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quote:
Originally posted by pedropcola:
Ok pinned. Pinned how? Vertically has to be a no so it's pinned horizontally. How thick is this barrel that you have room to cut a dovetail and pin it? This seems wonky as hell to me. It also seems like you aren’t ever changing that front sight. Ever.


You mean like how they've pinned revolver sights for over 60 years?



quote:
Needlessly complicated for arguably no gain. And it has to be a big reason for that ridiculous price tag. They did it this way because it LOOKS cool. That’s it. It isn’t any more effective than normal porting. It’s for show. Which is why I will never own one, not because I can’t afford one but because I’m not a sucker.


So it can't look cool and function at the same time? It's a fairly similar concept in competition guns and people who bought a Staccato XC finds it works just fine. This is a really weird hill to make a final stand on.
 
Posts: 3384 | Location: Kansas City, MO | Registered: May 28, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Dan I don’t know if you can’t read or are just being obtuse. These things are pinned to a moving semi auto barrel longitudinally. If you think that and pinning a front sight to a revolver are the same then we just need to agree to disagree because that ain’t this. I struggle to understand how you can look at that L frame then look at the pistol in question and your response is, “yep they are the same”. Lol

And I don’t know what Hill you are talking about. It’s a discussion thread. I’m discussing. My opinion is it adds to the ridiculous price tag and provides zero value while making it needlessly complicated to boot. All for the sake of looking cool. I wouldn’t buy one. Not a hill. Not a hill I’m making any final stand on. Lighten up.

Edited while boss was posting. I’m out and apologies I will delete if necessary, just tell me.
 
Posts: 5985 | Location: Florida | Registered: June 18, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Let's take it easy, please.
 
Posts: 100656 | Registered: January 20, 2000Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by pedropcola:
Dan I don’t know if you can’t read or are just being obtuse. These things are pinned to a moving semi auto barrel longitudinally. If you think that and pinning a front sight to a revolver are the same then we just need to agree to disagree because that ain’t this. I struggle to understand how you can look at that L frame then look at the pistol in question and your response is, “yep they are the same”. Lol

And I don’t know what Hill you are talking about. It’s a discussion thread. I’m discussing. My opinion is it adds to the ridiculous price tag and provides zero value while making it needlessly complicated to boot. All for the sake of looking cool. I wouldn’t buy one. Not a hill. Not a hill I’m making any final stand on. Lighten up.


It's a sight block/island barrel system that's common on $3K race guns. The idea of the system is to keep the front sight relatively stationary during fast fire. Sometimes the sight is dovetailed into the barrel/block and other times it's pinned like in the case of the Zev.

The system does work and wasn't made like that just to be cool, but other well founded questions range from is it worth the extra cost to how well does it work. It's also not that much more than other OZ9 models with super hacked up ginzu designs.

Again, I just find it odd that for all of the other reasons not to buy this gun like high cost, questionable aesthetics, Zev's mediocre QC, hit or miss customer service, and questions about the platform itself that this one issue looks like it's the straw that broke the camel's back.
 
Posts: 3384 | Location: Kansas City, MO | Registered: May 28, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I think they are wildly overpriced for what you are getting. I think that method of installing front sights probably is a factor in that high price because that is some serious machining mojo right there. Looks wicked cool though.

I read the stuff about keeping the sights flatter during shooting but that sounds suspiciously like marketing nonsense. I will have to read more about that but I doubt it makes any difference whether the sight is mounted on the barrel or the slide, they are both recoiling upwards disturbing the sight picture. In fact, as the barrel unlocks it actually tilts upward a few degrees compared to the slide which is not in keeping with the claims. Somebody besides the guys selling the high priced system would have to explain its value otherwise it sounds like blah blah blah marketing. (edited Oh they are saying it doesn't move like the slide does. Hm. That still seems like splitting hairs. The slide moves an inch and a half maybe while rotating vertically, seems like hokum to me.)

Like I said in the first post. It was a nice gun when handling. Looked well made. Crazy stupid price for what it was. (to me)
 
Posts: 5985 | Location: Florida | Registered: June 18, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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sight block/island barrel system


Can you point me to these sight block/island systems on race guns? I can't find any like this one. I keep finding blocks that are either added onto the end of barrels or screwed on like comps and the sight is dovetailed there. I can't find a single one that is dovetailed into the front of the barrel itself like this zev. Maybe my google fu is weak. Not an impossibility. Thanks.
 
Posts: 5985 | Location: Florida | Registered: June 18, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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It's pretty much a feature that's only found on gamer guns that has little practical use unless you're running USPSA or 3 Gun and you're trying to cut tenths out of your time. It's more helpful on ported/comp guns as you're getting recoil reduction from the ports. It's more than snake oil magic, but if it's worth it or not is down to the person.

