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Problem with the Phalanx is it's good for 3, maybe 4 engagements before its needs to be reloaded. Something to think about when dealing with a swarm of inbound vampires or, a small boat attack.
 
Posts: 15142 | Location: Wine Country | Registered: September 20, 2000Reply With QuoteReport This Post
fugitive from reality
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quote:
Originally posted by stoic-one:
quote:
AFAIK, Phalanx has always been 20mm. And yes, used DU shells.

Oops, you're right. I have several of the original ammo boxes, and they're all labelled 20mm. My mistake.


I sincerely hope the ammo boxes you have didn't contain the DU rounds. They're mildly radio active. Eek


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Posts: 7126 | Location: Newyorkistan | Registered: March 28, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Was Navy Gunners Mate when these were getting installed in the late 70’s. If memory serves these originally would do 6,000 rounds per minute. Then they slowed them down to 3,000 rpms.

So a 1500 round magazine lasted about 15 seconds...
 
Posts: 2164 | Location: south central Pennsylvania | Registered: November 05, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Stangosaurus Rex
Picture of Tommydogg
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I was a Phalanx tech for 20 years in the Navy. I was in the second class that was taught in Great Lakes in 1980. I even made it one of the ships that was in the first batch in Norfolk to Get CIWS. I served on the USS Savannah as the CIWs Work Center Sup then the USS Iowa as the Work center sup for the 2 forward mounts. After that I went back to Great Lakes as a CIWS instructor for 4 years then Off to 2 more ships. The first version of CIWS had a hydraulic drive system for the M61A1 gatlin gun that cycled for a firing rate of 3000 rounds a minute (50 rds per second). Block 1, the second version had a Pneumatic drive that cycled the gun to shoot 4500 Rounds a minute (75 Rds Sec). Block zero had a rotating search radar that had a limited search beam height. Block 0 the second version had a rotating phase array antenna that had closer to 90 degrees elevation coverage. Both versions had the same tracking system. The rounds used for target practice were of a ball type 20 mm round which tended to swiss chees a towed target which tended to take more rounds to destroy targets because they were towed. Battle ammo in the begging was DU, latter we used tungsten. Both tungsten and DU 20 mm was sub caliber and covered by a nylon sabot. When firing at a live target, the radar would detect with the search radar and track with a tracking radar, both located in the white radome. A few mileseconds after opening fire, the tracking radar would multiplex between the target and the space in front and behind the target looking for outbound rounds. The computer would use this to correct the aim of the gun to place ordnance on target. A self propelled target such as a missle would take less ammo to destroy than a towed target due to the ammo used and the action of destroying the airframe vice poking holes in a towed target with ball ammo. Some folks tended to freak out when it took 3 or 4 hundred rounds to destroy a towed target. It was a lot of fun! Being there in the begging of the program was a great honor and learning experience. When I taught it, specialized in the radar, gun, radar servo interface and mount movement subsystems.


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Posts: 7846 | Location: South Florida | Registered: January 09, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Unflappable Enginerd
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posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by SgtGold:
quote:
Originally posted by stoic-one:
quote:
AFAIK, Phalanx has always been 20mm. And yes, used DU shells.

Oops, you're right. I have several of the original ammo boxes, and they're all labelled 20mm. My mistake.


I sincerely hope the ammo boxes you have didn't contain the DU rounds. They're mildly radio active. Eek
Yep, but no rounds, but the boxes are labelled as such. I keep them in my shed and don't use them as stools/benches Wink


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Posts: 6383 | Location: Headland, AL | Registered: April 19, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Stangosaurus Rex
Picture of Tommydogg
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by stoic-one:
quote:
Originally posted by SgtGold:
quote:
Originally posted by stoic-one:
quote:
AFAIK, Phalanx has always been 20mm. And yes, used DU shells.

Oops, you're right. I have several of the original ammo boxes, and they're all labelled 20mm. My mistake.


I sincerely hope the ammo boxes you have didn't contain the DU rounds. They're mildly radio active. Eek
Yep, but no rounds, but the boxes are labelled as such. I keep them in my shed and don't use them as stools/benches Wink
the box should have a stencil. You may have boxes from dumm rounds, or tungsten. The DU rounds were encased in a nylon sabot so DU would not normally touch the box. DU has bot been used since mid 90s.


