SIGforum.com Main Page The Lounge Gravity by nature is not a force itself, though it can be calculated as such.
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| Do the next right thing  |
Hence why I said
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Member |
Now Waterbury, I was going to try to make more progress by commenting further on the genuinely intelligent contributions from screamingcokatoo, kkina, ftttu, jey, and rey, and right before I wasn't sure if I could pull it off, you dropped this, knocking me back to square one, knowing not how to proceed. Maybe after a break I'll be able to think clearly again to see if I may contribute one last time before the IQ in the room increases any further. Lover of the US Constitution Wile E. Coyote School of DIY Disaster | |||
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| Savor the limelight |
What would happen if the Sun just disappeared? Would the planets immediately just go flying off into space? | |||
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Member |
It would get very cold. _________________________________________________________________________ “A man’s treatment of a dog is no indication of the man’s nature, but his treatment of a cat is. It is the crucial test. None but the humane treat a cat well.” -- Mark Twain, 1902 | |||
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As humans, we think we have a pretty good handle on laws of physics, gravity, space-time, astrophysics, and the like. Then we get some reality checks. We can't seem to reconcile General Relativity with Quantum Mechanics. In lay terms, the theory of the very big with the theory of the very small. Even if we have concepts of regular matter down, we don't know much about the other "stuff". Many scientists believe that regular matter makes up only 5% of the universe, with 27% being dark matter, and 68% being dark energy. So far, nobody really knows what the 95% "other stuff" is. Scientists generally believe the universe is 13.7 to 13.8 billion years old. But the width (if that's what we want to call it) of the universe is said to be 93 to 94 billion light years -- almost 7 times larger than the distance light can travel during this time. This implies that space itself has expanded at speeds multiple times the speed of light. In some ways it's akin the parable of blind men describing an elephant after touching only a small portions of an elephant. | |||
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Shaman |
First theory doesn't mean what you think it does. Theory is how it's applied to produce results from within a model. The universe is so large from cosmic inflation, before the universe cooled enough to produce a limit on speed.  He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. | |||
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Member |
Perhaps the most accurate approach would be to call gravity an "emergent force," meaning that what looks like a direct force is actually emerging from more fundamental effects (the warping of spacetime). With this in mind, it is perfectly reasonable to call gravity a real force. ______________________________________________ Life is short. It’s shorter with the wrong gun… | |||
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אַרְיֵה |
Dark, too. הרחפת שלי מלאה בצלופחים | |||
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Void Where Prohibited |
While what I posted was in fact a joke, it goes right to the simplest explanation of gravity - the fundamental interaction which causes attraction between all things with mass or energy. "If Gun Control worked, Chicago would look like Mayberry, not Thunderdome" - Cam Edwards | |||
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Baroque Bloke |
Then there’s this: “fundamental force, also called fundamental interaction, in physics, any of the four basic forces—gravitational, electromagnetic, strong, and weak—that govern how objects or particles interact and how certain particles decay. All the known forces of nature can be traced to these fundamental forces. The fundamental forces are characterized on the basis of the following four criteria: the types of particles that experience the force, the relative strength of the force, the range over which the force is effective, and the nature of the particles that mediate the force. …” https://www.britannica.com/sci...damental-interaction Serious about crackers | |||
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Ammoholic |
You've got that wrong. Satellites and planes time dilation is due to gravity. Time dilation due to speed is less noticeable until you get significant fractions of the speed of light. It's almost a flat line until you get to 50% then from 90 to 100% the chart turns near vertical. Jesse Sic Semper Tyrannis | |||
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His Royal Hiney |
Okay, I stand corrected. I'm slow because I'm been mostly laying on my back rather than standing up. I don't mind learning something new. I did fact check you using ChatGPT. I use it for a lot of research. I know it does often come up with factually incorrect answers that are sometimes contradictory with an immediately preceding answer it gives.
