Originally posted by pessimist: This is just a show for the American people. Everyone already knows the outcome. Nothing about this process has been sincere including this latest puppet show.
My issue is that I don't want people watching this to be left with the impression that the President is getting off on a legal technicality.
Just earlier, President 's council had to spend time "clarifying" Dershowitz's argument.
Yep, this is all simply about trying to damage him heading into the next election. They tried their best to make his entire first term about how he colluded with Russia to get elected in 2016 and now they're trying to make the whole next term about how he colluded with Ukraine to get elected in 2020. If it somehow makes a difference in their favor, they're willing to go all-in to try to win. But I strongly suspect they know they're going to lose this next election, this is all about launching yet another investigation and another impeachment hearing and trial to try and remove him in his second term. "First President to be impeached twice" will be a headline sometime in the coming years. And it will still be bullshit.
______________________________________________ Carthago delenda est
January 30, 2020, 09:09 PM
sdy
Schiff refuses to answer a question similar to Rand Paul's question.
I believe that Senator Ron Johnson rephrased the question Senator Paul submitted to Chief Justice Roberts as set forth in the adjacent post. Chief Justice Robert having declined to read the question, Senator Johnson gave it another go. The question alludes to the RCP columm by Paul Sperry that we also published last week in “Whistleblower overheard.” Not surprisingly, Chief House impeachment manager and House Intelligence Committee Chairman Adam Schiff declines to answer the question.
January 30, 2020, 09:23 PM
TigerDore
quote:
Originally posted by flashguy: The compact among the states that would force that to happen does not yet take hold,
flashguy
Thanks, I didn't realize that they were all doing this as a part of a compact.
.
January 30, 2020, 09:29 PM
bigdeal
quote:
Originally posted by sdy: Schiff refuses to answer a question similar to Rand Paul's question.
I believe that Senator Ron Johnson rephrased the question Senator Paul submitted to Chief Justice Roberts as set forth in the adjacent post. Chief Justice Robert having declined to read the question, Senator Johnson gave it another go. The question alludes to the RCP columm by Paul Sperry that we also published last week in “Whistleblower overheard.” Not surprisingly, Chief House impeachment manager and House Intelligence Committee Chairman Adam Schiff declines to answer the question.
We really need to return to colonial times, and make personal dueling legal under the law. Then someone could challenge Schiff to a duel and remove this POS from the human race permanently. Sometimes the old ways are actually the best ways.
----------------------------- Guns are awesome because they shoot solid lead freedom. Every man should have several guns. And several dogs, because a man with a cat is a woman. Kurt Schlichter
January 30, 2020, 09:36 PM
TigerDore
The supremely talented Tom Shillue may be sad to see the Schiff Show come to an end.
Sen. Lamar Alexander, R-Tenn., a key impeachment swing vote, announced Thursday that he will not join Democrats in voting to call witnesses in President Donald Trump's Senate impeachment trial, suggesting that there may not be enough GOP votes for the trial to advance to that next stage.
"I worked with other senators to make sure that we have the right to ask for more documents and witnesses, but there is no need for more evidence to prove something that has already been proven and that does not meet the U.S. Constitution’s high bar for an impeachable offense," he said.
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Susan Collins has said she would support calling witnesses
Romney ??
Murkowski - Murkowski said late Thursday that she had not made a decision. After Thursday's session adjourned, she told reporters that "I am going to go reflect on what I have heard, re-read my notes and decide whether I need to hear more."
I may not have this right, but if Romney, Collins, and Murkowski vote for witnesses, there would be a 50-50 tie
It is possible that John Roberts might step in and cast the deciding vote
This is a very cloudy situation
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update The prick Romney says he wants more witnesses
There were four key republican quisling senators who were possibilities on voting to continue the Senate impeachment trial and ask for witnesses: Susan Collins, Mitt Romney, Lisa Murkowski and Lamar Alexander.
Susan Collins “Yes”, she wants witnesses
♦ Mitt Romney “Yes”, he wants witnesses.
♦ Lisa Murkowski “Undecided” wants to sleep on it
♦ Lamar Alexander “No”, he does not want witnesses
This tentatively puts the current whip vote for possible witnesses at 49 yea and 5o nea – with one undecided. A 50/50 split should fail in the Senate (but there will be massive narrative manipulation of the rules by MSM). We won’t know until actual votes on a motion to hear from witnesses are cast.
