I worked for a short time at a small city police department that would issue the Smith and Wesson 40 Sigma's. I asked to carry my personal Glock 22 instead and I was allowed to for duty. I felt sorry for the officers that carried that pistol a trigger like a brick being pulled through mud. On the other hand I had a friend the carried an issue Colt Commander for a small college. So what you pistol made you cry when it was handed to you... just kidding cops don't cry we just grumble ...VI
I'm going to say a S&W Model 15...only because many other agencies were beginning to transition over to semi auto pistols. But the lounge lizards who made the decisions thought if it was good enough for them, it was good enough for us. We had JUST six extra rounds on our belts, again because the lounge lizards thought it was enough.
At least we were issued 870 shotguns with slugs and 00. Those got a lot of use back then.
i was able to carry my HK USP in 40. So, I was cool with that.
Ashland carried AMT hardballers. I watched one guy get so frustrated with failures when practicing for qualification, that he threw the gun at the target when it was locked open.
HAD to furnish my own personal firearm. Colt Combat Commander 45acp. all of the other uniform officers carried 38/357 revolers / detectives carried 9mm semi-autos( again personal) but the Chief when he came out to play carried a S/W 29 in 44mag when told to get rid of the 45auto because the range Only allowed 38//357. when I demanded it be put in a written order the order was recended abd I kept carrying the Colt ....................drill sgt.
The S&W 4043. Worst DAO 3rd Gen Smith auto ever.
No one could control the trigger long enough to hit anything and the primer wipe was the worst I have ever seen. Several times I saw primers actually pierced by the firing pin.
How did we wind up with the turd?
Golf outing! The local Smith sales Rep offered my asshole chief a golf outing if he bought the gun. To Hilton Head.
No testing or evaluation. And this was after I shot my entire ammo budget for the year on ammo for our 686s.
When we finally dumped them for P229s, the distributor offered to let us buy the 4043s for a scandalously cheap price. No takers.
The whole 4043 scam made my blood boil and still does!
End of Earth: 2 Miles
Upper Peninsula: 4 Miles
When we transitioned from the 1911 to the M9, beretta....it was huge and females couldn’t even hold it properly to qualify, plus they didn’t do well in the salt water environment.
Then We moved to the Sig 229 in DAK, the triggers were abominable...even trying to teach people who had never shot before, the trigger was less than stellar. The CG is still stuck with them.
In reality they should have gotten the Glock in the 90s...but the powers that be chose differently.
When I was a cop, I started with a Sig 226 in 9mm! Hose things were so nice! We went to the 226 in 357 Sig and scores went down due to recoil.
Eventually the females were issued 229 or 228 in 9mm because of hand size. Then the dept went back to 9mm due to money(any way to save a dime).
I retired and kept my 357SIG. So I’ve only ever had one pos and it was he DAK...I Qualified with it and shot expert but I hated it, I hated having to teach it to new sailors and I hated that we couldn’t change the springs, kinda like getting a Bruce gray work on the fire control system.
"Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor.”
― Robert A. Heinlein
“ You may beat me, but you will never win.” sigmonkey-2020
None really, when I was hired 1989, my agency was transitioning to SIGs (officer's choice of 220 in .45, or 226,225,or 228 in 9mm). They had previously carried S&W 686 and 66s.
The order of issuance for the SIGs was by seniority, so new hires were going to get a revolver. However, you could carry your own Semi Auto if it was approved by the Range Master. I received permission to carry my own Beretta 92FC (13 round version). I had carried and qualified with a Beretta 9mm my last year at Ft. Knox.
After my first year, I was issued a SIG P226 9mm. I later switched over to a SIG P220.
So really, I can't say that any duty gun was a bad one.
Tomorrow's battle is won during today's practice.
|Fighting the good fight|
I can't complain too much. The "worst" I was ever issued was a Gen 3 Glock 17.
I only say it was the "worst" because, at the time, aftermarket mods were not allowed, other than slip on rubber grip sleeves. And I have big hands, and get railroad track slide bite from stock Glocks. So I just had to suck it up and accept the fact that I was going to be bloody after every round of training.
Once we went to Gen 4s in 2012ish, the beavertail backstraps alleviated that. Plus, aftermarket mods started to be allowed with approval (and within reason), and I got approval for a Grip Force beavertail, which I like even more than the factory beavertail backstraps.
(Now, I'm the Training Supervisor, so I get to carry basically whatever I want. . I mostly carry a personal P320 now, but still qualify with my issued Glock 17.)