"It did not really matter what we expected from life, but rather what life expected from us. We needed to stop asking about the meaning of life, and instead to think of ourselves as those who were being questioned by life – daily and hourly. Our answer must consist not in talk and meditation, but in right action and in right conduct. Life ultimately means taking the responsibility to find the right answer to its problems and to fulfill the tasks which it constantly sets for each individual." Viktor Frankl, Man's Search for Meaning, 1946. | |||
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| No ethanol! |
Not that simply disappearing is possible without other extreme forces, but yup. Newton's first law: An object at rest remains at rest, or if in motion, remains in motion at a constant velocity unless acted on by a net external force. ------------------ The plural of anecdote is not data. -Frank Kotsonis | |||
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| Ammoholic |
You're using ChatGPT to explain the theory of relativity, meanwhile I'm currently having AI draw me pictures of ninja ducks swordfighting... Jesse Sic Semper Tyrannis | |||
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| His Royal Hiney |
Not theory of relativity but, yes, I mentioned that because I know you use the painting and I've been using it a lot. It's better than Google or any search engine. "It did not really matter what we expected from life, but rather what life expected from us. We needed to stop asking about the meaning of life, and instead to think of ourselves as those who were being questioned by life – daily and hourly. Our answer must consist not in talk and meditation, but in right action and in right conduct. Life ultimately means taking the responsibility to find the right answer to its problems and to fulfill the tasks which it constantly sets for each individual." Viktor Frankl, Man's Search for Meaning, 1946. | |||
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| Member |
Yes absolutely, it was a pretty good joke, esp after it dawned on me it was true. This is why my grown daughters still to this day tell me how bad my dad jokes were when they were little, and in this case here still are, but they aren't scientific nerds like me. Lover of the US Constitution Wile E. Coyote School of DIY Disaster | |||
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Yes that's right. I remember after watching a video of Brian Greene showing an interactive computer algorithm graphic on stage this affect how time dialates with speed, how that curve didn't really take off until well after .5c. So for fun I put the forumla he gave on a spreadsheet just to see it for myself. One thing I couldn't figure out however, is that as a mass approaches light speed, but apparently cannot ever achive it, that dialation just continues to approach asymptiotically, so I don't know if this means that time actaully stops, or does the equation just break down at the extreme case. It is interesting that Richard Feynmen said the best equations in physics are still just an approximation. Really precise and incredibly reliable, but not perfect. Hence why Einsteins equations break down inside black holes etc. You can listen to many Univerisity Feynman lectures on the internet, as well of his funny stories when he was working on the Manhattan Project and the like. Lover of the US Constitution Wile E. Coyote School of DIY Disaster | |||
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| Member |
There is a cool youtube video of a professor taking his students to a high elevation with one atomic clock after syncing a second clock at their starting point. When they returned the clock they took with them after driving to the top of a mountain had a different time. That was amazing. Another video is one I think they did in the 70s, syncing two clocks, then flying one of them around the world on a passenger jet, then showing the difference when they returned. Again pretty powerful demonstration of the physics. In both cases, however, no matter how dramtic the difference, you would never be able to notice it yourself, since in both cases this affect is only noticeable from a relatavistic point of view between two different inertial frames of reference (I hope I got that right). Within your own intertial frame of reference (whether going slow or fast etc) everthying is normal to you no matter your speed or gravitational well. It's at the extremes however that I don't understand - the gravity of a black hole, or the speed of light - and that I THINK is where Einsteins equations on this stuff break down. So maybe that's the answer - which is we still don't really know. Lover of the US Constitution Wile E. Coyote School of DIY Disaster | |||
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| Member |
Yes absolutely that's super freaky right there. It's cool they figured it out, that the Universe has been expanding, even though they still don't know why. That other thing they've figured is that there is no such thing as "empty" as far as can be determined, even in the empty of empties between galaxy clusters, there's still something going on, really weired, like something or another popping into, and out of, existence. Incredible. Lover of the US Constitution Wile E. Coyote School of DIY Disaster | |||
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Yes for all practical purposes absolutely. I'm assuming these standard classical physics equations were used to calculate the trajectories when we sent our men to the moon in 1969. BTW I watched that Saturn V liftoff and Moon Walk both live on our B&W TV at home when I was a little kid. Can you imagine how exciting that was for a kid who read all of the How and Whey Science books for kids that were ever printed. Lover of the US Constitution Wile E. Coyote School of DIY Disaster | |||
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SIGforum.com Main Page The Lounge Gravity by nature is not a force itself, though it can be calculated as such.
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