However, that said, Collins decision has almost guaranteed a loss for her Senate seat. In response to this vote the MAGA base will likely not support her. Therefore it’s a gift to her opponent. An unfortunate 2020 Senate seat loss for the GOP.
Republicans scored a point with their last question. They asked if the Steele dossier would count as foreign election interference
DEM Hakeem Jeffries says no because it’s opposition research that was purchased.
Sekulow immediately poucing. “If you purchase it I guess it’s ok."
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TOTAL DISASTER: Hakeem Jeffries answering "Is the Steele dossier foreign interference in an election" literally says the Steele dossier is okay because it was "purchased."
This captures just one aspect of why this impeachment is so hypocritical/dumb. The same camp hyperventilating about "foreign interference in our democracy" paid for a fictional foreign dossier that fueled surveillance of a campaign & 3 years of all-consuming conspiracy theories.
Finally some resolution. Have trump write a check to the Ukraine and we can move on.
January 30, 2020, 11:28 PM
bigdeal
When Collins loses her seat this fall she'll know exactly when, where, and why it happened. I never thought she was very bright, but her move here was spectacularly stupid. If Murkowski votes for witnesses, the GOP Senate Election Committee needs to promote a primary challenge against her and that POS Romney. The message needs to be, stab your party and supporters in the back and you're toast.
----------------------------- Guns are awesome because they shoot solid lead freedom. Every man should have several guns. And several dogs, because a man with a cat is a woman. Kurt Schlichter
January 30, 2020, 11:49 PM
chellim1
quote:
The prick Romney says he wants more witnesses.
The new McCain. Asshole for the sake of his own ego.
"Some things are apparent. Where government moves in, community retreats, civil society disintegrates and our ability to control our own destiny atrophies. The result is: families under siege; war in the streets; unapologetic expropriation of property; the precipitous decline of the rule of law; the rapid rise of corruption; the loss of civility and the triumph of deceit. The result is a debased, debauched culture which finds moral depravity entertaining and virtue contemptible." -- Justice Janice Rogers Brown
"The United States government is the largest criminal enterprise on earth." -rduckwor
January 31, 2020, 05:26 AM
Elk Hunter
As far as I am concerned, roberts (intentionally did not capitalize it!) stepped in the crap and showed his true, swamp colors when he declared Obamacare to be a tax. He was paying somebody off.
If any impeachment is to take place, it should start with him!
And his personal selection of questions to be asked is just more of the same crap.
Elk
There has never been an occasion where a people gave up their weapons in the interest of peace that didn't end in their massacre. (Louis L'Amour)
"To compel a man to furnish contributions of money for the propagation of opinions which he disbelieves and abhors, is sinful and tyrannical. " -Thomas Jefferson
"America is great because she is good. If America ceases to be good, America will cease to be great." Alexis de Tocqueville
FBHO!!!
The Idaho Elk Hunter
January 31, 2020, 06:36 AM
feersum dreadnaught
quote:
Originally posted by chellim1:
quote:
The prick Romney says he wants more witnesses.
The new McCain. Asshole for the sake of his own ego.
NRA Life Member - "Fear God and Dreadnaught"
January 31, 2020, 06:45 AM
triggertreat
IANAL but I think sdy touched on it.If there is a tie it should fail as there isnt a simple majority vote.roberts is an appointed judge not an elected official nor a Senator and has no business casting a vote.
I'm alright it's the rest of the world that's all screwed up!
January 31, 2020, 07:21 AM
bobtheelf
quote:
Originally posted by triggertreat: IANAL but I think sdy touched on it.If there is a tie it should fail as there isnt a simple majority vote.roberts is an appointed judge not an elected official nor a Senator and has no business casting a vote.
Is not the role of the Vice President to break ties in the Senate?
January 31, 2020, 07:23 AM
pbslinger
quote:
Originally posted by bigdeal:
quote:
Originally posted by sdy: Schiff refuses to answer a question similar to Rand Paul's question.