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Posts: 7846 | Location: South Florida | Registered: January 09, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Corgis Rock
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In the 1980s the Army had a towed Vulcan. They showed it off at the ROTC camp. Imagine a SciFi plasma weapon. There was a stream of fire going downrange. After a couple of bursts they closed up and the fire department took over. They had a nice blaze to put out.



“ The work of destruction is quick, easy and exhilarating; the work of creation is slow, laborious and dull.
 
Posts: 6066 | Location: Outside Seattle | Registered: November 29, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Go ahead punk, make my day
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quote:
Originally posted by corsair:
Problem with the Phalanx is it's good for 3, maybe 4 engagements before its needs to be reloaded. Something to think about when dealing with a swarm of inbound vampires or, a small boat attack.
yeah, IF it doesn't jam up.

RIM116 has replaced many CIWS mounts in the US Navy. Multi-threat engagement is a plus.

But yeah, if you are relying on either, you have screwed the pooch and are pretty fucked already.
 
Posts: 45798 | Registered: July 12, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Unflappable Enginerd
Picture of stoic-one
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Tommydogg:
quote:
Originally posted by stoic-one:
quote:
Originally posted by SgtGold:
quote:
Originally posted by stoic-one:
quote:
AFAIK, Phalanx has always been 20mm. And yes, used DU shells.

Oops, you're right. I have several of the original ammo boxes, and they're all labelled 20mm. My mistake.


I sincerely hope the ammo boxes you have didn't contain the DU rounds. They're mildly radio active. Eek
Yep, but no rounds, but the boxes are labelled as such. I keep them in my shed and don't use them as stools/benches Wink
the box should have a stencil. You may have boxes from dumm rounds, or tungsten. The DU rounds were encased in a nylon sabot so DU would not normally touch the box. DU has bot been used since mid 90s.

Not dummy rounds, printed, no stencil. Trust me, I know what came out of these boxes, I loaded my share of them in the mid-late 80's...


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Posts: 6383 | Location: Headland, AL | Registered: April 19, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by Tommydogg:
I was a Phalanx tech for 20 years in the Navy. I was in the second class that was taught in Great Lakes in 1980. I even made it one of the ships that was in the first batch in Norfolk to Get CIWS. I served on the USS Savannah as the CIWs Work Center Sup then the USS Iowa as the Work center sup for the 2 forward mounts. After that I went back to Great Lakes as a CIWS instructor for 4 years then Off to 2 more ships. The first version of CIWS had a hydraulic drive system for the M61A1 gatlin gun that cycled for a firing rate of 3000 rounds a minute (50 rds per second). Block 1, the second version had a Pneumatic drive that cycled the gun to shoot 4500 Rounds a minute (75 Rds Sec). Block zero had a rotating search radar that had a limited search beam height. Block 0 the second version had a rotating phase array antenna that had closer to 90 degrees elevation coverage. Both versions had the same tracking system. The rounds used for target practice were of a ball type 20 mm round which tended to swiss chees a towed target which tended to take more rounds to destroy targets because they were towed. Battle ammo in the begging was DU, latter we used tungsten. Both tungsten and DU 20 mm was sub caliber and covered by a nylon sabot. When firing at a live target, the radar would detect with the search radar and track with a tracking radar, both located in the white radome. A few mileseconds after opening fire, the tracking radar would multiplex between the target and the space in front and behind the target looking for outbound rounds. The computer would use this to correct the aim of the gun to place ordnance on target. A self propelled target such as a missle would take less ammo to destroy than a towed target due to the ammo used and the action of destroying the airframe vice poking holes in a towed target with ball ammo. Some folks tended to freak out when it took 3 or 4 hundred rounds to destroy a towed target. It was a lot of fun! Being there in the begging of the program was a great honor and learning experience. When I taught it, specialized in the radar, gun, radar servo interface and mount movement subsystems.


I haven't heard one shoot live since 96 or 97, but I can still remember how it sounded; it's a sound you can't/don't forget. We were told the rounds were DU.
 
Posts: 132 | Location: PA | Registered: December 13, 2018Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Stop Talking, Start Doing
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75 rounds per second?!?! Eek


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Posts: 5088 | Location: The (R)ight side of Washington State | Registered: August 31, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Baroque Bloke
Picture of Pipe Smoker
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quote:
Originally posted by Tommydogg:
I was a Phalanx tech for 20 years in the Navy. I was in the second class that was taught in Great Lakes in 1980. I even made it one of the ships that was in the first batch in Norfolk to Get CIWS. <snip>

There’s LOTS of expertise here on SigForum. An amazing resource.



