter. Same size dot for the 507 series as well when set to using only the single dot reticle.

407k per Holosun's website is only available in a 6MOA dot.

I have a 507 with the ACSS reticle. As you get used to it,the less you need the large circle. It can be turned off to extend battery life. The top of the chevron does make a very precise aiming point.