Edit: Here's the picture up close with the hypercomp. It's pinned through the added material above the barrel and the ports and has no contact with the bore.

 
Posts: 3384 | Location: Kansas City, MO | Registered: May 28, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Makes sense. I guess I was asking if anybody else mounts the front sight this particular way. Literally into the front of the actual barrel itself. I’ve never seen that online or in person. Anybody besides Zev do it this way?

It is a very clean way to do it regardless of whether I would pay for it or value it accordingly. It seems kind of unique to zev.
 
Posts: 5985 | Location: Florida | Registered: June 18, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Originally posted by venenoindy:
Would you buy an OZ9 hyper comp?


Yes I’ll get one at some point. I have two OZ9’s and they are awesome.

By the way, get info from people that actually own one. Lots of opinions. Very little first hand knowledge.
 
Posts: 1207 | Registered: September 20, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Originally posted by pedropcola:
Makes sense. I guess I was asking if anybody else mounts the front sight this particular way. Literally into the front of the actual barrel itself. I’ve never seen that online or in person. Anybody besides Zev do it this way?

It is a very clean way to do it regardless of whether I would pay for it or value it accordingly. It seems kind of unique to zev.


I've seen Cabot Arms use a front dovetail to push a sight in, but also uses the barrel bushing to hold it in place.
 
Posts: 3384 | Location: Kansas City, MO | Registered: May 28, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Like many things, it depends. Literally like now much $1899 means to you to get a gun. Is it the only gun you are going to buy for the next seven years and rely on it forever for life and death vs. the 16th least expensive gun you are going to by this week.

Would I? No. If I won the lottery? Maybe, but I honestly don't like the looks (I dislike bronze barrels in guns personally).

I won't not buy it just because it's a Zev or has compatibility/association with the Glock platform which is available at a cheaper price.

Look, listen to bac1023. He seems very in the 16th least expensive gun bought this time period type person and has experience with it.

But also listen to other voices for who a purchase of a firearm of this . . . caliber shall we say? is a stretch and so must meet lots of needs and budget.


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Posts: 1595 | Location: T-town in the 253 | Registered: January 16, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I have to admit I don’t mind TiN barrels. It’s a weakness in me. Lol.

These are unique and are well made. The front sight install is a thing of beauty. As for usefulness or practicality not so sure.

As for taking the word of people who have bought them? Maybe yes, maybe no. Every time I see pics it’s like a glamour shot of your girlfriend in lingerie. How about some video of one shaving seconds off a stage with all its amazingness? I have a friend who used to own one of those rare Shelby Mustangs that are worth a ton. Beautiful car. How was it to drive? No idea, he basically drove it to position it at shows and put in on the trailer. Not really an in depth dive into its performance.

I’m a practical guy. Bling has its place but it’s way down my list. This thing screams bling and a price tag to match. And I’ve never seen anyone pull one of these out at a match, which is what is was built for ostensibly.

Edited to add: Part of the reason threads like this go the wrong way is that the guys on this forum who are fans never give pictures of groups or how it did during a match or even just a range report. We get glamour shots of a gun that looks for all the world like it’s going to be displayed/fondled for a living. Everybody here loves guns, we all have a mix of practicality and wow that’s just neat. The only difference is the ratio between those two mindsets. It would be really nice to have someone do a range report. Give us a match stage video using these guns. Something, anything besides regurgitating the work of the zev marketing team.

Regardless of where you fall on it’s just a fancy Glock or it’s totally different, I think we all like to see a gun that most of us will never buy in action. Q does this all the time. He gives us practical actual usage reports on guns that most of us would think were way too valuable to do that to. You might change some minds. Or you just might just provide cool gun porn which is good too. Just a thought.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: pedropcola,
 
Posts: 5985 | Location: Florida | Registered: June 18, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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For a review part, I can help a little bit:



He also does some shooting at night in the desert in this so you'll get the most flash with current self defense ammo. I posted a video in another thread with Jerry Miculek night shooting with ported barrels using modern self defense ammo and the dirtiest reloads he could make. I can post that here if anyone's interested.

As far as front sights go, I couldn't find a sight block/island barrel with a sight attachment like this, but 1911s have dovetail sights while the Glock front sight is screwed into place. While not exactly the same, Cabot Arms does use a front sight that drives in from the front and is held in place by the barrel bushing:



My Masterpiece Arms DS9 has a sight that slides in from the front held by a set screw which makes it very easy for me to change out to the correct height sight depending on if I'm using irons or a dot.



Some of the upper end CZs use a similar system. The only down side I've had with this design is a shot my front fiber out of the gun, but that's a fiber optic problem (and they sent me extra fibers free of charge).
 
