I maintain that a proper holster designed specifically for the handgun you are carrying goes a long way to mitigating and even eliminating unintentional discharge. I don't know if that's what happened here, but I have dedicated holster set-ups for each P320 and P365 model that I own for OWB carry and AIWB carry. I feel confident using them.

I liked the P365 from the first time I held one and dry fired the trigger. Most striker action pistols fall into the single action category more than double action. And don't kid yourself that the little tab in the Glock trigger makes any difference. Anything making its way into the trigger guard and capable of applying enough pressure to move the trigger is going to depress that little tab. It's nothing. You'd be better off with a manual thumb safety. Personally, the more simple the manual of arms the better for me. If that gun is coming out of the holster, the only thing I want to have to do to fire the weapon is engage the trigger.

I have a young child. The P365 is in the safe always when it's not on me. There is no margin of error with a gun like that, I'll agree. I prefer the flat triggers in my Sigs.

quote:

Originally posted by Dwill104:

quote:

Originally posted by limblessbiff:

quote:

Originally posted by Dwill104:
Are P365s having ADs like the P320s? They don’t have a trigger safety either.

I haven’t heard of one, seems to be a 320 thing. An army MP was just shot in the foot by his own weapon when somebody bumped into his holster.

https://www.nhpr.org/nh-news/2...o-reason-for-concern

I haven’t heard of it being a P250 or P365 problem either, so what’s the difference? None of the three have trigger safeties. Also, not buying the “bumped holster” story. What’s the mechanism that caused the trigger to pull by two holstered guns coming in contact with each other? Not to mention, as has been noted, what about the safety on the military guns? The bump also caused the safety to be moved down in addition to the trigger being pulled?

Maybe the manual safety isn’t working as designed? There are more than a few videos of cops guns going off without being messed with, seems that a 320 with a light in a duty holster is prettt sketchy and sig straight up won’t take responsibility for it and has punted the problem off to the holster makers..

I dunno, but as a former MP I can tell you walking around with your safety off will get you in trouble, and people pay attention to that. Not sure what the holster set up is these days but when I was carrying an M9 the safety was visible in a serpa or the safariland holsters we had.

I tried a P320 years ago and LOVED shooting it but never bought one because I was not used to a trigger breaking so far forward and with so little take up.

I don't believe for a second that P320 pistols are discharging by themselves but I believe that those who are less than fastidious about safe gun handling and choosing proper holsters are more likely to have a ND than with striker fired pistols that have the Glock type blade safety which prevents the trigger from activating if just the edge of the trigger is moved by anything including a holster flexing.

A week doesn't go by when I don't read about someone on a forum buying brand X SF pistol and then saying how it fits their holster of a brand Y SF pistol perfectly.

Having a ND would be extremely embarrassing at minimum and could open one up to grave injury, criminal charges, liability, and loss of job. Blaming the gun is one way to eliminate most of that and also possibly end up having a nice payday for the person who had the ND and their lawyer.

The military reports are a little troubling.

I think everyone was under the impression that, for whatever reason, the M17’s weren’t having that “going off by themselves” issue.

If it’s proven, and at least one is on video, that they do have a tendency to do that. It’s kind of troubling.

Assuming a P320 is equipped with a manual safety, and proper handling is always observed (meaning the safety is engaged whenever the gun is not in use), I have no clue how it could go off on its own. Assuming the safety is off (or the gun isn’t equipped with one), I can understand how the drop fire occurs. But is the trigger bar really so sensitive that tapping/bumping a holstered pistol is enough to knock said trigger bar out of place and cause a discharge? Wild.

quote:

Originally posted by MacGyver:
Assuming a P320 is equipped with a manual safety, and proper handling is always observed (meaning the safety is engaged whenever the gun is not in use), I have no clue how it could go off on its own. Assuming the safety is off (or the gun isn’t equipped with one), I can understand how the drop fire occurs. But is the trigger bar really so sensitive that tapping/bumping a holstered pistol is enough to knock said trigger bar out of place and cause a discharge? Wild.

It's not. At least mine isn't. It's taken a lot of hits.

This case isn't about the gun going off on it's own. They didn't make that claim. They simply convinced the court that the design is less safe and more prone to negligent discharge than other contemporary designs (specifically due to it's lack of a trigger safety), and that Sig was negligent in the design and marketing thereof.

^^^Sorry, I forgot to add a quote in my post. I was actually referring to limblessbiff’s article from NHPR, not the OP. I already addressed the OP in my earlier post.

Here's a story about an UD that occurred w/ an LEO this past May.

quote:

Originally posted by FP2000H:
I maintain that a proper holster designed specifically for the handgun you are carrying goes a long way to mitigating and even eliminating unintentional discharge. I don't know if that's what happened here, but I have dedicated holster set-ups for each P320 and P365 model that I own for OWB carry and AIWB carry. I feel confident using them.

