^^^ That thing is still around, with the "GSG" brand substituted.

2007 introduction of the P250, had a subcompact in 40, it worked for a bit, then wouldn't feed rounds, you'd get one maybe 2 shots off and it would jam. Tossed it in the safe and a few years later decided to call Sig, they took it back, paid for shipping both ways, fixed it but I couldn't trust it and traded it in on a Glock.

Strangely enough, I bought another one out of the used gun case many years later..

quote:

Originally posted by stiab:
Gen 2 Glock 19s for the PhaseIII problem. NYPD returned hundreds of them, and Glock never figured out the problem, for FTE that could not be cleared without tools.

Glock did figure out the problem. It was a combination of NYPD's mandated 12 pound NY2 trigger spring putting additional upward pressure on the slide along with NYPD's choice of underpowered loads, which resulted in lackluster ejection that caused the possibility of a rare but potentially deadly "Phase 3" malfunction in what was estimated to be 1 in 450,000 rounds fired.

The malfunction was effectively a "horizontal stovepipe" in which the previously fired case would be trapped by the closing slide, with the rear of the casing forced back under the extractor while the mouth of the casing would be forced over the barrel hood, locking the gun up.



Glock responded by adding a bevel to the barrel hoods to prevent such a malfunction from locking the gun up, and Glock even set up a temporary machining operation in NYC in 2002 to convert all ~20k of the NYPD's Glock 19s to the new geometry.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: RogueJSK,

The original Sig P220ST with the internal extractor.
Sig never did admit there was a problem even after Bruce Gray confirmed there was a issue. He found a cure, Sig did not.
The reason I will probably never buy another Sig.

Same here.
They pissed me off big time.

quote:

Originally posted by egregore:
About the same time, this one may or may not have been actually bad, but it was certainly a sales flop. The poor choice of font probably didn't help.

While perhaps not as bad as the R51, the RP9/RP45 were still plagued by similar problems with unreliability and poor quality control. Par for the course with the Remington of the 2010s.

In addition to the poor reviews and reports of reliability issues dragging down sales, the perhaps bigger problems were that Big Green was well over a decade late to the already overcrowded striker fired/polymer framed market and more importanly only offered these guns in an overly large and chunky full size package at a time when small compact/subcompact/microcompact guns were primarily what the commercial handgun market was wanting.

Remington resorted to offering them for low as $169 within the first year of production in 2017 in an attempt to squeeze even a miniscule profit out them in face of their looming financial collapse, but like the R51 the RP9/RP45 were dropped from production after the 2018 bankruptcy.

quote:

Originally posted by RogueJSK:

Glock did figure out the problem. It was a combination of NYPD's mandated 12 pound NY2 trigger spring putting additional upward pressure on the slide along with NYPD's choice of underpowered loads, which resulted in lackluster ejection that caused the possibility of a rare but potentially deadly "Phase 3" malfunction in what was estimated to be 1 in 450,000 rounds fired.

When I said didn't figure out the problem, I meant in time for repairs and NYPD to continue using the guns. As to the 1 in 450,000 rounds, it only took about 10 rounds for it to occur the first time I shot my used but like new G19 Gen2. Took me an hour to clear it, then happened again about 10 rounds later. It was exactly as your pictures showed.

quote:

Originally posted by stiab:
When I said didn't figure out the problem, I meant in time for repairs and NYPD to continue using the guns.

Except as stated in my earlier post, NYPD did continue using the G19, and all ~20k of their Glock 19s were repaired/modified by Glock technicians on site from 2002 to 2003.

In the years before the repair went into effect in 2002, NYPD and Glock had resorted to simply returning those G19s that displayed the malfunction and swapping them out for new G19s.

So some NYPD G19s did get returned/exchanged, but they didn't return all of them or discontinue using them.

quote:

Originally posted by RogueJSK:
So some NYPD G19s did get returned/exchanged, but they didn't return all of them or discontinue using them.

According to the retired NYPD detective on GlockTalk when my specific gun was being discussed about 12-15 years ago, all of the Gen2 G19 were returned and then eventually replaced with Gen3 about 2003. Maybe he was wrong.

