Apologize if this has been covered but I couldn't find anything.

Regarding concealed carry, is it ok to show your belt loops if your pistol and holster are not visible at all? Had a stranger approach me and actually complained that my holster was showing and he didn't appreciate knowing I had a firearm I was within my rights to be carrying at this location and I was wearing a fine R Grizzle tuckable holster and my wife said she could not tell I was carrying except for the belt loops.

I would have told said stranger to mind his own fucking business and went on with my day..

As far of the particulars of your question, I live in a concealed and open carry state, so I can't help you there.

quote:

Originally posted by 1lowlife:
I would have told said stranger to mind his own fucking business and went on with my day..

As far of the particulars of your question, I live in a concealed and open carry state, so I can't help you there.

Ditto

Plus why was he watching you that closely?

Could be more appropriate to place this in the CCW page rather than SIG Pistols.

That said while you may not have done anything wrong, many prefer not to telegraph anything while carrying, up to and including t shirts and hats which give away the lifestyle. The reason being no hints to the bad guys.

If you're carrying concealed, then carry concealed. What should matter to you is that someone was able to tell that you were carrying.

If you're truly carrying concealed and others know you're carrying, you've made a mistake. Do what you need to do, to correct it.

Telling someone to mind their own fucking business for your own mistake is not the correct way to do it. It's your mistake. Fix it. You might even thank them for identifying a flaw in your efforts, which allows you to do a better job of concealing.

I can’t answer your question definitely for all jurisdictions, but I’m pretty confident that in most places you have nothing to worry about. In a very anti-gun place, who knows what the nutty ones will choose to prosecute? If your firearm can’t be seen, it is concealed. Even if it’s “printing”, it’s still concealed. And I am not aware of any laws prohibiting the carrying of a holster, so your belt loops are irrelevant.

Perhaps today’s belt loops are equivalent to yesteryear’s Hawaiian shirts. Someone who is aware will see them for what they are, but to average people they mean nothing.

I would be concerned about the person who approached you, as he is either a really big dick, or an anti-gunner who is too aggressive for his own good.

Thanks for the feedback and sorry for not posting in the carry area.

I agree I would prefer that nobody know even some nosy bastard. What I wanted to tell him and what I told him were two completely different things. When I carry, which is most of the time, I find myself more in an anti-conflict state of mind. While I would have liked to have told him to fuck off and mind his own business, if he were a whack job that could have easily let to a confrontation and who knows what happens then. No worth my time for some asshole busybody. And besides, as mentioned, he pointed out a flaw in my carry so I should be more appreciative.

I will correct my attire as I also believe concealed is concealed. Gets tougher in the summer and I do more pocket carry with my P938 and a sticky holster. I would prefer my P320 or P365 in an IWB holster though.

I live in a free state, where concealed carry is common, open carry is common, and where no permit is required for concealed carry for resident, or non-resident, if they choose. I carry concealed most of the time.

Businesses can restrict the carry of weapons by placing a sign, and I find the use of that sign offensive. I keep a cell phone application that includes a list of such places that ban firearms, and when I encounter such a business I snap a picture and upload it to the site to notify others of the business that suppresses the 2nd amendment.

That said, I also take a certain pleasure in carrying concealed in places that would prefer me unarmed, and in order to do that, it's necessary to be completely concealed.

A few years ago I saw a peter/paul (Mary was gone, then) concert, which was a fantastic concert. I was armed. Paul Stuckey made some comments about firearms; the two are pacifists and opposed, and I understand and respect their position. Never the less, I had to chuckle, because aside from me, likely half the other people in the audience were armed, too.

My wife and I have a regularly weekly date night when I'm home, which often includes a movie. I carry at the movie. The theater has an armed presence; a deputy or officer is there, especially on weekends, as a deterrent for youthful indiscretions which might occur, I suspect. Carrying is not allowed in the theater, but on the theory that I'd rather be alive to debate it should someone go nuts and decide to shoot up a theater, I'm a good scout and show up prepared, as always. It's best not to have something printing that would give the officer reason to react to me, rather than focus on those who are actually a threat.

Concealed works best concealed.

You can get "J hook" style loops that are almost invisible. Only a really in tune gun-person could catch that and then personally I wouldn't care.

Anyway, a real pro can usually tell you are carrying by your body language anyway, no need to see anything printing or showing.

Also, while it was a good lesson in what was showing, his comment is just weird about "not appreciating" knowing you had a gun. What a maroon.

What showed? The exposed portion of the clip or loop? This is supposed to be the raison d'être of a tuckable holster. Are you sure your cover didn't rise up or something? What is your law regarding accidental exposure of your gun? Some states equate this with "brandishing" it, I am told.

As for his part, he is simultaneously very smart (to recognize an exposed clip as a holster) and very stupid (to risk antagonizing a stranger carrying a gun). I think I'd tell him, politely but firmly, to get lost.

quote:

he didn't appreciate knowing I had a firearm

I don't particularly care what you appreciate

I think there are two issues here. First, would showing the clips/loops of a tucked tuckable holster with a gun in it constitute non-concealment where concealment is required? I can't think of a situation where it would. The requirement is to keep the gun concealed, not the holster. As long as the gun itself is not visible, under any state laws I've heard of, you're good. I don't even think overt printing would be illegal.

