I've been asked to be one of the armed security at our church. I have no problem doing it, but with all the legal issues that this could potentially pose if something were to go south or an accident occur has me questioning some things. Do I need to carry insurance to cover myself? How else can I protect my family/assets from exposure from a civil suite? I haven't had a chance to pose any questions to the head of church security yet because I have been sick for the past few weeks so anything you can recommend I can surely bring it up.

I’m in Ohio BTW.


Thanks!

This message has been edited. Last edited by: jcsabolt2,

Do you have any training?

I personally would never accept any sort of "official" position as armed church security. And as an elder of a church, would never recommend my church having an official armed security team unless they are a contracted professional security team with a business license and insurance.

quote:

Originally posted by YellowJacket:
Do you have any training?

I have my CCW and have taken an advanced handgun combat course about 10 years ago.

Our church actually has a pretty robust security plan that has been reviewed by local law enforcement and have some LEOs on the security team. That's about the extent of what I know right now.

I would make sure it stayed "unofficial". Having a private plan with your fellow church goers is the best idea.

IMO: You're not official unless they are paying for your insurance (at least).

If you take action against someone and they or their estate sues you, on whose shoulders does the liability fall on, the churches or yours? Is the church going to indemnify you if you're named as a defendant in a criminal or civil trial?

If they expect you to do more than a normal CHL holder would do, are they willing to do more for you as the enlisting organization?

they don't want to hire an off duty cop b e c a u s e . . . .
you might find one that would do it for a slice of the collection take

If you have any kind of compensation in any form, even the President’s lawyers paying someone not to talk, you may have a licensing problem, depending on the state, or even be committing a crime without proper credentials.

I'm always armed when at church. That said, I prefer to keep that relationship confidential and private.

What state are you in? Some, like Texas, have laws that allow churches to set up security without the usual licensing issues.

quote:

Originally posted by jcsabolt2:

quote:

Originally posted by YellowJacket:
Do you have any training?

I have my CCW and have taken an advanced handgun combat course about 10 years ago.

Our church actually has a pretty robust security plan that has been reviewed by local law enforcement and have some LEOs on the security team. That's about the extent of what I know right now.

The first thing you should do is get your state's security guard license. I'm not sure in your state, but here in Florida there is a short course and you get licensed. If things go South this is the first thing the state is going to look for.

Personally, I wouldn't touch it for liability reasons. The church would have to carry liability insurance for me, for me to even remotely consider doing that. Your Church is probably better off (for liability reasons) for hiring an off duty police officer to cover masses.

My friend is a full time security guard for a very large church, but he is not armed.

I'm a pastor and we are forming our church security team. Our insurance company will cover our church security team if a shooting occurs and it is reasonably determined the person was acting with the best interest of protecting the congregation. One thing our insurance company asked us to do though is to put in writing the names of the members of our church security team. We could add whoever we wanted, but the names on the list would be the ones covered by our church's liability policy.

Check with your church's insurance company to see if they provide any kind of liability coverage for security team members.

And if I were you, I would get as much certification as I possibly could. Anything you can show will help you if the worst happens.

quote:

. Our insurance company will cover our church security team if a shooting occurs and it is reasonably determined the person was acting with the best interest of protecting the congregation.

geez, does it seem like that is open to all sorts of interpretation, to anyone else?

quote:

Originally posted by Ryanp225:
I would make sure it stayed "unofficial". Having a private plan with your fellow church goers is the best idea.

On the contrary, being part of an 'official' team protects you.

My church has an organized team that trains together, has the full support of the church leadership, and has its own lawyer. This way, if there is a shooting, you are covered under the protective umbrella of "The Church." Any lawsuits *should* (I'm not a lawyer) be directed at the corporate church entity, not the individuals.

Of course, every state has its own laws and interpretations. I would at least check to see if the team has a lawyer to represent it.


And our security team isn't limited to just shootings. I never carried a firearm as part of my team (I never worked up to that level). I did, however, have the legal authority of the church, which is the property owner. Say, some moron is acting hostile and/or disruptive. I could order him to leave. If he refused, our on-site police could then arrest him for trespassing. Can't do that if you are not sanctioned and appointed by the church. This was a very comforting concept to me, and it also covered me from any lawsuits, as long as I wasn't blatantly criminally negligent (choking out a 5-yr old for stealing a dollar from the offering, for example ).

