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1. As far as you know does the US Secret Service still use the DAK trigger in their P229 pistols ? 2. What is / was their impressions of the DAK trigger ? And other LEO impressions on the DAK ? 3. Does SIG still make / offer the DAK to LE depts and if so how does this jibe with what I'm hearing about SIG not supporting / getting away from the DAK ? Thanks. | ||
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| Freethinker |
I’m not certain, but I don’t believe the Secret Service issues DAK pistols. As I recall, at least one member here works for an agency that does, but otherwise it would be a rare thing. A couple of people where I work are issued DAK P226s. They started out as essentially novice shooters and did okay with P220s, but they and a former employee or two all did better with the replacements. Part of that was probably due to the 226s’ being chambered for 9mm, but even as inexperienced as they were with shooting handguns, they certainly had no more problem adapting to the DAK trigger than the two-pull-type DA/SA P220 triggers. One obvious advantage of DAK SIGs over most hammerless pistols is that it’s harder to have an unintentional discharge due to not paying attention when holstering in a stressful situation. Fortunately none of them were exposed to the propaganda that the DAK trigger was a terrible system that no one liked; they therefore don’t labor under that belief and just shoot the guns when required. And of course, unless someone has some sort of physical disability or mental deficiency, the DAK trigger should be no more difficult to operate than a Glock’s—to cite just one of many examples: Pull the trigger and it fires; stop pulling the trigger and it stops firing. The thing that seems very odd to me as a veteran of the days when virtually all law enforcement handguns were double action revolvers is that although a very few lawmen (almost all were men) preferred the single action 1911 trigger, I never knew anyone in LE who couldn’t manage the revolver trigger. And the relevance of that observation? The function of DAK trigger, including its stroke and reset, is just the same as a well-tuned DA revolver’s. I have carried a DAK P229 almost exclusively for about 13 years now, and it’s by far my preference for concealed carry. I do most of my training with DAK P226s, and my shoot-at-3-yards-and-don’t-look-at-the-sights split times are a tiny fraction of a second slower than when I use a P320, but otherwise my performance is the same. I have no idea about the current DAK support SIG gives to LE agencies. When we ordered our last one we waited a long time to receive it, but I don’t know that that signifies anything. The best thing would be to contact them directly, but it’s obviously good to get up to date information from actual users. Perhaps someone with more current experience will chime in. ► 6.4/93.6 ___________ “We are Americans …. Together we have resisted the trap of appeasement, cynicism, and isolation that gives temptation to tyrants.” — George H. W. Bush | |||
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| Member |
http://www.thetruthaboutguns.c...ng-to-p229-dak-sigs/ | |||
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| Member |
Nobody really knows the true facts about any agency, and if they did they can't say. So what is your point of a 2012 posting. Sig has discontinued DAK at least for commercial sales. But for LE sales I would have no idea personally but I'm pretty sure if you want 10,000 of anything Sig will build it. But other than that I would say SOL. I don't think impressions really matter, as a market place fact it did not succeed. YMMV of course. But if you are actually interested in buying LEO SIG's suggest you get your local LEO sales guy involved to discuss DAK to get the facts as sigfreund suggests. “So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong, and strike at what is weak.” | |||
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| Freethinker |
Thanks for that link; somehow I missed the fact that the Secret Service also chose my favorite pistol—including the chambering. And special thanks for this gem: “In a stressful situation, who wants to choose whether to pull the trigger at reset one or two?” That’s a typical statement from someone who is ignorant about the operation of the gun and yet doesn’t let his ignorance interfere with rendering an opinion on the subject. Unlike the two trigger pulls that he admits the DA/SA system uses, the short reset of the DAK system is optional, as in optional or don’t-use-it-if-you-don’t-want-to optional. But more to the point, there’s no choosing involved. It’s simply use the short reset or don’t use it (did I mention that it’s optional?). Despite the * Edited: To try to give SIG a little credit, I will admit that new shooters of the DAK system shouldn’t be trained to try to use the short trigger reset option. They should just be trained to fire strings of shots while resetting the trigger properly as they would with any other firearm. If they’re trained and they become accustomed to doing that, then their use of the full or short reset will follow naturally. They may learn to use the short reset which may save them a millisecond or two or they will continue to use the full reset point. Either method is fine and developing the habit of using one over the other is unlikely to have any practical effect on their shooting. What they won’t be doing consciously, though, is “choosing” one over the other half way through the process of firing follow-up shots. ► 6.4/93.6 ___________ “We are Americans …. Together we have resisted the trap of appeasement, cynicism, and isolation that gives temptation to tyrants.” — George H. W. Bush | |||
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| Member |