Serious about crackers
 
Posts: 9601 | Location: San Diego | Registered: July 26, 2014Reply With QuoteReport This Post
The success of a solution usually depends upon your point of view
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Tommydogg:
I was a Phalanx tech for 20 years in the Navy. I was in the second class that was taught in Great Lakes in 1980. I even made it one of the ships that was in the first batch in Norfolk to Get CIWS. I served on the USS Savannah as the CIWs Work Center Sup then the USS Iowa as the Work center sup for the 2 forward mounts. After that I went back to Great Lakes as a CIWS instructor for 4 years then Off to 2 more ships. The first version of CIWS had a hydraulic drive system for the M61A1 gatlin gun that cycled for a firing rate of 3000 rounds a minute (50 rds per second). Block 1, the second version had a Pneumatic drive that cycled the gun to shoot 4500 Rounds a minute (75 Rds Sec). Block zero had a rotating search radar that had a limited search beam height. Block 0 the second version had a rotating phase array antenna that had closer to 90 degrees elevation coverage. Both versions had the same tracking system. The rounds used for target practice were of a ball type 20 mm round which tended to swiss chees a towed target which tended to take more rounds to destroy targets because they were towed. Battle ammo in the begging was DU, latter we used tungsten. Both tungsten and DU 20 mm was sub caliber and covered by a nylon sabot. When firing at a live target, the radar would detect with the search radar and track with a tracking radar, both located in the white radome. A few mileseconds after opening fire, the tracking radar would multiplex between the target and the space in front and behind the target looking for outbound rounds. The computer would use this to correct the aim of the gun to place ordnance on target. A self propelled target such as a missle would take less ammo to destroy than a towed target due to the ammo used and the action of destroying the airframe vice poking holes in a towed target with ball ammo. Some folks tended to freak out when it took 3 or 4 hundred rounds to destroy a towed target. It was a lot of fun! Being there in the begging of the program was a great honor and learning experience. When I taught it, specialized in the radar, gun, radar servo interface and mount movement subsystems.



This man knows what he speaks of.

I still have a small dent in my skull from where a few pounds of dummy rounds fell on me when a link broke while we were downloading DU rounds and replacing them with dummy rounds for the weight.

Medical told me that if the link that broke had been 6 inches higher I would not be here today to talk about it.



“We truly live in a wondrous age of stupid.” - 83v45magna

"I think it's important that people understand free speech doesn't mean free from consequences societally or politically or culturally."
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Posts: 3923 | Location: Jacksonville, FL | Registered: September 10, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Stangosaurus Rex
Picture of Tommydogg
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quote:
Originally posted by OMCHamlin:
quote:
Originally posted by Tommydogg:
I was a Phalanx tech for 20 years in the Navy. I was in the second class that was taught in Great Lakes in 1980. ... After that I went back to Great Lakes as a CIWS instructor for 4 years ...


Oh yeah, we went to Opticalman "A" and "C" school on the floors above your glass CIWS room at GLAKES, in the building right above the beach.
small world! I have a vague memory of a truck full of old binoculars pulling up outside the window of the instructor prep room. I dont know what happened to them, bu they were for you guys up stairs!


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"I Get It Now"

Beth Greene
 
Posts: 7846 | Location: South Florida | Registered: January 09, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Stangosaurus Rex
Picture of Tommydogg
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by SpinZone:
I still have a small dent in my skull from where a few pounds of dummy rounds fell on me when a link broke while we were downloading DU rounds and replacing them with dummy rounds for the weight.

Medical told me that if the link that broke had been 6 inches higher I would not be here today to talk about it.



Now that's lucky! I have a few scars from my blood sacrifices to the CIWS Gods!


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Beth Greene
 
Posts: 7846 | Location: South Florida | Registered: January 09, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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My first live fire experience with the M61 was 1964. We installed a new gun in a F-104 and required alignment
with the fire control radar. We had to jack and level the aircraft as well as secure it to the ground with chains
so it wouldn't jump off the jacks. The F-104 did not recapture the spent casings, it just ejected them to the ground.
We made adjustments in 50 round burst. Being that close to 20mm @ 100 RPS was something you don't forget. My ears
are still ringing!
 
Posts: 152 | Location: west Florida | Registered: July 08, 2018Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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