quote:

Originally posted by Voshterkoff:
I assume you mostly carry concealed, or with a Safariland with optic guard? My other question is how snow interferes with it.

Correct. I carry it most of the time concealed. When I don’t, it’s in a safariland with a cover. I’ve not had much experience shooting it in heavy snow where it may cause issue. Where I live, that’s a twice per year problem.

RMR’s may not be perfect and they may not fit everyone’s needs. I fully admit it. But, I won’t ever be without one. I haven’t seen an issue that could make me want to go back to irons.

Excellent. Thank you, JLJ, for both replies. This is kind of feedback I need to hear.

And yes, your advanced course sounds awesome. I'm assuming Pat McNamara is teaching it, then.

Lol, not Pat Mac. Just an Academy class.

I think the jury is out on this red dot value question, no?

Unless you are a bullseye master expertly lining up that front post between those two white dots, the threat focus red dot aiming method is crazy easier to grasp and master.

The endless variations, "improvements", radioactive tubes, different colors, trapezoids, etc etc in iron sights can just stop and be relegated to the dustbin of history.

Give me a CR2032 battery, a sealing plate, and black suppressor sights and let's go!!

quote:

Originally posted by Catalina:
...

Give me a CR2032 battery, a sealing plate, and black suppressor sights and let's go!!

You bring up a question I was needing answered, sir.

The question of the Sealing Plate. Should I get one for my P320 Carry and P365 cuts? I've read both sides in the endless Googling.

I don't PLAN on going over-the-beach with my RMR, but I guess if the mill isn't perfectly smooth then I need to get a sealing plate, yes?

What does it hurt? It’s a $9 item. Don’t know if it really makes a difference for my uses, but I’ll use it for $9 or whatever it costs.

quote:

RMR’s may not be perfect and they may not fit everyone’s needs. I fully admit it. But, I won’t ever be without one. I haven’t seen an issue that could make me want to go back to irons.

I concur whole heartily.

I will readily admit that a red dot on a pistol is inherently more accurate and once you master acquiring the dot fast is just plane simply the best way to shoot.... with that said I still fall back on "never trust your life solely to electronics.

Last time I went to Front Sight I spent three days training with a Sig P320 compact with the factory Romeo sight.... it actually got pretty boring never missing and just drilling hole after hole. Then on the day of the qualification test I pull the pistol out and no dot.... luckily I was smart enough to have spare batteries with me. Not sure any bad guys would have been willing to accommodate me changing batteries.

As for a defensive weapon in close quarters, which is the most likely situation... well hell you are probably not going to be using sights of any type.

Regarding sealing plates -

Recently picked up a 365XL and added a Romeo Zero. The Romeo Zero came with the sealing plate, but no mention of it was found in the instructions. A google search brought up one interesting perspective on why it was necessary.

Disclaimer: This is internet lore and may be incorrect. The reason for the sealing plate is to provide electrical insulation between the Romeo Zero's battery and the slide. Without it battery life can be significantly shortened.

The thing this thread has reenforced to me- Never train at Front Sight.

quote:

Originally posted by Blume9mm:
Then on the day of the qualification test I pull the pistol out and no dot.... luckily I was smart enough to have spare batteries with me. Not sure any bad guys would have been willing to accommodate me changing batteries.

As for a defensive weapon in close quarters, which is the most likely situation... well hell you are probably not going to be using sights of any type.

And that's probably the biggest problem with using a Red Dot for EDC. You can probably think you can get around it by changing batteries long before they'd be discharged, but what if you get a defective battery and it only works for a day or so? What then? And I've had a number of factory defective batteries over the years I've been on the planet. Some of them worked for very short periods of time.

A couple of points on the above. At least on an RMR the purpose of the 'sealing' plate is (wait for it) sealing when there is not a place for the oring to seat/seal. https://www.trijicon.com/frequ...uestions/most-viewed
It doesn't hurt using one if its not needed.
I simply cannot imagine anyone would not have backup irons on an EDC gun. SO a battery failure literally means you are doing what you would have done anyway. And at modest distances I find centering in the RMR window generates pretty good accuracy even without the dot available. There are certainly some circumstances where the dot on the gun makes the irons less or even not useful, but the ones of those I know about I take pains to avoid.

Thanks all.

1) Yes, backup irons will be present on my red-dot'd pistols.

2) The sealing plate Trijicon sells for their RMRs are made of stainless steel, much like the SIG slide, so the idea they're for some sort of electrical insulation for the sake of battery life doesn't seem to jive.

3) All these pro/con arguments seem to be reminiscent of the "red dots on rifle" threads of old.

During my match yesterday the dot was turning into a blob in recoil. Sharp when centered, blob in recoil. No amount of lens cleaning worked. When I got home , I cleaned emitter thoroughly and it seemed to work. Headed to the range now to verify.

No huge drama. Still finished 75% of overall match winner but it was unnecessarily distracting and just suboptimal. Reinforced my plan to cut down my open emitter optics to a bare minimum.

what optic?

The SRO.

quote:

Originally posted by jljones:
The thing this thread has reenforced to me- Never train at Front Sight.

At front sight it is all about drilling in drawing from concealed and putting the sights on the target and firing two rounds.

What I learned latter when I took a force on force class twice at the Sig Acadamy was in most of the situations they put you in there was no time to use the sights... when a guy bust in a room and and is about 10 feet away and shooting people you don't have the time to use them.... in fact in one the only reason I used the sights on the P226 I was issued was the knife wielding perp I had shot and he was down but still holding the knife just below his chest and a threat and I did not want to shoot him in the hand. I had been shot in the hand in a previous class and was still bleeding.

quote:

Originally posted by YVK:
The SRO.

Sorry to hear that. Please post back when you get it sorted out. First I've heard of such an oddity.

quote:

Originally posted by dehughes:

quote:

Originally posted by YVK:
The SRO.

Sorry to hear that. Please post back when you get it sorted out. First I've heard of such an oddity.

It is sorted out. I probably should start bringing Q-tips to the matches, along with a lens pen, cloth, and lens cleaner that I already have in my bag. Cleaning the emitter window took care of that weird sector of blur.

Projection issues are quite common, they just range in their magnitude. Stuff on the window, on the emitter, etc. Shooting against low lying sun is something that can bring out blobs and distorted dots very easily.

Two IDPA matches ago, the sun was right over the back of the berm on my first stage.

There were TWO identical red dots
in my SRO.
Some kind of reflection, or my astigmatism, I guess. I lost a little time and dropped several shots into the -1's.

I can 't claim that same lighting situation hasn't cost me when shooting irons with a gold bead front sight.

(It's great excuse number 25b.)