Since I am a retired USSS Special Agent, and I now have a USSS P229 357 Sig commemorative (only sold to USSS retirees) it does not have the DAK action. It's serial number is preceded by the initials USSSxxxxx. It is the standard DA/SA sig. I also count among my other sigs a P229 DAK/SAS and a P239 DAK/SAS. I personally like the DAK feature. | |||
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| Freethinker |
May you tell us if your duty weapon had the DAK trigger? Or is that what you were saying and I'm just not sharp enough to figure it out for myself?  ► 6.4/93.6 ___________ “We are Americans …. Together we have resisted the trap of appeasement, cynicism, and isolation that gives temptation to tyrants.” — George H. W. Bush | |||
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Member |
Are y'all thinking about Air Marshalls? ----------------------------------------- Roll Tide! Glock Certified Armorer NRA Certified Firearms Instructor | |||
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3° that never cooled |
I don't know who uses what, but agree with sigfreund about the DAK. It does feel like a well tuned DA revolver. I still prefer the DA/SA guns,but that's just personal preference, not because of any deficiency in the DAK system.....ymmv NRA Life | |||
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| Moving cash for money |
U.S.C.G. replaced their worn M9s with P229 DAK in 40 S&W a few years back. "When in danger or in doubt, run in circles scream and shout" R.I.P. R.A.H. Ooga Chakka Hooga Hooga Ooga Chakka Hooga Hooga NRA Basic Rifle Instructor Red Cross First Aid/CPR/AED Adult/Child/Infant Instructor Red Cross Wilderness First Aid Instructor | |||
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| Member |
I have a Sig 229 DAK 9mm fact night sights , with the bar code etched down the slide its a ICE gun over run . Also had a USCG DAK 40 came in plain brown box , new with one mag , bar code on gun . Never fired them much but had great triggers I thought . | |||
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| Member |
I'm not a secret service agent, but I do own a P229 with a DAK trigger system in .40 and in .357 Sig. The P229 is an outstanding pistol regardless of the chambering and regardless of the trigger system. The DAK system, to me, feels like firing a revolver, albeit with an excellent double action pull, a higher capacity, and easier to clean, as well as easier to carry reloads and to operate them. You could also think of DAK as any other P229 that doesn't need to be decocked. I bought my .40 P229 because I was interviewing for a position with an agency which carried the P229 at the time. They didn't use DAK, but I was already buying into the P229 and the DAK became available at a good price. I didn't end up taking the job but I liked the P229 enough to have several versions. You're not going to go wrong with the standard double-action/single-action crunch tick arrangement, or with the DAK. | |||
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| Lead slingin' Parrot Head  |
I can't speak to what trigger system was issued later in time, but this USSS Issued Pistol Preventative Maintenance Guide, published 7/12/02, indicates that the DA/ S/A trigger was issued at that time...which shouldn't come as a surprise as the DAK wasn't introduced until a few years later.   | |||
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| Lead slingin' Parrot Head |
That was nothing more than a "hit" piece on the USSS, steeped in ignorance and lacking in experience of the SIG DAK system...but the author was able to couch his ignorance in poor attempts at humor. I sometimes think how much I would enjoy a career in the firearms/ shooting industry, including possibly writing articles in industry publications, but then I convince myself that I don't have the experience and should defer to those that do...but in reading that article I realize that I could do no worse than the jackass that wrote that article. | |||
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| Member |
In response to Sig Fruend's question, the Secret Service began issuing Sig Sauer pistols about 1986- 1987 to agents in Washington, DC. Offices around the country continued carrying issued S&W Model 19 revolvers well into 1988. During my USSS career, my carry revolvers included a Colt Commando .38 spl (pure junk USSS got from Marine Corps); my personally owned Colt model "357" - I shot a bad guy with it; followed by issued S&W Model 19 4in bbl then 2.5 inch bbl. Following my 1988 retirement, I was eager to experience what all of USSS HQ was so excited about - Sig! I purchased my first Sig; a P220 .45 ACP at a Gander Mountain store. I now have a decent assortment of Sigs, but I will forever keep that Colt "357" - it didn't let me down during that December 1964 quarter-mile, running shoot-out with a counterfeiter in NE Ohio. | |||
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| Freethinker |
Thanks for that additional information. ► 6.4/93.6 ___________ “We are Americans …. Together we have resisted the trap of appeasement, cynicism, and isolation that gives temptation to tyrants.” — George H. W. Bush | |||
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Member |
They have P229s in DA/SA chambered in .357 SIG. Some were issued P239s I think. Steve Small Business Website Design & Maintenance - https://spidercreations.net | OpSpec Training - https://opspectraining.com | Grayguns - https://grayguns.com Evil exists. You can not negotiate with, bribe or placate evil. You're not going to be able to have it sit down with Dr. Phil for an anger management session either. | |||
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| Member |
ON duty I carried a Sig P226 DA/SA for years. Since retiring I purchased a Sig P220 Compact SSA with the DAK trigger to carry concealed. I had no problem adjusting to the DAK and shoot it ever bit as good as any DA/SA. I will admit that I started my LEO career with a revolver so that made the adjustment easy. | |||
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