This may have been discussed before, but I apparently missed it...the new rules for USPSA specifically say finger groove removal is legal for Production.
https://uspsa.org/viewer/Appendix_D4.pdf

What they did to Production is a shame.

It is a slippery slope.

I'm not a competion shooter, but I just read those rules and they look reasonable (tame) to me. Grip mods to a polymer gun are pretty darn common for carry guns, even duty guns.

I don’t think it’s a big deal either. It’s not like removing finger grooves on a Glock is revolutionary. Gens 1-2 and 5 didn’t have them, so not allowing their removal in Gens 3-4 is really splitting hairs. I’m glad they made the change, and now I don’t have to spend the coin on a Gen 5 G34. Just going to remove the grooves in my Gen 4 and stipple it. Does anyone happen to know a good stippler in Central Ohio? I don’t really want to mess with shipping.

quote:

Originally posted by Strambo:
I'm not a competion shooter, but I just read those rules and they look reasonable (tame) to me. Grip mods to a polymer gun are pretty darn common for carry guns, even duty guns.

But the idea of the division was unmodified guns.

quote:

Originally posted by cas:

quote:

Originally posted by Strambo:
I'm not a competion shooter, but I just read those rules and they look reasonable (tame) to me. Grip mods to a polymer gun are pretty darn common for carry guns, even duty guns.

But the idea of the division was unmodified guns.

Production has always allowed some minor mode like grips, sights, and trigger work. This won't change anyone's scores.

If people are that hard set on 'unmodified' guns to make it 'equal', they should just have a different box stock gun for each stage of fire that competitors take turns using.

quote:

Originally posted by Ryanp225:

quote:

Originally posted by cas:

quote:

Originally posted by Strambo:
I'm not a competion shooter, but I just read those rules and they look reasonable (tame) to me. Grip mods to a polymer gun are pretty darn common for carry guns, even duty guns.

But the idea of the division was unmodified guns.

Production has always allowed some minor mode like grips, sights, and trigger work. This won't change anyone's scores.

Not really sure how this is any different.

quote:

Originally posted by RHINOWSO:
If people are that hard set on 'unmodified' guns to make it 'equal', they should just have a different box stock gun for each stage of fire that competitors take turns using.

Or everyone use the same one gun.

But, at every match I have been to, there is always one whiner who complains and complains about an advantage they want to take, that they argue with the RO over, trying to convince them that what they want to do is legal.

So, this will certainly never work.

I was just thinking it would be fun to have a stock G19 on stage 1, HK45 on stage 2, S&W MP340 with 357 Mags on 3... etc... And everyone had to use the firearm provided...

May the best shooter win!

My biggest gripe of the last several years is they keep taking the "division" out of the divisions, they keep making them more and more alike. This last bunch of changes is just more of the same. What we have now is two Limited divisions, broken up into price ranges.


Roll back the production rules.
Make Single Stack 45 ACP only.
Return revolver to 6 shot only.
Make the upper scoring zone all A.
No more non penalty Mike's.
Remove L-10 magazine length limit (just cause it's so stupid)
And most important.... Ban small pistol primer 45 ACP brass!!!!

This is my platform for my run for USPSA president.

quote:

Originally posted by RHINOWSO:
I was just thinking it would be fun to have a stock G19 on stage 1, HK45 on stage 2, S&W MP340 with 357 Mags on 3... etc... And everyone had to use the firearm provided...

May the best shooter win!

You can't do that!

If people had to shoot true unmodified stock guns, how could anyone buy themselves a trophy?

This happens in many sports. As cas says, you end up with two divisions that aren't really divided at all.

I have no issue with the rules change as long as they are administered in a fair and equitable manner in accordance with the rules as written... which has been a big issue with this administration and why we are in the production rule rewrite in the first place. If CGW hammers and Springer mag releases are going to be quasi legal, then why not allow agency triggers, etc?? Slippery slope, yes. But they can't seem to apply the rules as they were written, so maybe they can apply them correctly now.

Ben Stoeger is still going to be the top dog regardless of what John Q. Localguy does to his glock... but I certainly understand the objections on principle and take issue with how the current administration has "adjusted" the rules over the last few years to make exceptions for certain items while keeping others illegal.

Please understand that the Production changes DO NOT go into effect until Mid-May (3 months after their announcement by the BOD). Carry Optics and PCC changes are immediate, since they were made prior to removing their "provisional" status.

The camel's nose came into the tent a long time ago with Production, and the amount of "legal" mods kept creeping up. I think the changes will make it easier to RO the Division, equipment-wise, and it should allow some people to make their guns fit them better. Aside from that, I agree that standings aren't going to change.

I just want a division where I could compete with my P220.
Damn 1911 nerds.

quote:

Originally posted by Ryanp225:
I just want a division where I could compete with my P220.
Damn 1911 nerds.

Yeah, I sold my P220ST after I realized Limited 10 was the only place I could use it (if I could find enough 10-rd 220 mags). It helped fund my X5 Allround purchase and it went to a good home.

I started in L-10 with a 220ST.

What's with all the rules? Many on this Forum have said you cannot buy it you must train to do it. So, if it is truly only skill obtained by traning, who cares about the guns?

quote:

Originally posted by ACP1:
What's with all the rules? Many on this Forum have said you cannot buy it you must train to do it. So, if it is truly only skill obtained by traning, who cares about the guns?

Only top competetion shooters. It matters not to any serious CCW carrier or 75% of competition shooters who aren't in the top (but they still think it does).

Rules have to apply equally to all....but IMHO they are written for the top 25% who actually could gain a tenth of a second here and a hundreth there and edge out the guy next to them of equal skill, but a slightly worse trigger or grip per se.

The other 75% would do better with more training, hand them an unlimited race gun in the stock division...they still aren't placing...