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Nullus Anxietas |
Stream of consciousness kind of a thing... My of my best friends is putting together a 25-yard pistol range against a natural rise. I wanted to contribute a couple gongs. (I already fabricated a target stand.) I was thinking a shepherd's hook and a couple gongs. Then got to thinking a shepherd's hook probably won't stand up to much abuse. That got me to thinking about welding-up some hangers and stands out of angle iron and rebar. Then I saw an episode of one of the TOH shows where a guy fabricated some really sweet Adirondak chairs out of square tube steel and cedar (?). So I was wondering: How difficult is it to learn to use a MIG welder competently and how much does a decent basic (if there is such a thing) MIG welder cost? What are good brands? "America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system,,,, but too early to shoot the bastards." -- Claire Wolfe "If we let things terrify us, life will not be worth living." -- Seneca the Younger, Roman Stoic philosopher | ||
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Honky Lips |
if you're going to be shooting at it, a stick welder would be just fine. and cheaper and easier to learn. | |||
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Member |
Interesting... I have done a little mig welding, but no stick welding. Aside from knowing the correct machine settings, I found mig welding plain steel to be about as complicated as using a hot glue gun, at least in not-safety-critical applications where the weld doesn't have to be cosmetically perfect. | |||
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Optimistic Cynic |
I know almost nothing about welding, but there has to be a reason you see the name Lincoln on the back of nearly every work truck around. | |||
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| Three Generations of Service  |
I sorta agree with FenderBender. You can make great LOOKING welds with a MIG almost instantly, once you get the balance between voltage/current setting and wire speed setting right, or at least close. Great HOLDING welds are another story. The most common mistake with beginners on MIG is using too little heat (voltage) and not getting any penetration. Nice looking weld just sitting on the metal like bird poop. Stick/Arc requires a bit more physical coordination and a steeper learning curve (IMHO). In addition to selecting the right polarity (DC+, DC- or AC) you have to think about rod composition, rod diameter, "stickout" (How far the tip of the rod is from the work) and keeping that gap consistent as the rod burns. However, a good LOOKING stick weld is almost always a good HOLDING weld. My best advice is to find an Adult Ed "Intro to welding" course. They usually introduce you to the major types of welding along with safety and have the machines and materials to allow you to try everything and see what you're most comfortable with. Be careful when following the masses. Sometimes the M is silent. | |||
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Certified All Positions |
| How much do you want to spend, how often are you going to use it, and what power do you have available? Are you making the stands, or the gongs? Gongs of just regular steel don't last. The cheapest route is to go get a Lincoln "Tombstone." You'll get a lot more power for cheaper. A good and poweful mig will set you back, meanwhile a decent stick welder is versatile and affordable. Arc. ______________________________ "Like a bitter weed, I'm a bad seed"- Johnny Cash "I'm a loner, Dottie. A rebel." - Pee Wee Herman Rode hard, put away wet. RIP JHM "You're a junkyard dog." - Lupe Flores. RIP | |||
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| Member |
I found stick welding more difficult than mig or tig. I took classes in all 3, I found mig easier of the 3. I had a Miller 200 and it would do everything I needed to do. For a stick I used a Lincoln Ranger 250. Good luck. | |||
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| Certified All Positions |
Hey, um... First, there are lots of trucks with Miller welders on the back of them.. Hobart, Esab, there are a number of great brands. Secondly, if you don't know much about welding, why comment? Please help a member seeking information, by speaking up on those things you're experienced with. If someone is asking the forum for specific information or expertise, don't speculate, guess, or muddy the water in a subject you aren't familiar with. Let the people who know, help the member get the information they need. Arc. ______________________________ "Like a bitter weed, I'm a bad seed"- Johnny Cash "I'm a loner, Dottie. A rebel." - Pee Wee Herman Rode hard, put away wet. RIP JHM "You're a junkyard dog." - Lupe Flores. RIP | |||
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Alea iacta est |
I did a mediocre job in high school welding. Stick welding is pretty difficult to learn. MiG is easy to learn, and as mentioned earlier, make sure you get the heat high enough to penetrate the steel. TiG isn’t hard if you know how to gas weld, otherwise, it's not that easy. I used a Hobart when I owned a fence company. It did good and was alright, but the duty cycle was too short. I would suggest renting a mig from a local tool rental shop and get flux core wire, so you don’t have to mess with a bottle or shielding. Buy a bunch of tips to match your wire gauge. You’ll need them when learning. Try it out for a week and weld up a bunch if shit. See if you like it, and it’ll give you an idea if the duty cycle meets your necessities. The “lol” thread | |||
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Fourth line skater |
If you really want to learn I'd recommend a class or two at a community college. Nothing like good instruction. At work we have some weekend warriors who like to leave a mess. On Friday I started the practice of turning my machine all the way down, or all the way up. They quite using my machine after a few weeks so my area was just how I left it. And, by the way I've used Miller and Lincoln, and we have an ESAB and Thermal Dynamics plasma cutters. All fine machines. My experience has been yes stick is more difficult. Now if you want to talk hoods Speedglas all the way. They have started the 9002 series up again, and you can get one for about 200 if you shop around the internet. I prefer the 9100 series, buts that's more spendy. _________________________ OH, Bonnie McMurray! | |||
