Baltimore's colossal Key Bridge collapses in moments after container ship crashes into it flinging 'multiple' cars into the river
quote:
I agree they probably could pull off getting malware onto the ship. Probably that malware could disable the ship. But that'd be a pretty damn impressive feat to use malware to disable a ships energy systems and have it perfectly drift into a bridge pier.
10 years ago hackers had the ability to remotely take control of some of your car's systems. While I agree this was likely an accident, it would not surprise me if there were terrorists out there looking at these types of possibilities. Why hijack a plane and fly it into a building if you could do it from the comfort of your living room couch?
All of this technology is great when being used for good, but it seems to open up a number of vulnerabilities for those with ill intent.
Not sure if it has been mentioned in this thread or not, but another factor that will most likely significantly impact the logistics of the dismantling and bridge rebuild efforts is the 240 kV power line that is seen in many of the photos just astern of the ship.
These lines carry power generated from the power plants located in Baltimore and provide power to the city of Baltimore, nearby communities and into the PJM market.
Any (tall) demolition / construction cranes cannot be operated near those lines as the risk of an arc would be too high and catastrophic.
A LOT of planning for matters across the board need to be well thought out and thoroughly vetted before those lines can be de-energized (if they are going to need to be).
__________ "I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal labotomy."
March 28, 2024, 11:45 AM
corsair
quote:
Reid also said the ship was “piloted by a very heroic crew from India” and that it was also racist to criticize them despite them failing to prevent the ship from crashing into and destroying the bridge.
As we document in the video below, the group that managed the Dali cargo ship and the Maryland Port Commission both appear to have prioritized ‘diversity’ over safety before the ‘accident’ that led to the collapse of the bridge.
Good grief.....anybody that's spent any time within the merchant services knows if there's any racial group that's under-represented on board merchant ships, is there's not many white or, black guys. The vast majority of crew on these ships are Filipino (I would bet comprise 50% of crews worldwide), Indonesian, Bangladeshi, Sri Laken, Malay, Pakistani and a variety from around the Caribbean. Ship masters and engineers not unusual to have them be of Norwegian, Swedish, Dutch, Danish or German backgrounds...you know seafaring nations with a long tradition ocean going.
March 28, 2024, 12:38 PM
trapper189
quote:
Originally posted by Cookster: Not sure if it has been mentioned in this thread or not, but another factor that will most likely significantly impact the logistics of the dismantling and bridge rebuild efforts is the 240 kV power line that is seen in many of the photos just astern of the ship.
These lines carry power generated from the power plants located in Baltimore and provide power to the city of Baltimore, nearby communities and into the PJM market.
Any (tall) demolition / construction cranes cannot be operated near those lines as the risk of an arc would be too high and catastrophic.
A LOT of planning for matters across the board need to be well thought out and thoroughly vetted before those lines can be de-energized (if they are going to need to be).
I’m sure the cranes will be under 700’ tall.
March 28, 2024, 01:26 PM
Cookster
Is 700’ the actual height those towers or the above water height of the line sag?
__________ "I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal labotomy."
March 28, 2024, 01:56 PM
trapper189
Those towers are a little over 700’ away from the closest point of the bridge.
March 28, 2024, 05:11 PM
vthoky
I've read the thread but may have missed this... what's the condition of the ship itself? Not leaking or sinking? If that's the case, can it be floated (tugged) to a proper place for unloading? (Yes, I know that relies on getting the bridge off it and getting a path in the water cleared.)
If it's damaged, is it damaged too badly to be tugged back to the port for unloading the cargo onto other ships? And how would a crew go about unloading it if it can't yet be moved? I'm thinking serious helicopters, but I imagine that would have to be seriously expensive.
God bless America.
March 28, 2024, 05:25 PM
229DAK
quote:
Originally posted by vthoky: And how would a crew go about unloading it if it can't yet be moved?
I would suspect smaller container ships (less draft) with alongside cranes.