I don't own either a P320 or a P365. I have never even held either one. With that said, who makes the decision as to whether a holster is properly designed specifically for handgun you are carrying?

The reason I ask is not to be antagonistic. I am intrigued by both of these pistols. I am interested in adding a P365X and a P320 compact to my "accumulation".

FP2000H - I have seen mentioned in this thread, and others I believe, that holsters designed for weapon mounted flashlights seem to play a factor in some of these negligent discharges. Do you have any opinions on that?

Again, I do not wish to be antagonistic. I'm just looking to add to my knowledge. Thank you.

quote:

If it’s proven, and at least one is on video, that they do have a tendency to do that. It’s kind of troubling.

Got a link? Merely curious, not calling you out!

-- Chuck

My P320 carry guns have safeties - M17 Bravo (black finish) and a Compact MS. I added safeties to my P365 and P365XL as well.

Range guns like my P320 Legion and FCU builds are OK without them.

Agency Arms makes a replacement trigger with a dingus and available at Omaha Outdoors:



Adding the dingus now would basically admit fault on Sig's part, and probably result in another "voluntary recall".

quote:

Originally posted by chuck s:

quote:

If it’s proven, and at least one is on video, that they do have a tendency to do that. It’s kind of troubling.

Got a link? Merely curious, not calling you out!

-- Chuck

Below is a link (originally posted by limblessbiff) with nine reports, including the USMC report below that mentions video footage. I did not see the video in the report or in the article.

https://www.nhpr.org/nh-news/2...o-reason-for-concern

Excerpt from the Camp Foster report:

After reviewing the security camera video footage, the mishap investigator concluded that P1 did not
mishandle the weapon at anytime while on duty at Gate 1 prior to the weapon discharging. From the
evidence and statements from the persons involved, it is apparent that the weapon fired while on safe
and secured in the holster. Maintenance was conduct per Technical Manual 13141A-23 and Technical
Instruction 8005-24 Pre-Fire Inspection Criteria for Small Arms. Weapon is TC062681...

Complete report:

https://npr.brightspotcdn.com/...corps-2023-02-14.pdf

quote:

Originally posted by Broadside:

quote:

Originally posted by FP2000H:
I maintain that a proper holster designed specifically for the handgun you are carrying goes a long way to mitigating and even eliminating unintentional discharge. I don't know if that's what happened here, but I have dedicated holster set-ups for each P320 and P365 model that I own for OWB carry and AIWB carry. I feel confident using them.

I don't own either a P320 or a P365. I have never even held either one. With that said, who makes the decision as to whether a holster is properly designed specifically for handgun you are carrying?

The reason I ask is not to be antagonistic. I am intrigued by both of these pistols. I am interested in adding a P365X and a P320 compact to my "accumulation".

FP2000H - I have seen mentioned in this thread, and others I believe, that holsters designed for weapon mounted flashlights seem to play a factor in some of these negligent discharges. Do you have any opinions on that?

Again, I do not wish to be antagonistic. I'm just looking to add to my knowledge. Thank you.

First thing, I think, is to go with a reputable holster manufacturer.

Second, go with a holster that is purpose built for the gun you are going to carry. Some people will use a holster designed for a different gun with a gun that shares the same light. I think this is where you can get into trouble. The differences in slide geometry and holster design tolerances might allow the gun to shift in the holster.

Some people will use a holster if they can get the gun in it even if it is designed for a different gun. They figure, "Hey, it fits!"

Always test the holster fit with an unloaded gun to make sure it secures the weapon with no movement and doesn't activate the trigger. Do this also when changing out the trigger in a gun. Some holsters won't work with aftermarket triggers and are only designed to be used with the stock trigger.

quote:

Originally posted by FP2000H:
First thing, I think, is to go with a reputable holster manufacturer.

Second, go with a holster that is purpose built for the gun you are going to carry. Some people will use a holster designed for a different gun with a gun that shares the same light. I think this is where you can get into trouble. The differences in slide geometry and holster design tolerances might allow the gun to shift in the holster.

Some people will use a holster if they can get the gun in it even if it is designed for a different gun. They figure, "Hey, it fits!"

Always test the holster fit with an unloaded gun to make sure it secures the weapon with no movement and doesn't activate the trigger. Do this also when changing out the trigger in a gun. Some holsters won't work with aftermarket triggers and are only designed to be used with the stock trigger.

Thank you, FP2000H. This was pretty much along the lines of what I was thinking. I always like to check to see if there is something I am missing.

I think I would also add that if going with a weapon mounted light (WML), make sure the holster is designed for the specific pistol/WML combination you intend on carrying.

In light of reports involving negligent discharges with the P320, I think I would go a step further and say that if intending to carry a P320 with a WML, you should opt for a version of the P320 with an external safety.

I avoid leather holsters for striker guns. I just feel that Kydex, with its stable rigidity and proper form fit is a safer choice for a non manual safety gun. Thats not to say that all or any leather holsters make a striker gun more dangerous. Its just a decision I have made for myself.