When will the coronavirus arrive in the US? (Disease: COVID-19; Virus: SARS-CoV-2)

April 08, 2020, 01:13 PM

feersum dreadnaught

No idea if this is correct, but read this:

The past 48 hours or so have seen a huge revelation: COVID-19 causes prolonged and progressive hypoxia (starving your body of oxygen) by binding to the heme groups in hemoglobin in your red blood cells. People are simply desaturating (losing o2 in their blood), and that’s what eventually leads to organ failures that kill them, not any form of ARDS or pneumonia. All the damage to the lungs you see in CT scans are from the release of oxidative iron from the hemes, this overwhelms the natural defenses against pulmonary oxidative stress and causes that nice, always-bilateral ground glass opacity in the lungs. Patients returning for re-hospitalization days or weeks after recovery suffering from apparent delayed post-hypoxic leukoencephalopathy strengthen the notion COVID-19 patients are suffering from hypoxia despite no signs of respiratory ‘tire out’ or fatigue.

It is INCORRECT to assume traditional ARDS and in doing so, you’re treating the WRONG DISEASE. Think of it a lot like carbon monoxide poisoning, in which CO is bound to the hemoglobin, making it unable to carry oxygen. In those cases, ventilators aren’t treating the root cause; the patient’s lungs aren’t ‘tiring out’, they’re pumping just fine. The red blood cells just can’t carry o2, end of story. Only in this case, unlike CO poisoning in which eventually the CO can break off, the affected hemoglobin is permanently stripped of its ability to carry o2 because it has lost its iron ion. The body compensates for this lack of o2 carrying capacity and deliveries by having your kidneys release hormones like erythropoietin, which tell your bone marrow factories to ramp up production on new red blood cells with freshly made and fully functioning hemoglobin. This is the reason you find elevated hemoglobin and decreased blood oxygen saturation as one of the 3 primary indicators of whether the shit is about to hit the fan for a particular patient or not.

http://web.archive.org/web/202...-secret-91182386efcb

April 08, 2020, 01:27 PM

Hammer1967

quote:
Originally posted by holdem:
I appreciate Trump's enthusiasm. And I agree, it must be open sooner rather than later. Come May 1st, the gears 100% have to start turning towards economic motion again.

But it will not boom before his re-election. Not a chance in hell. Too much damage has been done and getting this economy moving again will be a HUGE effort and take lots of time.

It’s going to be a while for sure

April 08, 2020, 01:41 PM

sigfreund

quote:
Originally posted by feersum dreadnaught:
COVID-19 causes prolonged and progressive hypoxia (starving your body of oxygen) by binding to the heme groups in hemoglobin in your red blood cells.

Swell.
Did I already mention my concerns about impaired lung function because of living at high altitude (69% of sea level air pressure and available O2)? So maybe now it’s not the lungs I need to fret* about, but the blood.

* I say “fret” because if I said I was worried, I’d be accused by some people of PANICKING!!! (with accompanying videos), and I certainly wouldn’t want that.

April 08, 2020, 01:49 PM

sigalert

I understand enough of what fearsum posted to know I don’t understand it. I’d appreciate Doc H chiming in.

April 08, 2020, 01:52 PM

sdy

NY City is seeing a high rate of deaths

just NY City:

confirmed cases 81,803
deaths 4,571

4571 / 81903 = 5.6%

NY city has 55% of NY state's confirmed cases, but 73% of the deaths

data from

https://coronavirus.1point3acres.com/en

April 08, 2020, 01:54 PM

kkina

quote:
Originally posted by sigalert:
I understand enough of what fearsum posted to know I don’t understand it. I’d appreciate Doc H chiming in.

I read through the original article. Very interesting for sure, but it's still just one guy's theory. Waiting for a more official, peer-reviewed report.

April 08, 2020, 01:56 PM

maladat

quote:
Originally posted by feersum dreadnaught:
No idea if this is correct, but read this:

The past 48 hours or so have seen a huge revelation: COVID-19 causes prolonged and progressive hypoxia (starving your body of oxygen) by binding to the heme groups in hemoglobin in your red blood cells. People are simply desaturating (losing o2 in their blood), and that’s what eventually leads to organ failures that kill them, not any form of ARDS or pneumonia.

...

My wife (MD) was telling me about this yesterday. She has an MD/PhD friend who is a research scientist who just received a grant for laboratory research related to this.

This could also explain the very elevated mortality rate among diabetics. I may not be repeating this correctly, but my understanding is that even a diabetic who is meticulous about controlling his blood sugar has larger swings in blood sugar levels than a non-diabetic, and elevated blood sugar leads to sugar binding to hemoglobin and reducing its oxygen-carrying capacity (I think this is what the A1c test measures). So basically, a diabetic person's hemoglobin is already likely to be less efficient, and then when you pile COVID-19's effect on top of that, it's bad news.

April 08, 2020, 01:56 PM

Cassandra

[/QUOTE] It’s going to be a while for sure[/QUOTE]

I actually think PDJT will start letting people go back to church on Sunday (with correct spacing or out doors), and start commerce going again on Monday starting with low risk work (construction and other outdoor activities), and gradually opening up other work with sports and schools outdoors. Entertainment venues indoors should be last

April 08, 2020, 01:58 PM

chellim1

quote:
I actually think PDJT will start letting people go back to church on Sunday

That's up to the States.