I believe that Senator Ron Johnson rephrased the question Senator Paul submitted to Chief Justice Roberts as set forth in the adjacent post. Chief Justice Robert having declined to read the question, Senator Johnson gave it another go. The question alludes to the RCP columm by Paul Sperry that we also published last week in “Whistleblower overheard.” Not surprisingly, Chief House impeachment manager and House Intelligence Committee Chairman Adam Schiff declines to answer the question.
We really need to return to colonial times, and make personal dueling legal under the law. Then someone could challenge Schiff to a duel and remove this POS from the human race permanently. Sometimes the old ways are actually the best ways.
Too bad Bob Munden has passed.
January 31, 2020, 07:37 AM
joel9507
quote:
Originally posted by bobtheelf:
quote:
Originally posted by triggertreat: IANAL but I think sdy touched on it.If there is a tie it should fail as there isnt a simple majority vote.roberts is an appointed judge not an elected official nor a Senator and has no business casting a vote.
Is not the role of the Vice President to break ties in the Senate?
Yes, and the Constitution tasks the Senate to vote on the trial following impeachment. It does not grant tie-breaking to third parties, regardless of the color of their robes or the matter before the Senate.
January 31, 2020, 07:54 AM
triggertreat
Then there is this-When the President of the United States is tried, the Chief Justice shall preside: And no Person shall be convicted without the Concurrence of two thirds of the Members present.
I'm alright it's the rest of the world that's all screwed up!
January 31, 2020, 07:55 AM
chellim1
quote:
Is not the role of the Vice President to break ties in the Senate?
Exactly! Funny, the Dems seem to think it should be Roberts?
"Some things are apparent. Where government moves in, community retreats, civil society disintegrates and our ability to control our own destiny atrophies. The result is: families under siege; war in the streets; unapologetic expropriation of property; the precipitous decline of the rule of law; the rapid rise of corruption; the loss of civility and the triumph of deceit. The result is a debased, debauched culture which finds moral depravity entertaining and virtue contemptible." -- Justice Janice Rogers Brown
"The United States government is the largest criminal enterprise on earth." -rduckwor
January 31, 2020, 09:35 AM
PASig
quote:
Watch Schiff's Hilarious Attempt to Stop Nadler From Delivering Closing Remarks
Rep. Jerry Nadler raced to the podium Thursday after Chief Justice John Roberts read the last question before adjourning for the evening, blowing past House impeachment manager Rep. Adam Schiff who attempted to stop him.
"Could you please respond to the answer just given by the president's counsel and provide any other comments the Senate would benefit from hearing before we adjourn for the evening?" Roberts read from the card.
Townhall's Julio Rosas captured the viral moment Nadler is seen bolting from his chair, walking straight past Schiff.
"Jerry, Jerry, Jerry," Schiff said as he stepped toward his colleague.
“This is INCREDIBLE. Schiff tried to stop Nadler! You can hear him call him to stop. And then he showed why," National Republican Senate Committee senior advisor Matt Whitlock tweeted. "Dems ask for a closing statement on the night. Nadler, clearly fed up, jumps to his feet and scurries to the mic, ignoring audible protests of lead manager Schiff. Then Nadler gives a terrible lecturing close."
MSNBC host Lawrence O'Donnell even commented on how quickly Nadler raced to the podium.
"Adam Schiff stood. He was ready to go to the podium. He only had to do about three steps to get there. Jerry Nadler had to do about 12. It's the fastest I've seen Jerry Nadler move, in the 25 years that I've known him," O'Donnell remarked.
History dictates Roberts would be tie breaker, if so I see him letting the witnesses come forward so that he's not hung with being the decision maker on Impeachment and hung out for history as the person that decided a POTUS fate.
Judges typically rule in favor of allowing relevant witnesses at trials and, although Roberts has offered no clues about how he would approach the situation, there is precedent for it.
In 1868, Chief Justice Salmon Chase cast two tie-breaking votes in President Andrew Johnson's impeachment trial. Indeed, the current Senate rules for impeachment trials include a history section noting, "The chief justice has voted in the case of a tie." (The same section says that in the Johnson trial, the senators also voted to support the chief justice's conclusion that he could cast tie-breaking votes, noting "the Senate turned down each attempt to prevent the chief justice from voting.")
