Just watched a video about the Beretta "1911" as it was titled, a review of the 92XI SAO.

What makes this a 1911? Beretta doesn't call it that. It's SAO, yes. It has a frame mounted safety, yes. And it is 9mm, which is becoming very popular in XX11 guns. But that seems to be where the 1911 similarity ends and none of those things are exclusive to the 1911 platform.

Then there is the trend to call guns a 2011 venacularly and now even a 2311 when the platform diverges well beyond what has been iconic for the 1911 design.

So, what makes a 1911 a 1911 or a 1911ish gun enough of a 1911 to be called a 1911, or a 2011 or a 2311?

No offense to other thinking folks, but my first on the list of describing a 1911 is 45acp.

quote:

Originally posted by SIGWolf:
Just watched a video about the Beretta "1911" as it was titled, a review of the 92XI SAO.

What makes this a 1911? Beretta doesn't call it that. It's SAO, yes. It has a frame mounted safety, yes. And it is 9mm, which is becoming very popular in XX11 guns. But that seems to be where the 1911 similarity ends and none of those things are exclusive to the 1911 platform.

It is. It was used to get clicks on YouTube and nothing more.

quote:

Then there is the trend to call guns a 2011 venacularly and now even a 2311 when the platform diverges well beyond what has been iconic for the 1911 design.

So, what makes a 1911 a 1911 or a 1911ish gun enough of a 1911 to be called a 1911, or a 2011 or a 2311?

The 1911 is straight forward. 2011 is a style and trademark. A 2011 style gun is a slide, a frame rail, and a separate grip and trigger guard bolted to that frame instead of a fat Para Ordnance-style double stack frame. Staccato's patent on the 2011 expired, but they still have and enforce their trademark to the term "2011." A 2311 is a term to get around the confusion for something else just like Springfield using 1911 DS.

quote:

Originally posted by SIGWolf:
So, what makes a 1911 a 1911 or a 1911ish gun enough of a 1911 to be called a 1911, ...

This works for me: What Makes a 1911 a 1911?

quote:

Originally posted by SIGWolf:
... or a 2011 or a 2311?

Never heard of a "2311." As to 2011: It's ill-defined, but, essentially the same things that make for a 1911, except often has a polymer grip module with a squared trigger guard, and is usually double-stack.

Girsan is doing a 2011 style gun and calling it a "2311" while Oracle Arms is doing a 2311 that's a cross between a 2011 and a Sig.

quote:

Originally posted by SIGWolf:
Just watched a video about the Beretta "1911" as it was titled, a review of the 92XI SAO.

What makes this a 1911? Beretta doesn't call it that. It's SAO, yes.

It doesn't, by any stretch of the imagination. It's typical bullshit click bait by the reviewer.

Of course Beretta didn't call it a 1911, because they would have been the laughing stock of the firearm world.

quote:

Originally posted by SIGWolf:
Then there is the trend to call guns a 2011 venacularly and now even a 2311 when the platform diverges well beyond what has been iconic for the 1911 design.

Well, that's why they weren't called "1911".

This message has been edited. Last edited by: 12131,

quote:

Originally posted by DanH:
Girsan is doing a 2011 style gun and calling it a "2311" while Oracle Arms is doing a 2311 that's a cross between a 2011 and a Sig.

But they're really (or closer to being) Para / Caspian style guns, not 2011's. Being double stack doesn't make it a 2011.

Les Baer, Bill Wilson and Ted Yost can probably clear up any confusion on what constitutes a 1911.

quote:

Originally posted by cas:
But they're really (or closer to being) Para / Caspian style guns, not 2011's. Being double stack doesn't make it a 2011.

No, they aren't. They use the same frame rail that has a grip module with the trigger pack bolted to it. The Girsan is even using 2011 magazines. The Oracle Arms has nothing to do with a Para style double stack as no parts interchange.

Correction. I was going off some bad info that the Girsan was not modular. Digging past that I see that's wrong.

While I am a gun guy’s gun guy and I pretty much appreciate anything safe from NERF to belt fed I must confess I just don’t like “riding safeties” ala 1911/2011 etc. I mean I can and I appreciate the triggers etc. but I just don’t care for that thumb over safety feel.

quote:

Originally posted by cslinger:
While I am a gun guy’s gun guy and I pretty much appreciate anything safe from NERF to belt fed I must confess I just don’t like “riding safeties” ala 1911/2011 etc. I mean I can and I appreciate the triggers etc. but I just don’t care for that thumb over safety feel.

I don't care for the thumb over safety feel either. I just don't do it and I don't have any issues with not doing so.

quote:

Originally posted by YooperSigs:
Les Baer, Bill Wilson and Ted Yost can probably clear up any confusion on what constitutes a 1911.

There's 1911 purists who say they're not really 1911's anymore since they've drifted (added) so much from the original design. Not me, while I love those old original commercial / mil-spec 1911's, I can't shoot them. So I don't own any.

And of course there's lots of people, frustrated after trying to add aftermarket parts to a Baer would angrily tell your they're just 1911 shaped.