Posts: 3384 | Location: Kansas City, MO | Registered: May 28, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Well Dan that was kind of my initial point which you so vehemently disagreed with. “It’s common on 3k race guns”. No, it isn’t. This is a fairly unique and expensive way to mount a front blade. It looks cool. The machining is done well but it’s a hard way to do simple. It adds a bunch to the cost and the claim of “sight tracking” is dubious at best. More like a marketing guy talking than an actual shooter. That was my point/question. Bling over usefulness. Heaven help you if you ever need to replace a barrel.

You’ve posted a couple pictures of guns that don’t attach the front sight to the barrel directly and seem to be making a correlation. There isn’t one. Hell, I told you a dozen posts earlier that CZ does it this way but in the slide with a set screw. You now post a Masterpiece Arms picture like you are making a point. Well yea, I said that already on a 500 dollar gun not a 3k dollar one. I initially questioned why do it this very expensive very non user friendly (zev directly on barrel) way? It’s common you say, yet all your pictures are of a different style of mounting that is very common. A million CZ75’s do it that way. That Masterpiece Arms sight is so friggin identical I bet it might fit in a CZ cut. Masterpiece Arms copied that dovetail from CZ who might have copied it from someone else.

This is why these threads suck. You post a picture of a very expensive gun that has zero bearing on this subject. It mounts the front sight EXACTLY like a old CZ75. (Or a new one). It doesn’t add to this thread because it’s not the same mounting. At all. You have a different definition of “common”.

I can look up videos from random guys on the Internet. In many of these threads we get assailed with “well if you can’t experience this kind of firearm you just won’t understand” nonsense. It gets old. There are a lot of multi millionaires on this board who can afford whatever they want. Getting centerfold shots and then being told how amazing they are and never once shooting a picture of a gun in the middle of a pile of brass, or in a holster, or dirty, no I don’t necessarily think that opinion matters. You figure out how good a gun is by shooting it. A bunch. In different conditions. With different kinds of ammo. Etc.

I have to assume the guys on this board who love these have done that. A honest usage review would be a good read. Somebody actually shoot that thing and say “oh yea, it’s much easier to track the front sight”.

Nobody has to but it would be better than rehashing the zev pamphlet propaganda.
 
Posts: 5985 | Location: Florida | Registered: June 18, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Looks like it would be expensive to find a replacement sight and/or barrel.


Joe
 
Posts: 2431 | Location: Az | Registered: October 28, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Originally posted by Blackwater:
Looks like it would be expensive to find a replacement sight and/or barrel.


That's probably going to be a complete upper.

quote:
Well Dan that was kind of my initial point which you so vehemently disagreed with. “It’s common on 3k race guns”. No, it isn’t. This is a fairly unique and expensive way to mount a front blade. It looks cool. The machining is done well but it’s a hard way to do simple.


Ok, so I was wrong. The principal is still the same and I can show videos from shooters like The Honest Outlaw or The Humble Marksman on Youtube with video showing and explaining the concept and how it help, and both of them are competition shooters.

quote:
Getting centerfold shots and then being told how amazing they are and never once shooting a picture of a gun in the middle of a pile of brass, or in a holster, or dirty, no I don’t necessarily think that opinion matters. You figure out how good a gun is by shooting it. A bunch. In different conditions. With different kinds of ammo. Etc.


It's like you completely ignored the video I posted where Roger Barrera took the gun out to the Nevada desert with 2 other shooters running drills from their concealment holsters they make with multiple bullet weights under lights and under night vision to test if the ports affect their night vision. Nut you would have had to watch the video first to know what all it covered.

As far as Sight Trackers, I know Honest Outlaw covered it on his review of the STI Aperio and a couple of his Atlas Gunworks videos and his 2011 vs CZ video. He also runs several 1,000 round tests on guns at his range in the middle of Iowa with whatever ammo he gets his hands on.
 
Posts: 3384 | Location: Kansas City, MO | Registered: May 28, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Yep. I completely ignored your video. I can watch dozens of online videos. I am respectfully asking forum members who love these guns to give actual experiences, videos, range reports, actual use stuff, if they are willing.

That’s why I love this forum. Q will find a one in a million Sig and instead of just taking glamor shots, he takes glamor shots and shoots the snot out of it and gives a range report. Lots of guys do similar things. I have yet to see a zev owner on this forum post real use stuff.

I’m just saying it would be nice. I’m not demanding it. I’m not dying on any hill. My suggestion was that if one of this forums zev guys posted real use range report stuff it would be fun and interesting and lead us to more productive less divisional discussions. That’s all. Nothing nefarious just actual use from guys I “know”.
 
Posts: 5985 | Location: Florida | Registered: June 18, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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This is one where we're stuck with only Youtube reviews because nobody here (me included) is likely to buy one.
 
Posts: 3384 | Location: Kansas City, MO | Registered: May 28, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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That's a lot of typing back and forth over a roll pin.


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