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| Member |
I don't care how good your weld is. a 50 BMG will devastate anything up to 1/2" maybe thicker. .223 will waste anything up to 1/4", even plates or gongs. you can design a great target, hanger, or support, but an errant shot will destroy the parts even if the weld holds. ymmv john | |||
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| Member |
Welding is a profession, a trade; it's not as easy as using a glue stick gun. It looks that way, though. Anyone can buy a handgun, but it doesn't make them a shooter; they should seek competent instruction. Same with a welder; they can be had for relatively little cost, but buying a welding machine gets a person no closer to being a welder. We live in a world today when people want to watch a youtube video and then perform heart surgery. I suggest getting with someone who does mig welding, and getting some instruction. Burn up a few spools, run a lot of beads, get to know the reason for grinding out a channel and a bevel, how to clean them, start them, and fill them, and how to tie the base metal with the weld. Also how to not contaminate the welding bead, how to recognize the correct weld, and about cleaning between passes. Learn what materials can be welded, and what can be used to weld them. Learn about proper settings, feed speed, etc. With welding it's easy to think you're doing a good job; it's another matter to cut, bend, and break welds to find out how well they held up, penetration, etc. Invest in some training. Welding is one of those things where you don't know how much you don't know ; get someone to show you, so you know. It's the difference between a weld that appears sound, and one that is. | |||
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| Banned |
You-Tube has some excellent how to videos on mig welding. | |||
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safe & sound |
We have the regular need for welding in my line of work. I do some of it myself, especially the "decorative" type. When it's structural I won't touch it. I leave that to those who do it for a living. Mostly Miller equipment.  | |||
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| Experienced Slacker |
Drift, but feels like the place to ask: I've never seen anyone welding and using respirators or the like, but the fumes can't be good. Is "proper ventillation" all a hobbiest would need? Or is this just another way to play russian roulette over time? | |||
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| Three Generations of Service |
A well set-up professional welding shop will have a fume removal system. Smaller shops may have one with a flexible hose and a portable hood that can be positioned over the work. A particulate respirator is not a bad idea. They make them specifically to fit under a welding helmet. Most of us hobby sorts depend on natural ventilation or a fan. That can lead to it's own set of problems particularly with gas-shielded MIG or TIG welding. Be careful when following the masses. Sometimes the M is silent. | |||
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"Member" |
I welded something on my car a few weeks ago... first time I'd welded in 30 years. People ask me "Are you a good welder?" I say.. "Considering I basically taught myself when I was in Jr. High, and I have no idea what metals I'm welding, no idea what rods I should be using or AM using, no idea what settings I should be using or am using, I'm a great welder! But not compared to, you know... a welder.  "_____________________________________________________ Sliced bread, the greatest thing since the 1911. | |||
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| Member |
I guess I came off as a little dismissive. I didn't mean to. I used to be a mechanical engineer and did both design and QA/QC work on welded parts. I know there's a lot that goes into good welding. With something like a target stand where strength is not critical and there's no real problem if it falls apart, if you're welding an easy-to-weld steel alloy and someone who knows what they're doing tells you what machine settings to use for the alloy and material thickness you're using, it's easy to get a good enough weld with a MIG welder. If it falls apart, weld it back together, and after a while you'll figure out how to do it well enough that it doesn't fall apart anymore. That doesn't mean you go out and buy a MIG welder and weld up an aluminum boat trailer as your first project. Your trailer and your boat will end up in pieces scattered down the road. | |||
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Spread the Disease |
Besides picking a machine, be sure to get a decent helmet/mask. Auto dimming is a great feature. It makes learning much easier, though it may not be practical for a beginner's budget. Also, don’t weld with short sleeves. UV flash burn sucks. Don’t forget gloves, too. I'm looking to pick up a MIG welder once my new house it finished. I made sure to put a 220V outlet in the garage, mainly for this reason.This message has been edited. Last edited by: flesheatingvirus, ________________________________________ -- Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past me I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain. -- | |||
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| Certified All Positions |
For years, I'd just lie on my side so that the inert gas could drain at break. You can breath in inert gas, but your lungs will slowly fill. A few years before I left that job, they bought those of us welding all day these: https://www.weldersupply.com/P...eedglasAdflo9100FX-A It was a new day, and to be able to be inside the shield gas and not breathe it is really something. If you intend to spend a lot of hours welding, Speedglas is still the king, because they offer the lightest weight equipment. If you don't think weight is important, you haven't welded enough. Arc. ______________________________ "Like a bitter weed, I'm a bad seed"- Johnny Cash "I'm a loner, Dottie. A rebel." - Pee Wee Herman Rode hard, put away wet. RIP JHM "You're a junkyard dog." - Lupe Flores. RIP | |||
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