Second, from a tactical standpoint, I think it's nearly a non-issue, especially if you're intellgent about it (like matching the belt color to the clip color.) People would have to be really close, look really closely to see them. Even a criminal looking to rob you probably wouldn't pick them out.

quote:

Originally posted by BBMW:
I think there are two issues here. First, would showing the clips/loops of a tucked tuckable holster with a gun in it constitute non-concealment where concealment is required? I can't think of a situation where it would. The requirement is to keep the gun concealed, not the holster. As long as the gun itself is not visible, under any state laws I've heard of, you're good. I don't even think overt printing would be illegal.

Second, from a tactical standpoint, I think it's nearly a non-issue, especially if you're intellgent about it (like matching the belt color to the clip color.) People would have to be really close, look really closely to see them. Even a criminal looking to rob you probably wouldn't pick them out.

The point of concealing a firearm isn't just to cover it; it's to prevent its presence from being known. As few wear around a holster without a firearm, knowledge of the holster is knowledge of the firearm.

That's not concealed.

That's more akin to the child hiding behind the drapes. His feet stick out, his sleeves and pant legs are visible, but he's hiding his face. "How did you find me?" He asks. He met the requirements of concealment as he saw it. His skin wasn't visible. Yet we knew where he was. The snake that swallowed the pet rat had no rat showing, yet the 1" diameter snake became four inches around a big bulge, then one inch again. I suspect a rat.

It may or may not be illegal to print (and there's more than one way to print, be it the outline of the pistol, or a visible holster), but that's not really the point. If the pistol is supposed to be concealed, and yet someone knows its there, then it's not really concealed, is it?

quote:

and yet someone knows its there

He didn't know it was there. He assumed it was there.

cruise 68 __
I use Remora IWB full sweat shield holsters for my Shield (with a red dot sight) and my P365. You have to pay $6.50 extra for the FSS. Worth it here in the Tucson area when wearing a T-shirt.
To get exactly the right size, best to use their email system and they get back to you and suggest the proper size holster.
Stay safe
Poli Viejo

quote:

Originally posted by nasig:

quote:

and yet someone knows its there

He didn't know it was there. He assumed it was there.

Exactly.

Because he had a reason.

Concealed means not providing a reason.

These anti gun haters are always out there. You did nothing wrong or unwise. With people like this person we are always wrong but just have good replies in advance, e.g., "sorry but my dentist told me not to chew gum."

I am a licensed psychologist and at a continuing education event at a hotel I was reading my "Guns and Ammo" magazine during the break and a clin. social worker said to me that she needed to know if I was carrying firearms since she was traumatized by gun violence on TV. I looked at her and gave her a sarcastic and long "NO" as if she was doing something wrong. She immediately left the room and came back after 15 min. She said nothing further. Probably called the County Police but I did not care since I was doing nothing wrong.

As I said, there are two issues, legal and functional/tactical. If the gun is concealed to the level that it satisfies the legal requirement, it's up to the carrier to decide if the level of concealment meets what he defines as the functional/tactical requirements. The latter is wholly subjective.

quote:

Originally posted by sns3guppy:

quote:

Originally posted by BBMW:
I think there are two issues here. First, would showing the clips/loops of a tucked tuckable holster with a gun in it constitute non-concealment where concealment is required? I can't think of a situation where it would. The requirement is to keep the gun concealed, not the holster. As long as the gun itself is not visible, under any state laws I've heard of, you're good. I don't even think overt printing would be illegal.

Second, from a tactical standpoint, I think it's nearly a non-issue, especially if you're intellgent about it (like matching the belt color to the clip color.) People would have to be really close, look really closely to see them. Even a criminal looking to rob you probably wouldn't pick them out.

The point of concealing a firearm isn't just to cover it; it's to prevent its presence from being known. As few wear around a holster without a firearm, knowledge of the holster is knowledge of the firearm.

That's not concealed.

That's more akin to the child hiding behind the drapes. His feet stick out, his sleeves and pant legs are visible, but he's hiding his face. "How did you find me?" He asks. He met the requirements of concealment as he saw it. His skin wasn't visible. Yet we knew where he was. The snake that swallowed the pet rat had no rat showing, yet the 1" diameter snake became four inches around a big bulge, then one inch again. I suspect a rat.

It may or may not be illegal to print (and there's more than one way to print, be it the outline of the pistol, or a visible holster), but that's not really the point. If the pistol is supposed to be concealed, and yet someone knows its there, then it's not really concealed, is it?

Wrong section.

I've known tens of thousands of criminals, and I still don't know one that picks out citizens carrying concealed. Hats, tactical pants, t-shirts, none of that, in my opinion, signals "operator" to anyone other than some overly sensitive tactical soul. Most people don't even notice open carry, to be honest with you. If someone is "uncomfortable" knowing you are carrying (and he only suspected, in reality) they should be fucking terrified of a yute in a hoodie.