The worst duty gun I've ever seen being carried was on a former SRO for a nearby tiny agency, who carried a Walther PPK for her duty gun, in one of those ultra cheap Uncle Mike's nylon holsters with the nylon strap. I shit you not. But I seriously doubt that was issued...
|The Quiet Man|
Trigger wasn't the issue. At least not on the early guns. It was heavy, but smooth and short. The problem was the gun wasn't up to the caliber. Frames cracked at relatively low round counts. They were the only 3rd gen Smiths I ever saw with reliability issues. I went through 5 in the first 7 years of my career. We briefly went to the 4043 Tactical. It beefed up the frame and helped with the cracking, but they changed the trigger and hammer set up which negatively effected the pull. Reliability was still iffy.
If we'd kept the 5946 or even gone to the steel framed 4046 I'd probably not have hated Smiths for as long as I did. When we upgraded to the 229 it was a major improvement.
S & W Sigma in .40. We transitioned from model 19 to semi autos. They had so many malfunctions that S&W totally replaced them. The replacement was nearly as bad. Finally they went to Glock 22.
Beretta 96D. Department has them coated in NP3 which was a nice idea, but mine was so tight, it would stick 1/2 open after a few rounds. Once you hit the mag to clear that jam, it would go into battery. I learned to carry a backup after being told they wouldn’t replace it.
The one gun I didn’t buy when we switched.
|Prepared for the Worst, Providing the Best|
Since I've been there, they've all been good. We've made some poor decisions on other gear, but the gun choices have been on the money. I started on a DA/SA P229 (guys that wanted it could get the DAK), and now we have P320s. I was also issued a P365 for a while, which wasn't bad, but I passed it along in favor of a second P320 (subcompact). Honestly, if I could carry whatever I wanted on duty, I'd probably stick with what I have right now.
This is easy for me, it was a SW 4006, what a POS.
Easy. S&W Smagma 40’s. Biggest piece of shit ever. They had 5906’s before I got hired on. They were boat anchors but, they were reliable and accurate. After a few years with the Smagma’s we went to Gen3 22’s. Now it is Gen4 Block 22’s.
|Do No Harm,|
Do Know Harm
.45 S&W M&P.
Trigger was god awful.
Had to give up an HK USP .45 for that piece of shit. Still mad about that.
Second worse is my current .40 M&P. Trigger is slightly better. Still hate it.
Both the earlier generations. We had 2.0s locked down for free but some brass braniac killed the deal.
Knowing what one is talking about is widely admired but not strictly required here.
Although sometimes distracting, there is often a certain entertainment value to this easy standard.
"All I need is a WAR ON DRUGS reference and I got myself a police thread BINGO." -jljones
Agreed. We transitioned from S&W model 10's to the 4006. Heavy & not very accurate. Issued mags were defective. Chief wouldn't buy new ones so I bought new ones on my own.
Rom 13:4 If you do evil, be afraid. For he does not bear the sword in vain. For he is God's minister, an avenger to execute wrath on him who practices evil.
S&W 4046. Worst ever.
Haven’t had many.
Beretta 92D Centurion (2/1998-4/1998)
Second (current) agency:
S&W 4046 (5/1998-1/2002)
Glock 22 (gen3) (1/2002-1/2008)
Glock 31 (gen3) (1/2008-5/2012)
Glock 31 (gen4) (5/2012-1/2018)
Glock 31 (gen4) (1/2018-5/2031)This message has been edited. Last edited by: Chowser,
Not minority enough!
I hate to say it, but the worst duty gun I was ever issued was a SIG 220ST. We only kept them for about 18 months before transitioning to M&P .45’s which weren’t stellar but way better than the SIG.
In 1982 in the Bureau of Prisons I was issued a Colt Police Positive with electrical tape holding the grips on and 158gr RNL ammo. Eventually we got S&W model 64s. The RNL stayed until we went to 9mms 8 or 9 years later. An officer accidentally discharged one into the inside door panel of a pickup. The round got stuck in the plastic liner.
When I first started in LEO, we were allowed to carry anything we wanted within reason. 9mm to 44 SPL. Most guys carried a 1911, Glock or 92's. I carried a Delta in 10mm and a P228 Two Tone in 9mm.
We hired a new chief from KHP and he standardized us to the P226's. Loved those Sigs. They were Pre railed models and rails were starting to become the new norm. We got word that he was switching us over to Smiths in 40. No one complained to much until we went to the range to get qualified and issued our new Sigma's! Needless to say we raised a little hell. No one was going to carry that pile of shit and when pointed out that the Sigma was not even allowed for off duty carry, the chief backed down. He didn't last long after that though. Quit after 3 years to run for sheriff of a neighboring county, won the primary, had to move. Before he left, he switched us over to the Glock 22. To my knowledge, they still carry them to this day.
My current department is much like my first. Carry what you want in 9mm/40/45 black weapons unmodified. Most carry Glock's, M&P's XD's and 3 old timers still carry a P228. They just allowed the Glock 48 for plain cloths carry this month.
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