One thing is for certain, with the tank off, that's an ugly looking mess.

I can’t speak to their motorcycles but if you’re ever in Munich and have a couple of days to spend, the Duetches Museum and the BMW factory tour are a fun way to spend a day.

As for WWII, 85m people against the world cannot be overcome by engineering. No matter how good you are at it.

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Originally posted by HRK:

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This is why zee Germans lost the war. Unnecessary mess like this.

Quite a bit of truth in that, Germany built some bad ass tanks in WW2, Tiger, Panzer, in combat we'd lose 10 tanks to their 1, hellofa design, 80mm cannon, stronger steel, magnificent specimens of engineering design.

Problem was, while they built 10,000 tanks, the US cranked out 250,000 tanks.

You can be the strongest guy in the room, but 1000 people bum rush you and you'll lose.

Not only that but US tanks were actually Field Repairable. Contrast that to the Tiger that became notorious for breaking down and the only Field Repair that could be done on one is to the track.

IMO the last well designed motor vehicle from Germany was my 1970 Beetle. That car was dead simple and quite easy to work on.

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Originally posted by Scooter123:
Not only that but US tanks were actually Field Repairable. Contrast that to the Tiger that became notorious for breaking down and the only Field Repair that could be done on one is to the track.

The Panther had a notoriously weak transmission. They broke on their own. But also, being mounted in front, it was constantly taking hits. Unlike the Shermans which were field replaceable and bolt off/bolt on, theirs had to get dragged off to a full on repair facility. In reality, since they never got any facilities in place, really meant a flat rail car to the factory. Most just stayed in place where they were killed and got stripped of equipment if there was access and time. If not, c'est la vie.

American vs German armor was a side show. It was the T-34 that really gave Germany the what-for.

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Originally posted by cas:
Years ago a did a bunch of work of two Porsches that belonged to friends of mine. I'd still like to sit down with one of their engineers and have him try explain some things to me.

"I can see WHY you did that, but I don't understand why you'd WANT it to do that?" (Like make it so if the oil pump seized up, the engine could keep running. Seems like you went through a lot of extra effort to allow something to happen that you wouldn't want to be allowed to happen!)

Even the much maligned Chevrolet Vega had a switch that shut off the fuel to the engine when it lost oil pressure!

Well I guess I will go against the grain here.

This was my much beloved 2002 BMW GS. Had well over 43k trouble free miles when I traded it in on my current 2012 GS. Most people seem to fall into two groups of ownership with them and it is still their most popular selling model.

Tons of accessory aftermarket support and anything you want in "how to maintain it vids". Valve adjustments, throttle body synchs were a piece of cake once you had done them a few times. As far as the drive shaft goes I never had a problem with mine but always did extra fluid changes along with lubing the splines.

GS stands for Gelände/Straße (off-road/on-road) and yes they are by no means a lightweight motorcycle. And although some folks do some amazing things with them I know my limitations and my off road excursions are kept to dirt roads and easy two track.

The main aggravation on my F850 GS is the dozens of tiny Torx head screws that fasten everything together. The main off road limiter for me is the stock tires, which are useless in the dirt. When they wear out, I will improve them. I bought mine knowing its a pig in the dirt and I spend most of my time on paved roads. But here in the Yoop, our roads resemble goat trails so its almost off road.

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The main aggravation on my F850 GS is the dozens of tiny Torx head screws that fasten everything together.

German vehicles (of all kinds) used to use a lot of hex (Allen) heads. These were and are prone to getting the bit stuck in the screw (the corners bite in) and/or stripping out. Torx don't do either of these things, but in an off-road vehicle, the holes fill up with dirt and mud.

In general, German cars (all of them) are needlessly complicated and difficult to repair, especially if you (meaning I) don't work on them a lot. One guy brought in a 2009 Mercedes S550 for the routine oil change. It was still some $200, but that was better than the $300 it would have cost at the M-B dealer (30 miles away in Kingsport). Barely a week later, an air spring on a front strut blew out. (Other than height leveling in the rear, air has no business in car suspension. A coil spring, even if broken, won't "pancake" the car on the ground.) The same guy - apparently a glutton for punishment - also brought in a 2004 E320. Yeah, it was previously garaged by a little old lady, only has 55,000 miles on it and looks great, but the A/C doesn't work, accompanied by a blinking light on the control panel, due to some electrical bug. I warned the boss prior to taking the first car that this kind of shit will happen that I'm barely or unable to work with.

No it’s not

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Originally posted by TMats:
No it’s not

I’m sure that OP know that and the thread title was just a little levity.

Correct me it I'm wrong but the OP's motorcycle does not look like a WWII BMW to me... much newer. To get a more current WWII German cycle you need one built in Russia.

When I got into riding, I sought out a flat twin GS until I realized it wasn't exactly a small bike. I ended up getting a thumper instead...an F650GS. Slightly more spritely at 425lbs but with a 34" standover

To me there is beauty in simplicity. The less crap you put on something the less chance you have of something breaking. Things tend to break at the most in opportune time on motorcycles in my experience. To German engineers building simple, uncomplicated things is a form of blasphemy.

I’ll still retain one (much older) German motorcycle but my GS won’t be the staying around too much longer.

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Originally posted by YooperSigs:
CanBus!

That, and E46 control arms.
Massive headaches, both.

Simple. Straightforward. You could set off on a coast-to-coast trip, knowing that you could handle most problems with the tool kit that came with the motorcycle.

V-tail, that one is a little older than my R100 but it is beautiful. The one BMW I’ll be keeping forever will hopefully one day look like this. My many other projects, distractions and raising 4 kids has taken priority but one day I’ll modify it or commission a custom build to transform it into a more minimalist machine similar looking to the one below.

Wait until you have to work on a BMW automobile.
Their K Bus is a nightmare. The direct injection is ridiculously complicated.

Replacing ball joints? Hey lets have to practically remove the engine to get to the inner joints!

I used to have a 2004 BMW R1150R and remember having to remove the tank to get to the battery. It also had a recall because the quick release fuel lines would leak and drip gasoline on the engine. The next version of the bike, the R1200R, had the battery under the seat.

It is not just the Germans that make things hard to reach. This is a picture of the oil filter on my Freightliner with a Cummins engine. I had to remove the air filter housing and turbo intake hose to get access to the oil filter. Even then, I could barely get a filter wrench on it.

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Ummm maybe under the effing seat where Honda, Kawasaki, Suzuki and Yamaha somehow all collectively realized was an obvious place to put a battery…

To be consistent, I don't remember their country faring all that well in dubya dubya eye eye either.

I agree that Japanese motorcycles are generally easier to work on, but they all have their quirks.

And while I completely agree that there are some engineering WTF moments in every mechanical endeavor - it's important to remember the engineering departments don't all work together. They tell the chassis engineer that it has to be this width, this length, and achieve this degree of stiffness or whatever, and off they go to complete the mission. They're told to keep their mouth shut. This is a new design and they don't want the competition to get any inside info.

Then they tell the engine people it has to have this horsepower, this torque, and then it must fit in this amount of space. And they need to keep a lid on it. It's a new motor design that they want to keep top secret until the Tokyo motor show or whatever.

So the chassis people built it as perfect as they can. Comes in under the weight spec, and spot on the sizes. The engine guys do their job. Comes in with even more power and torque than anticipated, and it fits the hole. Then the assembly people slap it together and find out the oil filter location is behind the main spar on the frame, and all the wiring has to run under the tank.

Then you have your team guy losing his f-ing mind because none of the shit works right, and none of the design teams were allowed to talk to each other, and none of them were told to build it to be easy to work on. They were told to make it light, fast, and make it fit.