I would not touch that with "someone else's ten foot pole".I have always been armed at church, but you are just asking for trouble if somethi8ng bad goes down. I've got too much net worth to jeopardize it like that.

Not without a really good policy that would cover an intentional shooting and I'm not sure that exists.
I would just go as a good concealed carry parishioner. Maybe the church should just post a sign that concealed carry is allowed in that church and let a potential evil doer guess who and how many.
The actual risk isn't all that great.

https://psmag.com/news/church-...ing-much-more-common

quote:

Originally posted by jimmy123x:
The first thing you should do is get your state's security guard license. I'm not sure in your state, but here in Florida there is a short course and you get licensed.

"Short course and you get licensed?"

Are you aware that there is a big difference, in training, testing, licensing (and license renewal), between a Florida D license (unarmed security guard) and a Florida G license (armed security guard)?

from what you have posted you are not a "trained" security person. All you will be doing is adding a shit load of personal liability against you, the church and your estate.

But lets look at this from a different stand point, would you volunteer as your church's trained emergency medical response team because you have an awesome first aid kit? (assuming you are not a working EMT)

Off-duty LEO's are ridiculously cheap for the hour or 4 hours you would use them.

quote:

Originally posted by V-Tail:

quote:

Originally posted by jimmy123x:
The first thing you should do is get your state's security guard license. I'm not sure in your state, but here in Florida there is a short course and you get licensed.

"Short course and you get licensed?"

Are you aware that there is a big difference, in training, testing, licensing (and license renewal), between a Florida D license (unarmed security guard) and a Florida G license (armed security guard)?

If you really want to know about security guard licenses in Florida, and what is required to obtain a Florida Class G security license, it's all documented on the freshfromflorida.com website. Do a little digging there and find the actual facts.

Do you pick apart every single post I make?

It is 28 hours total of course and training to get a Class G license in Florida. That is 3 1/2 8 hour days of training. To me an 3.5 day course is a short course.


"In most cases, a security guard who will carry firearms will need to complete a 28 hour course to earn his or her Class G license. The course will be taught by a professional who holds a Class K firearm instructor license.
The course will teach a state-mandated curriculum (http://www.freshfromflorida.com/Divisions-Offices/Licensing/Private-Investigation/Private-Investigation-and-Firearms/G-License-Classroom-and-Range-Requirements). Legal aspects of use will comprise 12 hours. Safety and mechanics will comprise another 11 hours; this portion will culminate in a written test. Up to eight hours will be credited for firearms qualification; this portion will include practical exercises and qualifying rounds.
Some individuals will be exempted from taking the mandated 28-hour course based on training they received as law enforcement officers or correctional offers. Those who qualify for firearm instructor licenses can also be exempted.
License holders will need to requalify each year.
The armed security officer will be qualified for a particular type of firearm (http://www.freshfromflorida.com/Divisions-Offices/Licensing/Private-Security-and-Firearms).

An applicant for a Class “G” license must submit proof of having completed an initial course of instruction that includes 28 hours of classroom and range training pertaining to the use of firearms in connection with duties regulated under Chapter 493, Florida Statutes (F.S.).

https://www.freshfromflorida.c...License-Requirements"

quote:

Originally posted by jimmy123x:

quote:

Originally posted by jcsabolt2:

quote:

Originally posted by YellowJacket:
Do you have any training?

I have my CCW and have taken an advanced handgun combat course about 10 years ago.

Our church actually has a pretty robust security plan that has been reviewed by local law enforcement and have some LEOs on the security team. That's about the extent of what I know right now.

The first thing you should do is get your state's security guard license.

Why? A better option would be to first find out what the laws in your State have to say about the matter, and contact the attorney for the church.

quote:

I'm not sure in your state, but here in Florida there is a short course and you get licensed. If things go South this is the first thing the state is going to look for.

On what are you basing the second part of your comment?

quote:

Personally, I wouldn't touch it for liability reasons. The church would have to carry liability insurance for me, for me to even remotely consider doing that. Your Church is probably better off (for liability reasons) for hiring an off duty police officer to cover masses.

My friend is a full time security guard for a very large church, but he is not armed.

Once again, with the “I have a friend/customer/etc”!

Have you personally looked into this? Have you attended even a single meeting about church security?

The best and safest thing to do is hire a couple of off-duty cops for your church services. In any event, make damned sure THE CHURCH carries insurance coverage for any security team.