I had a Remington 870 "express". The express part of it was you could watch it rust at the speed of an express train. Worst finish on any firearm I have ever owned.

quote:

Originally posted by stiab:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by RogueJSK:
So some NYPD G19s did get returned/exchanged, but they didn't return all of them or discontinue using them.

According to the retired NYPD detective on GlockTalk when my specific gun was being discussed about 12-15 years ago, all of the Gen2 G19 were "returned" and then eventually replaced with Gen3 about 2003. Maybe by "returned" he mean taken off the streets.

quote:

Originally posted by stiab:

quote:

Originally posted by C L Wilkins:
Remington had a recall and replaced it with the 7400.

No, that was the Remington 742 replaced by the 7400. The 742 aka "Jam-O-Matic" deserves it's own post here.

gunsmith friend was making a fortune working on them,

he said they ran great , as long as they were spotless clean and well lubed,

no one cleaned them, or really knew how to lube them so he had a lot of repeat business,

quote:

Originally posted by Aglifter:
The Browning salt wood guns, but I suppose those have all been dealt with by now.

still pop up now and again,

seen a few superposed in the past few years that had damage, and original wood,

and a nice set of 22's, Tbolts, that were new in the box, and crusted up at the wood line

quote:

Originally posted by YooperSigs:
I had a Remington 870 "express". The express part of it was you could watch it rust at the speed of an express train. Worst finish on any firearm I have ever owned.

they came in brand new in the box from the distributors rusty,



remington also had the 870 supermag, that was a pos, sent many back to get repaired

and the RM380 was a design that was neat, till remington bought it and changed it,



while piling on remington then, they also bought Para Ordnance, and abandoned or shut them down, for the R1 (1911) which was a good gun



Taurus autos, the PT99/92's were good, the various varities of the PT111 were not, and they had, IIRC, a class action lawsuit against them,
company I worked for shortly before going out on my own, sold a shitton of them, about 2 out of 10. sometimes more, went back for repairs


about that same time,( 2015-2017 ish) Kimber was almost as bad, we sent a ton back for repairs, and some 1911's would arrive with dirty or stuck mag releases, had to teach a couple other guys how to pull a 1911 mag catch and clean it out,
once that was done, no issues



going back a bit, Colt had issues at each strike, in the 80's era,

every so often you would see an AR-15 that looked like someone with a paint stick got ahold of it, they used a gray lacquer or paint to cover up scratches, marks from roll pins etc,

I have a couple of mid-1990s 870 Express shotguns that have been great. But that was back closer to when they were first introduced, so they still had a decent finish and a metal trigger group, and that was before they started using MIM parts too.

The quality of Remington guns in general and these Express models in particular started to slip in the 2000s and especially the 2010s, most notably post-Freedom Group acquisition in 2007.

quote:

Originally posted by stiab:

quote:

Originally posted by C L Wilkins:
Remington had a recall and replaced it with the 7400.

No, that was the Remington 742 replaced by the 7400. The 742 aka "Jam-O-Matic" deserves it's own post here.

Yes that is correct, it was the 742 not the 700. Not a good rifle at all.

About 10 years ago, my younger son bought a Rem 870 Supermag at a local pawn shop for $150. I was a little envious that he got it instead of me.

Well, it wouldn't feed and fire consistently. He ended up sending it to an authorized repair center to get the shell latches inside the receiver replaced. Apparently the angle on the ends of the installed ones were out of spec and caused the feeding issues (that was probably why it was at the pawn shop). Once the repair was done, he didn't have any further issues.

I have a question about the photos of the NY Glock issue. Both pics appear to show the barrel hood wedged into the case. Where was the bevel cut? Also, did the bevel eliminate the possibility of that specific jam, or only allow for the jam to be cleared by racking the slide?

Sig 522s initial run had a couple of issues that they had to replace some e clip and the barrels were canted I believe.
It’s been nearly 20 years so I don’t exactly recall full what the recall was for.

Not sure if it counts but Black Dog Mags were making the magazines for these as well and they had to change the followers a couple times to get them to run properly.