"Some things are apparent. Where government moves in, community retreats, civil society disintegrates and our ability to control our own destiny atrophies. The result is: families under siege; war in the streets; unapologetic expropriation of property; the precipitous decline of the rule of law; the rapid rise of corruption; the loss of civility and the triumph of deceit. The result is a debased, debauched culture which finds moral depravity entertaining and virtue contemptible."
-- Justice Janice Rogers Brown

"The United States government is the largest criminal enterprise on earth."
-rduckwor

April 08, 2020, 01:59 PM

pulicords

quote:
Originally posted by feersum dreadnaught:
No idea if this is correct, but read this:

The past 48 hours or so have seen a huge revelation: COVID-19 causes prolonged and progressive hypoxia (starving your body of oxygen) by binding to the heme groups in hemoglobin in your red blood cells. People are simply desaturating (losing o2 in their blood), and that’s what eventually leads to organ failures that kill them, not any form of ARDS or pneumonia. All the damage to the lungs you see in CT scans are from the release of oxidative iron from the hemes, this overwhelms the natural defenses against pulmonary oxidative stress and causes that nice, always-bilateral ground glass opacity in the lungs. Patients returning for re-hospitalization days or weeks after recovery suffering from apparent delayed post-hypoxic leukoencephalopathy strengthen the notion COVID-19 patients are suffering from hypoxia despite no signs of respiratory ‘tire out’ or fatigue.

It is INCORRECT to assume traditional ARDS and in doing so, you’re treating the WRONG DISEASE. Think of it a lot like carbon monoxide poisoning, in which CO is bound to the hemoglobin, making it unable to carry oxygen. In those cases, ventilators aren’t treating the root cause; the patient’s lungs aren’t ‘tiring out’, they’re pumping just fine. The red blood cells just can’t carry o2, end of story. Only in this case, unlike CO poisoning in which eventually the CO can break off, the affected hemoglobin is permanently stripped of its ability to carry o2 because it has lost its iron ion. The body compensates for this lack of o2 carrying capacity and deliveries by having your kidneys release hormones like erythropoietin, which tell your bone marrow factories to ramp up production on new red blood cells with freshly made and fully functioning hemoglobin. This is the reason you find elevated hemoglobin and decreased blood oxygen saturation as one of the 3 primary indicators of whether the shit is about to hit the fan for a particular patient or not.

http://web.archive.org/web/202...-secret-91182386efcb

With a [B]NOVEL[/B] virus like this, the unknowns need to become known before a truly effective treatment(s) and/or vaccines can be perfected. I'm encouraged by the universal efforts to address this threat.

April 08, 2020, 02:01 PM

Cassandra

quote:
Originally posted by sdy:
NY City is seeing a high rate of deaths

4571 / 81903 = 5.6%

NY city has 55% of NY state's confirmed cases, but 73% of the deaths

But how many of the 4571 deaths are actually flu, high blood pressure and obesity, etc?

April 08, 2020, 02:05 PM

Cassandra

quote:
Originally posted by chellim1:
quote:
I actually think PDJT will start letting people go back to church on Sunday

That's up to the States.

Indeed it is but his job is to make recommendations for the Governors to make the right decisions, just as he has been saying almost every day in his briefings.

April 08, 2020, 02:11 PM

chellim1

quote:
Originally posted by sdy:
NY City is seeing a high rate of deaths
4571 / 81903 = 5.6%
NY city has 55% of NY state's confirmed cases, but 73% of the deaths

Indeed. The Detroit area is faring poorly also.

April 08, 2020, 02:16 PM

bigdeal

quote:
Originally posted by sdy:
Dr Birx:

"The intent is right now if someone dies with COVID-19, we're counting that as a COVID-19 death," "There are other countries that if you had a pre-existing condition and let's say the virus caused you to go the ICU and then have a heart or kidney problem. Some countries are recording that as a heart issue or a kidney issue and not a COVID-19 death."

Good to know others countries are at least trying to get it right, and disgusted to once again look at the way we're handling this issue. As you are well aware, this one attribute is absolutely key to having any statistics that we can rely on regarding just how deadly this virus actually is. This is a textbook example of the concept of "garbage in, garbage out".

April 08, 2020, 02:21 PM

Fenris

quote:
Originally posted by feersum dreadnaught:
No idea if this is correct, but read this:

The past 48 hours or so have seen a huge revelation: COVID-19 causes prolonged and progressive hypoxia (starving your body of oxygen) by binding to the heme groups in hemoglobin in your red blood cells.

This might explain why diabetes is a risk factor. As a diabetic, I find this rather fascinating. Frightening but also fascinating.

I know blood transfusion/exchange is used to treat severe CO poisoning. I wonder if it could work with Wuhan.

Also as Hydroxychloroquine protects red blood cells from the malaria parasite, maybe it also protects the red blood cells from attack by the Wuhan virus.

Another piece to the puzzle perhaps.