_________________________________________________________________________ “A man’s treatment of a dog is no indication of the man’s nature, but his treatment of a cat is. It is the crucial test. None but the humane treat a cat well.” -- Mark Twain, 1902
March 28, 2024, 06:18 PM
r0gue
quote:
Originally posted by a1abdj:
quote:
I agree they probably could pull off getting malware onto the ship. Probably that malware could disable the ship. But that'd be a pretty damn impressive feat to use malware to disable a ships energy systems and have it perfectly drift into a bridge pier.
10 years ago hackers had the ability to remotely take control of some of your car's systems. While I agree this was likely an accident, it would not surprise me if there were terrorists out there looking at these types of possibilities. Why hijack a plane and fly it into a building if you could do it from the comfort of your living room couch?
All of this technology is great when being used for good, but it seems to open up a number of vulnerabilities for those with ill intent.
[FLASH_VIDEO]<iframe frameborder="0" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/MK0SrxBC1xs?si=kE1Uo6zHmZ2gF9ng" title="YouTube video player" width="560"></iframe>[/FLASH_VIDEO]
Yeah, I think we've established that shit can get hacked. That's not the point. The point is, the .gov guy that said that didn't think it was a terrorist, and nor does anyone else except those that want to think thusly. Recall this line of discussion started on "how could they rule out...", and I think it's as simple as someone saying it didn't appear to be so in a press conference because, it didn't appear to be so.
March 28, 2024, 07:28 PM
6guns
As for offloading the ship, I suspect they could tow her right back to the container dock once free of the bridge debris.
SIGforum: For all your needs! Imagine our influence if every gun owner in America was an NRA member! Click the box>>>
March 28, 2024, 07:31 PM
Balzé Halzé
quote:
Originally posted by 6guns: As for offloading the ship, I suspect they could tow her right back to the container dock once free of the bridge debris.
I suspect she'll be able to sail under her own power, with tugs alongside of course.
~Alan Acta Non Verba NRA Life Member (Patron) God, Family, Guns, Country
Men will fight and die to protect women... because women protect everything else. ~Andrew Klavan
"Once there was only dark. If you ask me, light is winning." ~Rust Cohle
March 28, 2024, 07:40 PM
hrcjon
I am confused in all this about the design situation. Its not like ships hitting bridge supports and causing a collapse is a new risk. Has happened a bunch of times. So exactly why is there not enough buffer riprap or whatever around these supports that a ship hitting them (not a completely unknown risk since this is a PORT!) can't actually get to the support structure????
“So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong, and strike at what is weak.”
March 28, 2024, 08:03 PM
trapper189
My understanding is the bridge was built in 1977 and ships this large were not imagined at that time.
Looking at the satellite images on Apple Maps, the bridge has dolphins in front of its supports on both the inbound and outbound approaches. This ship managed to miss the dolphin in front of the support it hit.
March 28, 2024, 09:25 PM
V-Tail
quote:
Originally posted by trapper189:
This ship managed to miss the dolphin in front of the support it hit.
Did they do it on porpoise?
הרחפת שלי מלאה בצלופחים
March 28, 2024, 09:31 PM
hrcjon
quote:
My understanding is the bridge was built in 1977 and ships this large were not imagined at that time.
That's clearly not true at least in terms of built ships, it might be true in terms of 'average' or 'mean'. But in any case even if the design point was a smaller ship it surely must have envisioned that the ship might actually be under power. This one was not. So this ship might have more mass but it didn't have more energy.
“So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong, and strike at what is weak.”
March 28, 2024, 09:31 PM
hrcjon
quote:
Did they do it on porpoise?
That is a 10.
“So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong, and strike at what is weak.”
March 28, 2024, 09:44 PM
6guns
quote:
Originally posted by hrcjon:
quote:
Did they do it on porpoise?
That is a 10.
Yes, very clever!
SIGforum: For all your needs! Imagine our influence if every gun owner in America was an NRA member! Click the box>>>
March 28, 2024, 10:35 PM
hrcjon
I looked at the overhead photos. There is NOT A CHANCE that the slight structure around the bridge supports was designed to stop a wayward ship. And that really to me is negligent even in the 1970's. That Florida bridge had already hit the deck I think by then. And the Ohio river bridge a decade earlier.
“So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong, and strike at what is weak.”
